Is there really any way for a Non-UFC promotion to get success?

[TorontoTO]

The UFC turned into the 24 hr news cycle model, every week is a new event and new bouts are announced so casual MMA fans are continuously bombarded with UFC news, most promotions just don't have the roster quality to do that, be it KB, MMA, or Muay Thai. The one event you put on a month is overshadowed by the continuous new UFC drama, bouts, etc. ONE spends millions on advertising, but I would love to see if it really translates into substantial views. Just don't see how anyone can stand out in a climate with a behemoth like UFC. I would say most fans don't even know what bouts the UFC card that week have, much less the next one, but they know the routine.

 

[GueseGuy]

There are ways to have success. Finding your own niche or market can be one of those. There are ways to have success as an mma promotion but that doesn’t necessarily mean you will compete with ufc. I think Bellator is probably the 2nd most successful mma promotion of all time. Are they competing with ufc? No. Will they ever? Probably not. But they have a fanbase and have successfully expanded internationally and are most likely seeing a profit. In a monopolized market that has seen 100s of failures id say that’s pretty good. Not a threat to ufc but they are successful from a business standpoint.

 

[David R]

'monopolized market' no way!

Success is not measured by ufc standards.
New sport MMA has small bugrowing fan base. UFC has their fan base.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

It depends how you define success. If you mean become a genuine challenger to the UFC then I think that's nigh on impossible but if you mean running a profitable promotion then I'd argue that Bellator and KSW are pretty successful.

 

[ReemAteMyPony]

Get bought by Netflix.

 

[wwkirk]

Capitalize on openings. Exploit niches.
Bellator vs RIZIN on a holiday night ceded by the UFC is a start.

 

[skylolow]

Nope, the UFC won the MMA war.

When it comes to sports the fans have proving over and over they really only truly support the major version or the biggest org/league of that sport. Especially when talking about fringe fans. Any other form of that sport battles for the scraps nationally and worldwide.

Not to say the Bellator's of the world can't find a niche and carve out a small piece of the pie. They just aren't competing with the UFC on any level what so ever. Fans are the ones with unrealistic views or expectations of some of these orgs.

 

[WolverReem]

One is doing a great job in social media. UFC isn't even that big anymore I would say it peaked around mid to late 2000s and again during Conor/Ronda era in mid 2010s.

 

[TorontoTO]

One is doing a great job in social media. UFC isn't even that big anymore I would say it peaked around mid to late 2000s and again during Conor/Ronda era in mid 2010s.

I mean thirst posting Stamp and Danielle Kelly is top notch content, especially when they repost the same content every month

Can you still thirst post Angela Lee or is it disrespectful to do that to a mother?

 

[Hellowhosthat]

One is doing a great job in social media. UFC isn't even that big anymore I would say it peaked around mid to late 2000s and again during Conor/Ronda era in mid 2010s.

How's it going Chatri?

 

[GueseGuy]

One is doing a great job in social media. UFC isn't even that big anymore I would say it peaked around mid to late 2000s and again during Conor/Ronda era in mid 2010s.

UFC doesn’t have the PPV stars they had when conor and Ronda were on top but they are just as successful as ever with their foray into the UAE and their weekly broadcast deal with espn. They’re making a shit ton of money.

 

[WolverReem]

I mean thirst posting Stamp and Danielle Kelly is top notch content, especially when they repost the same content every month

Can you still thirst post Angela Lee or is it disrespectful to do that to a mother?

Even UFC and other orgs started the TikTok clip style promotion. If it works it works

 

[SokoudjouFanboy]

I think at least two of PFL, Bellator & ONE need to merge with one another. Take PFL's format, ONE's contrast and footprint in Asia with Bellator's actual MMA talent and you might. By themselves though they all have too many holes that can be poked at. Couple that with all the reasons you listed OP of which I agree with and year over year I think it's less likely with any current brand.

I do think that there's potential for a 1B if well funded, timed (ie 1, if not more then 1 of the 3 I've listed in the last paragraph are dead) and strategically executed down the line. The idea that the UFC is worthy of 90% of fan's exclusive attention is a mirage. IDK exactly what the roadmap is but the idea that the MMA landscape will be like this forever seems somewhat implausible when you think long enough about it (like I have lmao).

