Is Yuki Nakai the toughest MMA fighter in history?

Super Shotgun said:
Most want to get a big social media following leading to a big payday then sit on their ass collecting sponsorship money and fight at best once a year. I remember when Chuck had a title shot in the bag and still elected to fight Vernon White, not because he needed the money or anything, he just loved to fight.
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It's understandable why.
Would you prefer to be nearly broke and half blind/have brain damage?
Or would you prefer to be mostly healthy and rich?
 
gono btw said:
I believe @Lord Toranaga might have misunderstood: Hoyler probably said "Kill him!", but that does not necessarily means "Target that eye"
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You think the Gracies got to where they are today by being decent, merciful folk when trying to win the real life version of Bloodsport? I think @gono btw might underestimate the violent nature of the Gracie family. Don't let Gracie University T-shirts and skateboards fool you, bro. That family is a bunch of killers, Rickson was special. I don't care what @gono btw thinks Royler said or meant, I saw the doc. and Rickson was too busy cleansing his spirit in the pure freezing water of a snowy Japanese river to care what Royler thought either.
 
Lord Toranaga said:
You think the Gracies got to where they are today by being decent, merciful folk when trying to win the real life version of Bloodsport? I think @gono btw might give too much credit to the violent nature of the Gracie family. Don't let Gracie University T-shirts and skateboards fool you, bro. That family is a bunch of killers, Rickson was special. I don't know what Royler said or meant, Rickson was too busy cleansing his spirit in the pure freezing water of a snowy Japanese river to care what Royler thought either.
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Im actually the one who dropped this thread>

http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...-part-9-bjj-during-the-vale-tudo-era.3826197/
 
Lord Toranaga said:
You think the Gracies got to where they are today by being decent, merciful folk when trying to win the real life version of Bloodsport? I think @gono btw might give too much credit to the violent nature of the Gracie family. Don't let Gracie University T-shirts and skateboards fool you, bro. That family is a bunch of killers, Rickson was special. I don't care what @gono btw thinks Royler said or meant, I saw the doc. and Rickson was too busy cleansing his spirit in the pure freezing water of a snowy Japanese river to care what Royler thought either.
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dog y said:
From that convo alone I'd guess the attitude was more like "fuck not targetting the eye, kill him however!".
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OK, I checked.

Hickson had several opportunities to punch Nakai in the head while he was on top. He decided to throw exactly 3 punches, but he chose the left eye (the healthy one)...

At one point during the fight, it is possible to hear Hoyler´s voice sayin´ "Soco na cara", which means "Punch to the head"

@5mn 06:

 
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gono btw said:
OK, I checked.

Hickson had several opportunities to punch Nakai in the head while he was on top. He decided to throw exactly 3 punches, sadly he chose [or failed to recognize] the right eye...

At one point during the fight, it is possible to hear Hoyler´s voice sayin´ "Soco na cara", which means "Punch to the head"

@5mn 06:

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Royler not concerned about health of Nakai, confirmed. Rickson didn't care what Royler thought and did just enough to advance and finish, confirmed.
 
Lord Toranaga said:
Royler not concerned about health of Nakai, confirmed.
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I edited my post, the 3 punches targetted Nakai´s left eye, the good one.

Now, Hoyler´s call: "Punch to the head" is kindah tricky... left or right side?
 
gono btw said:
I edited my post, the 3 punches targetted Nakai´s left eye, the good one.

Now, Hoyler´s call: "Punch to the head" is kindah tricky... left or right side?
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Not the fight, backstage. They were all saying "just kill him, he would do it to you, kill him." Rickson like.... "Nah, sons."
 
Lord Toranaga said:
Not the fight, backstage. They were all saying "just kill him, he would do it to you, kill him." Rickson like.... "Nah son."
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I´ll check the tone and potential meaning of this "kill" and let ya know.
 
gono btw said:
OK, I checked.

Hickson had several opportunities to punch Nakai in the head while he was on top. He decided to throw exactly 3 punches, but he chose the left eye (the healthy one)...

At one point during the fight, it is possible to hear Hoyler´s voice sayin´ "Soco na cara", which means "Punch to the head"

@5mn 06:

Click to expand...

I remember in the pre fight filming, maybe during the locker room warm up, rickson saying he would not throw one strike.
I may be wrong after so long, but I wouldnt mention it if I thought so.
 
Sweet boys, those Gracies... even when fighting in an NHB competition representing the best their family has to offer and risking their life's work, their BJJ pot of gold, in the foreign country they stole the martial art from in the first place.

Ne Waza: myspace-tom-now-t.jpg

BJJ: zuckerberg-facebook-hearing-e1523653772551.jpg

Deconstructing MMA myths part 17.

Myth: Royce was chosen because he was weaker than Royler and Rickson and showed the skinny guy can use leverage to finish larger opponents.

Very convenient half-truth.

Reality: Royce was used as a built-in excuse, and if he would have lost, Rickson would have destroyed everyone at UFC 2 with family reputation intact. Using Royce was a smart, safe gamble that paid off. If you want to discredit BJJ, you will have beat two Gracie brothers.

