Is this routine good for strength?

[DLesko]

I cant do squats because i had a severe neck compressiong while doing jitz that destroyed one of the disks in my neck. Thay had to slice me open and take the disk out. They replaced it with a titanium plate and some screws. Needless to say, squats hurt my damn neck . Thanks for the ideas and advise guys.

 

[Jun Fan Lee]

Sorry dude, but do you know what an oxymoron is? Muscle size is not the same as muscle strength, which is not the same as strength.

Bodybuilding is about building muscle size. Powerlifting is about strength. Other sports are about neither.


He was talking about bodybuilding programmes, which are full of isolation exercises and rep ranges which favour sarcoplasmic growth.


Really? Scientifically? Show me these scientific studies then.

You know what the oxymoron refference was a bad choice of words , but I stand by my original statement , that best and most effective way to inscrease muscle size & strenght is through a bodybuilding program consisting of basic heavy compound movements , this isn't debatable its a fact , and when I mean basic heavy compound movements , I'm talking about bench presses , both incline and flat , deadlifts , squats , curls , military presses , rows , skull crushers , tricep pushdowns , flys , etc etc , I'm not talking about leg-extensions or peck-dec .

bodybuilding is NOT only about muscle size , its also about , shape , symmetry , balance , proprotion , aesthetics , and muscuartity and bodybuilder uses strenght as a means to that end , powerlifters are only concerned with strenght & technique and both use heavy basic exercises as a mean to thier ends , powerlfiters do many of the exact same basic heavy compound exercises as bodybuilders , the only difference being reps and the ammout of rest between sets .

and as far as other sports being about neither , every single sport that I can think of over the years have included a bodybuilding program into thier regular training because its effective , and they all use the exact same exercises as bodybuilders & powerlifters as a means to their end , simply because , once again its the most effective & efficent way to ad muscle size & strenght , this has been proven for over 100 years.

 

[Urban]

Jun Fan Lee, I would much appreciate it if you would quit pushing your bodybuilder shit around here. BBers are not strength athletes, sarcoplasmic hypertrophy (the type of muscle size BBers put on) is not the most beneficial to strength, and their training is not conductive to strength and power developement nor proper conditioning of the central nervous system. PERIOD.

 

[Jun Fan Lee]

Jun Fan Lee, I would much appreciate it if you would quit pushing your bodybuilder shit around here. BBers are not strength athletes, sarcoplasmic hypertrophy (the type of muscle size BBers put on) is not the most beneficial to strength, and their training is not conductive to strength and power developement nor proper conditioning of the central nervous system. PERIOD.

I'm mearly responding to a question asked about if his routine was good for strenght , I'm not pushing any " bodybuilding shit " and for you to say bodybuilders aren't strenght atheletes shows you have absolutely no clue as to what you're talking about .

 

[vjekoboban]

You know what the oxymoron refference was a bad choice of words , but I stand by my original statement , that best and most effective way to inscrease muscle size & strenght is through a bodybuilding program consisting of basic heavy compound movements , this isn't debatable its a fact , and when I mean basic heavy compound movements , I'm talking about bench presses , both incline and flat , deadlifts , squats , curls , military presses , rows , skull crushers , tricep pushdowns , flys , etc etc , I'm not talking about leg-extensions or peck-dec .

bodybuilding is NOT only about muscle size , its also about , shape , symmetry , balance , proprotion , aesthetics , and muscuartity and bodybuilder uses strenght as a means to that end , powerlifters are only concerned with strenght & technique and both use heavy basic exercises as a mean to thier ends , powerlfiters do many of the exact same basic heavy compound exercises as bodybuilders , the only difference being reps and the ammout of rest between sets .

and as far as other sports being about neither , every single sport that I can think of over the years have included a bodybuilding program into thier regular training because its effective , and they all use the exact same exercises as bodybuilders & powerlifters as a means to their end , simply because , once again its the most effective & efficent way to ad muscle size & strenght , this has been proven for over 100 years.

how exactly are curls heavy compound movements.

you seem to thing that if it isnt on a machine or cable that it is compound.........


seriously i did isolation exercises on biceps before i found this forum and read urban

 

[Sean S]

I'm mearly responding to a question asked about if his routine was good for strenght , I'm not pushing any " bodybuilding shit " and for you to say bodybuilders aren't strenght atheletes shows you have absolutely no clue as to what you're talking about .

Yes because we all know that the strength pole goes something like Bodybuilders > Strongman > Powerlifters > HIT.

Sorry guy, when you give up gains in strength for symetry, you give up on the idea of being the strongest possible. Beyond that, isolation is not the way to develop true strength.

 

[rEmY]

are bodybuilders called upon to use strength in any athletic endeavor when in competition? no. therefore they are not "strength athletes". yes, many of them are strong, but lifting weights is a means to an end for them, and the end is based solely on appearances.

the westside for skinny bastards is a good mix of strength training mixed with some more hypertrophy specific ideas.

http://www.defrancostraining.com/articles/archive/articles_westside.htm

 

[semiotik]

Squat causes him pain due to a surgically repair neck...you would already know that if you took the time to read all the posts in the thread before posting.

Duly noted.

