Kevin Lee: "Askren is easiest fight in division, but I could never outdo Masvidal's MGM buffet"

Right now - Kevin Lee should be last person to pile on as his stock has dropped off the market. I dont support Askren( or wrestlers in general) but it was a fight - whether an embarrassing 5 second loss or a 15 minute split decision loss, it only counts as 1 loss. Hes 1-1 and let's see how Askren deals with this adversity. How many UFC champions started their UFC career 2-2 ? I'm sure a handful( not saying he'll reach pinnacle but I'm not saying no ,either).

I'll give Ben this much credit- most fighters in his shoes, wed be hearing from him right about now or even one more week. Hes been owning up to all his interview bookings since fights end.
#respect

We'll see how things go from here.
Considering a very close and winnable fight where he matched him skill for skill, against a top 4 ww, former world champion and veteran who just came off fights with the 3 best wrestlers in the division.

All while not having a head coach and at 26 years old

I don't think his stock dropped at all. In fact I think his championship potential is more clear than ever
 
Askren is leagues better than Lee as a grappler. Not even close tbh.

Lee would beat him on the feet but that's not saying much, Lee isn't very good there either.
In wrestling yes

Jiu jitsu no

Lee's jits is really good.
Pretty sure Kevin Lee is the easiest fight in the division now that CM Punk got cut. Askren at least has a win in the division, which is 1 more than Kevin has after getting his ass kicked out of the last division he tried to fight at.
lol this is easily one of the lowest fight iq threads I've seen here in a while
 
Fighter Kevin Lee would lose that fight.
 
Man, I actually like Lee but this dude just does not learn his fucking lesson.

An undefeated Askren was caught by a brilliantly executed flying knee and he's taking the loss like a champion, giving Masvidal all the credit in the world for something he'd be extremely unlikely to ever pull off again. Lee on the other hand taps out or gets his ass beat half the time we see him in the cage, then makes excuses or complains about clear cut decisions and still talks like he's the best in the world. Askren would absolutely demoralize him and make him tap just like many other top WWs would at this point in his career.
 
This actually would be a matchup that makes sense, I hope they make it. I would actually favour Ben but who knows how he's gonna rebound after suffering that brutal loss.
 
Will Fighter Kevin Lee retire after Askren shoots the same takedown and then grinds him out for three rounds?
 
Kevin Lee is exactly what Askren needs.
 
Lol, Askren is a horrible match up for Lee. Lee gasses hard against a grinder with endless cardio like Askren.

People now are thinking that landing the Masvidal knee is easy.

I don't think very highly of Kevin Lee as a fighter but he would probably beat Askren

Lee's wrestling is good enough to keep the fight on the feet, where he's significantly better than Ben

Honestly either of these are possibilities. We won't know unless they fight. What we do know is that Askren has been beaten to a near coma in both of his first two UFC fights. I wouldn't write off Kevin Lee so fast. Jay Hieron almost beat Askren, and Lee is better than Hieron at everything except maybe cardio.
 
Fighter Kevin Lee talking a lot of shit for someone who lost his last 2 fights
 
Considering a very close and winnable fight where he matched him skill for skill, against a top 4 ww, former world champion and veteran who just came off fights with the 3 best wrestlers in the division.

All while not having a head coach and at 26 years old

I don't think his stock dropped at all. In fact I think his championship potential is more clear than ever
I have to look at this for what I'm seeing with my own eye balls. Since the Chiesa win where everyone was anointing Lee the next big thing, well - hes been the furthest thing from ..... coach or no coach or whomever is getting him ready. His only win in past 4 fights was an almost 25 minute fight where doctors halted fight agsinst someone who is now 1-4 in his last 5......and the one was hooker. I think barboza will continue to regress in re match with Felder ( that's just one mans opinion). Theres nothing really good to take from his 3 losses. He was stopped twice and lost as a healthy favorite to a fighter he had already lost to. ?????

I dont want to rain down on you but this " championship potential is clearer than ever" is more than a bit confusing. Hes now fighting upper tier to , at least, very good fighters and the results have not been good regardless of weight class.

If you see something I'm not then I can only respect your opinion.Im not calling the guy a can or even average but at this point, I now consider Lee nothing more than a good/solid fighter .
 