The Master never competes when challenged unless we're talking Musashi.
He sends out one of his students to represent him. If that fails, he can step up.

The Gracie's UFC rests on a foundation of a giant built-in excuse, they never had to use.

True or False? @gono btw. Sincere question to an expert.
 
Lord Toranaga said:
Not the fight, backstage. They were all saying "just kill him, he would do it to you, kill him." Rickson like.... "Nah, sons."
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OK I checked.

@1h27mn50:



3 actors here:

1/ Hickson, feelin´sorry for Nakai, and [potentially] emotionally weakened b4 the fight.
He´s sayin´ that he cant hit him.

2/ Hoyler, who was his coach (and thus the only voice that should matter here, since Helio was not in the room), senses that Hickson´s gettin´emotionally weakened, tells Hickson that he´s gonna have to hit him.
When Hickson replies that he cant, Hoyler then tells him to slap him instead.

> Hoyler is somehow doin´his job.

3/ @1h28mn04:
The guy one the ground (cant recall his name, but he´s got no 'authority' when it comes to the strategy of the fight)... is a true POS.
Mockin´Nakai and tellin´Hickson to hit him,that´s true

lock.gif
 
Lord Toranaga said:
Sweet boys, those Gracies... even when fighting in an NHB competition representing the best their family has to offer and risking their life's work, their BJJ pot of gold, in the foreign country they stole the martial art from in the first place.

Ne Waza: View attachment 506363

BJJ: View attachment 506365

Deconstructing MMA myths part 17.

Myth: Royce was chosen because he was weaker than Royler and Rickson and showed the skinny guy can use leverage to finish larger opponents.

Very convenient half-truth.

Reality: Royce was used as a built-in excuse, and if he would have lost, Rickson would have destroyed everyone at UFC 2 with family reputation intact. Using Royce was a smart, safe gamble that paid off. If you want to discredit BJJ, you will have beat two Gracie brothers.

The Master never competes when challenged unless we're talking Musashi.
He sends out one of his students to represent him. If that fails, he can step up.

The Gracie's UFC rests on a foundation of a giant built-in excuse, they never had to use.

True or False? @gono btw. Sincere question to an expert.
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Ah.. might be a Decons one day...

In short, Horion chose Hoyce coz he couldnt control Hickson, the size was a BS excuse.

Im talkin´about it here:

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...ce-his-gi-ufc-1.3734725/page-2#post-147972291
 
dog y said:
I remember in the pre fight filming, maybe during the locker room warm up, rickson saying he would not throw one strike.
I may be wrong after so long, but I wouldnt mention it if I thought so.
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check 2 posts above,mate
 
gono btw said:
Ah.. might be a Decons one day...

In short, Horion chose Hoyce coz he couldnt control Hickson, the size was a BS excuse.

Im talkin´about it here:

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...ce-his-gi-ufc-1.3734725/page-2#post-147972291
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This is why I ask sincerely, for years now. How good was Nakai to be half Rickson's size who's only path to victory is a submission with his eyes swollen shut. What were the Gracies even stressing about?

Nakai is a legend, confirmed.
 
Lord Toranaga said:
This is why I ask sincerely, for years now. How good was Nakai to be half Rickson's size who's only path to victory is a submission with his eyes swollen shut. What were the Gracies even stressing about?

Nakai is a legend, confirmed.
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They frequently went full ´tard, more often than not...

If ya pay attention to voices during fights, some instructions are laughable, shoutin´easy, logical transitions on the ground, as if the fighter were a rookie...
 
Nakai completely stole the show in Choke. It reminded me of Anderson Silva's Like Water documentary where they captured his biggest rivalry and his career defining last minute comeback by chance, only Nakai did something much more incredible and he was just a minor character that forced his way in to the movie by way of his massive balls and heart. He will never get the credit he deserves, a genuine MMA legend.
 
Super Shotgun said:
After retiring from MMA, Nakai became interested on Brazilian jiu-jitsu not due to his own defeat to Rickson, but Noboru Asahi's loss to Royler Gracie in 1996. He learned it from Enson Inoue, and a year later he participated in his first BJJ tournament, the Gracie Honolulu Open hosted by Relson Gracie. Nakai soon won the Pan American Championship on the brown belt category, and afterwards he was granted the black belt by Carlos Gracie Jr, becoming the first person from Japan to hold a black belt in Brazilian jiu-jitsu. In 1997, Nakai opened the Paraestra Shooto Gym, and over time was appointed president of the Japanese Confederation of Jiu-Jitsu.
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Wasn't Naoyuki Taira the first BJJ black belt from Japan? I thought he was already a black belt before Nakai even began training BJJ. Nakai was second (I could be wrong?), and he was the one who popularized the sport in Japan.

I don't even know what Taira is up to these days.
 
honestly though, those guys back then really believed in their art

Nakai's injury was certainly more severe, but look at a guy like Fred Ettish, those early UFC guys. If they were allowed to, some of them would probably continue despite a bad injury

(not saying there are no guys like that now, i believe there are but i hope nobody brings back No Holds Barred)
 
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