 

[Chad Hamilton]

Isolation movements = 0 strength
Compound movements = strength
Olympic movements = winner

 

[Jun Fan Lee]

how exactly are curls heavy compound movements.

you seem to thing that if it isnt on a machine or cable that it is compound.........


seriously i did isolation exercises on biceps before i found this forum and read urban

 

[Urban]

Compound = mulitple joint movement. Bicep curl = only movement at the elbow.

 

[ShadowNINku]

I don't even follow a plan anymore....lol I just do 1 exercise per large muscle groups
bench, squat, pull ups, heavy abs,power cleans......oh and my only body part I body build but could be functional to stop a choke....traps!!!

 

[Urban]

I got this definition from http://www.exrx.net/WeightTraining/Glossary.html and then I googled compound movements and most people would argue multiple muscle groups. Now is where you try to defend curls as a compound exercise, but I would argue (and I would be right) that just because you're holding onto the weight doesn't really mean you're working your forearm Flexors. any flexing of the forearms is strictly coincidental in a bicep curl as it is not the goal of the movment (the goal is flexing your bicep). therefore by either definition there is only one muscle group being used, and movement at only one joint. ergo curls are not a compound movement.

Want to work your forearms while you curl? use a 2" or greater thickbar. want to really work them while developing strength in your biceps and upper back? go climb a rope that's 1.5" or more. Curls are not for strength. Bodybuilders are not strength athletes, go educate yourself.

 

[Jun Fan Lee]

are bodybuilders called upon to use strength in any athletic endeavor when in competition? no. therefore they are not "strength athletes". yes, many of them are strong, but lifting weights is a means to an end for them, and the end is based solely on appearances.

the westside for skinny bastards is a good mix of strength training mixed with some more hypertrophy specific ideas.

http://www.defrancostraining.com/articles/archive/articles_westside.htm

I already said bodybuilders use strenght as a means to an end but thats not the point , the point is they're strong , you ever see a weak bodybuilder? now thats an oxymoron.

and to answer your question are bodybuilders called upon to use strenght in any athletic endeavor when in competition ? yes they do , its called posing , and they have to pose durring the prejudging in a competiton for 2 hours straight , even when they're not being compared to others , they have to stand in whats called a relaxed pose for up to 2 hours , and this relaxed pose demands you stand with hands by your side fully tensed until called out for a comparision , and once you are compared to others you're asked to do one of 7 mantatory poses , which are isometric exercises in essence , imagine trying to full tense and contract every single muscle in unisen and holding it for periods of time , all the while in a water and carb-depleted state with as low as 3% bodyfat under hot lights , so yes they use some form of muscle strenght and muscle endurance at a competition .

 

[Jun Fan Lee]

Compound = mulitple joint movement. Bicep curl = only movement at the elbow.

Compound = more than one muscle , Bench press = only movment at the elbow.

Bicep curl with dumbells = 2 movements wrist and elbow.

 

[MonkeyonRoids]

Oh god almighty.

Your bodybuilding strength that you use to lift isolation exercises in the gym is absolutely useless when applied to MMA.

 

[MonkeyonRoids]

BTW, who the FUCK gives a shit about posing in here?!!?!?

MMA forum? Who needs to fucking pose.

 

[Sean S]

Compound = more than one muscle , Bench press = only movment at the elbow.

Bicep curl with dumbells = 2 movements wrist and elbow.

Funny cause I could swear that your shoulders move a little bit.

Serious question: Why are you even moving your wrists on a barbell curl? Are you trying to create a compound movement?

Beyond that, I really don't say your point here. You are saying that bicep curls are compound because they have more then one movement. Right before that you are disproving that the bench is a compound movement (incorrectly I might add) because it only moves one joint? I could be reading this wrong though. That would suggest that the bench is not a compund movement, yet you imply it is earlier when you say that body builders use compound movements like the bench ect.

And as for body builders being strong, thats way relative. I can deadlift 430 and I consider myself weak. I have yet to meet a body builder that can match that. Now I'm not talking about top of the line body builders like say Coleman, I mean most body builders. Of course there are super strong body builders. However there is a point where bodybuilding routines are going to taper off (strength wise) compared to a power lifting or olympic routine. Body building will give you good isolated strength. Read isolated. however, it will never match the overall strength from Olympic routines, Power routines, or Strongman routines.

 

[Urban]

Compound = more than one muscle , Bench press = only movment at the elbow.

Bicep curl with dumbells = 2 movements wrist and elbow.

your shoulders don't rotate during bench? sounds like your form needs a LOT of work.

Here I found something for you: http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/Biceps/DBCurl.html . allow me to point out the right side of the page:

Classification
Utility: Basic
Mechanics: Isolated
Force: Pull


Muscles

Target

* Biceps Brachii

Synergists

* Brachialis
* Brachioradialis

Stabilizers

* Deltoid, Anterior
* Trapezius, Upper
* Trapezius, Middle
* Levator Scapulae
* Wrist Flexors

By comparison here's bench press: http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/PectoralSternal/BBBenchPress.html Notice that there are three vastly different synergists on bench press? and only two which are in the same muscle group on bicep curls? You're wrong, face it.

 

[Urban]

here's another: chinups. Looking up chinups on that site you can see a HUGE list of synergists http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/LatissimusDorsi/WtChinup.html making it a very compound exercise.