You only go by last 4 fights because his overall record is outstanding.

Good, not outstanding.
GSP, Jones, Silva have outstanding records.
Kevin Lee's best wins are Barboza, who almost KOd him, Chiesa and some good fighters like Prazeres & Trinaldo.
He lost to the top guys he fought: Ferg, RDA, Al.
 
I have to look at this for what I'm seeing with my own eye balls. Since the Chiesa win where everyone was anointing Lee the next big thing, well - hes been the furthest thing from ..... coach or no coach or whomever is getting him ready. His only win in past 4 fights was an almost 25 minute fight where doctors halted fight agsinst someone who is now 1-4 in his last 5......and the one was hooker. I think barboza will continue to regress in re match with Felder ( that's just one mans opinion). Theres nothing really good to take from his 3 losses. He was stopped twice and lost as a healthy favorite to a fighter he had already lost to. ?????

I dont want to rain down on you but this " championship potential is clearer than ever" is more than a bit confusing. Hes now fighting upper tier to , at least, very good fighters and the results have not been good regardless of weight class.

If you see something I'm not then I can only respect your opinion.Im not calling the guy a can or even average but at this point, I now consider Lee nothing more than a good/solid fighter .
Don't think you're looking closely enough at his losses


His last fight was again, against a top 4 ww, former champion, a fight in which he was actually getting the better of the striking, even matching RDA in the kicking department, holding his own everywhere the fight went and didn't look to be out of his element skill wise at all. What he didn't do was manage his energy efficiently and fight intelligently, which not having a head coach anymore likely played a big factor in.

Gotta keep in mind as well that it was his first fight at 170, RDA himself said that Lee will take some time to get adjusted to the weight and that initially his own cardio and performance suffered.

RDA also coming off 3 fights in a row against the best wrestlers in the division was more prepared than he's ever been in his career. His wrestling looked great and he fought a very smart fight. Truly was the experienced veteran, conserving his energy and waiting for the right moment to strike.

for me and I believe many others, there were s lot of positive take always for Lee and unlike you, I don't see that fight as hurting his stock at all. Quite the opposite really, it showed the same potential that fans, fighters and onlookers alike have been discussing since the beginning.

He's a 26 year old who showed that he's not at all out of place in the top of the division. This is without a head coach. The skills are there, his boxing is better than it gets credit for, he outstruck Barboza for 5 rounds, was outstriking Tony. He was even getting the better of RDA. His kicks are actually very good as well. Defense and ability to avoid damage is better than it gets credit for. His wrestling is strong, hes definitely a strong brown belt level in Jiu jitsu. Not unlike GSP, he's very good everywhere.

There's a reason why GSP himself said Kevin Lee is gonna be the best, someone he's trained with himself mind you. Lee's actual skill set and potential is undeniable to people who are objectively paying attention. I'm not suggesting Lee is going to be the best, but it's clearGSP sees the same potential I do. Question is, why are the fans so far behind?

Some people just see losses and all context goes out the window, they see an L and are unable to take anything positive away from it. That's sherdog for you, zero objectivity. People forget his guy is 26. If he were 30-34 maybe I could see the lack of respect but he's nowhere near his peak.

But yeah, with a few adjustments, particularly to his conservation and utilization of energy, a bit more patience, calm and more effecient mechanism for mixing up his techniques, along with continuing to polish up his techniques, his potential is undeniable.

Only people suggesting other than I said here, no offense, do not understand how to analyze fights
 
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Good, not outstanding.
GSP, Jones, Silva have outstanding records.
Kevin Lee's best wins are Barboza, who almost KOd him, Chiesa and some good fighters like Prazeres & Trinaldo.
He lost to the top guys he fought: Ferg, RDA, Al.

On the flip side, Askren's only win in the last 5 years of any significance was a near return-from-death comeback vs. an old Lawler...and some refs may have stopped that fight before he recovered. His win over Lima was 7 years ago and Lima is better now. And please no one say that his win over Aoki (a FW/LW who's seen much better days) was a significant win for a WW.
 
People in this site are unbelievably stupid when it comes to Lee

I shit you not, literally 90% of the people commenting in this thread are wrong.. To the point where it's embarrassing

The lack of fight iq is painful
 
He was stiffer than a mannequin, that's what 1 dimension looks like
Aldo getting Ko'ed by Conner was just as humiliating....Askren is no bum. He will wind up have a winning record in the division ...he can still outwreslte just about everyone
 
On the flip side, Askren's only win in the last 5 years of any significance was a near return-from-death comeback vs. an old Lawler...and some refs may have stopped that fight before he recovered. His win over Lima was 7 years ago and Lima is better now. And please no one say that his win over Aoki (a FW/LW who's seen much better days) was significant.

I didn't say it.
I like Askren (his personality, because his fighting style is boring AF), but his record is not very good.
His best wins (randomly) are:
Lima
Koreshkov
Hieron
Lawler
Plus 3-4 legit fighters.
 
I didn't say it.
I like Askren (his personality, because his fighting style is boring AF), but his record is not very good.
His best wins (randomly) are:
Lima
Koreshkov
Hieron
Lawler
Plus 3-4 legit fighters.

I didn't mean you personally. Just saying that if we criticize Lee's best wins, we can do the same for Askren. And as I said, all those wins except Robbie were many years ago. I'm not convinced he'd beat Lima or Koreshkov (or Robbie in a rematch) now.
 
Don't think you're looking closely enough at his losses


His last fight was again, against a top 4 ww, former champion, a fight in which he was actually getting the better of the striking, even matching RDA in the kicking department, holding his own everywhere the fight went and didn't look to be out of his element skill wise at all. What he didn't do was manage his energy efficiently and fight intelligently, which not having a head coach anymore likely played a big factor in.

Gotta keep in mind as well that it was his first fight at 170, RDA himself said that Lee will take some time to get adjusted to the weight and that initially his own cardio and performance suffered.

RDA also coming off 3 fights in a row against the best wrestlers in the division was more prepared than he's ever been in his career. His wrestling looked great and he fought a very smart fight. Truly was the experienced veteran, conserving his energy and waiting for the right moment to strike.

for me and I believe many others, there were s lot of positive take always for Lee and unlike you, I don't see that fight as hurting his stock at all. Quite the opposite really, it showed the same potential that fans, fighters and onlookers alike have been discussing since the beginning.

He's a 26 year old who showed that he's not at all out of place in the top of the division. This is without a head coach. The skills are there, his boxing is better than it gets credit for, he outstruck Barboza for 5 rounds, was outstriking Tony. He was even getting the better of RDA. His kicks are actually very good as well. Defense and ability to avoid damage is better than it gets credit for. His wrestling is strong, hes definitely a strong brown belt level in Jiu jitsu. Not unlike GSP, he's very good everywhere.

There's a reason why GSP himself said Kevin Lee is gonna be the best, someone he's trained with himself mind you. Lee's actual skill set and potential is undeniable to people who are objectively paying attention. I'm not suggesting Lee is going to be the best, but it's clearGSP sees the same potential I do. Question is, why are the fans so far behind?

Some people just see losses and all context goes out the window, they see an L and are unable to take anything positive away from it. That's sherdog for you, zero objectivity. People forget his guy is 26. If he were 30-34 maybe I could see the lack of respect but he's nowhere near his peak.

But yeah, with a few adjustments, particularly to his conservation and utilization of energy, a bit more patience, calm and more effecient mechanism for mixing up his techniques, along with continuing to polish up his techniques, his potential is undeniable.

Only people suggesting other than I said here, no offense, do not understand how to analyze fights
I more than know how to analyze fights(lol) and I'm not saying that there isnt room for him to evolve. In fact , anyone who pays attention to my posts- I give the benefit of doubts to fighters who suffer setbacks in UFC and go back to drawing board and just get better. I just dont know if Lee will turn out to be one of those and because of it - again- I consider him a good to solid fighter.
During these past handful of fights, Lee was considered this upper tier fighter. I demote that label FOR NOW .Just my " more than reasonable " opinion.

We'll see how his career plays out in the short term and if you're a Kevin lee supporter/fan - hey, I hope he starts to put some impressive wins together.
 
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