 

[Hellowhosthat]

I think at least two of PFL, Bellator & ONE need to merge with one another. Take PFL's format, ONE's contrast and footprint in Asia with Bellator's actual MMA talent and you might. By themselves though they all have too many holes that can be poked at. Couple that with all the reasons you listed OP of which I agree with and year over year I think it's less likely with any current brand.

I do think that there's potential for a 1B if well funded, timed (ie 1, if not more then 1 of the 3 I've listed in the last paragraph are dead) and strategically executed down the line. The idea that the UFC is worthy of 90% of fan's exclusive attention is a mirage. IDK exactly what the roadmap is but the idea that the MMA landscape will be like this forever seems somewhat implausible when you think long enough about it (like I have lmao).

Most people just don't want to watch more than one card a week and the UFC provides them with that. Those of us who are willing to watch more already do. I bet like 98% of Bellator's fanbase also watch UFC.

 

[SokoudjouFanboy]

Most people just don't want to watch more than one card a week and the UFC provides them with that. Those of us who are willing to watch more already do. I bet like 98% of Bellator's fanbase also watch UFC.

I don't think it's that simple though. I just think right now there are several TNAs floating around and no AEW. I do think UFC is the institution that will never go anywhere and basically be a money printing machine forever unless scandal ruins it, but that doesn't mean nothing else can become more popular then what the B shows are now. There just needs to be the right recipe and a series of events nobody can predict right now.

 

[careto]

I always thought Bellator could have a bigger piece of the pie and a way better brand recognition if they committed more resources. They have the parent company and the roster to do so but they never seemed to want to commit more resources (marketing, promotion, move to CBS, bigger signings) than the absolute necessary to keep them afloat. They wouldnt necessarily be the pepsi to the UFC's coke but they could definitely be a legitimate alternative to the UFC rather than be considered the B leagues.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

Yes. Absolutely.

MMA is nowhere NEAR fully saturated. Tthere will never be another major MMA promotion is a tad short sighted.

It's of course possible. Are any of the major promotions today going to be that secondary promotion? No, probably not, none are designed in a way to do that.

As the poster above me said, there are a lot of TNA's right now. The UFC has a lot of blind spots and all it takes is a couple of crossover stars from social media to get people to at least try out other products.

Think of it like this, the WWE was the biggest promotion for decades and THEN in the 80s became way more popular than the UFC ever was (Hulk Hogan in the 80s dwarfs McGregor and Rousey) - yet years in WCW, which was as popular as Bellator became a viable commercial alternative and was even more popular than the WWE for a couple of years.

So yes, if someone rich enough wanted to make a promotion to challenge the UFC they absolutely could do it. Or it's entirely possible that an org in another region that has good capital grows their brand globally adjacent to the UFC. Even a place like France just opened up with in the last year or two. A LOT can change between now and 2032.


It's actually more likely than not there is going to be a second major MMA promotion. If MMA does become more popular world wide the UFC doesn't have the infrastructure or reach to consolidate all of that.

If MMA's popularity becomes insanely large in a timezone that is not friendly to American audiences think about how easy it would be to capture that market with the right finance and marketing. The only way this doesn't happen is simply if MMA's fan base never grows from this point forward.

 

[manboy<3]

There is only 1 Japan

And its not even cool anymore (Showa era is over)

JMMA was the product of Showa era thinking, aethetics etc,

UFC was a product of the 90s

This human cockfighting shit is depressing in 2022

There are too many fights, too many fighters, too many promotions and none of them have anything interesting in them

Ganryujima 1 was great so was early RIZIN but Ganryujima is dead and RIZIN isn't worth watching anymore unless Floyd is fighting

RIZIN died for me when they stopped doing grandmas vs Gabi Garcia and joined the 21st century and started to promote Youtube trash

You can get success by not following the crowd

 

[Hellowhosthat]

I don't think it's that simple though. I just think right now there are several TNAs floating around and no AEW. I do think UFC is the institution that will never go anywhere and basically be a money printing machine forever unless scandal ruins it, but that doesn't mean nothing else can become more popular then what the B shows are now. There just needs to be the right recipe and a series of events nobody can predict right now.

I think pro wrestling is a bit different though. I don't really know about AEW but I remember the WCW days and the difference for me is in wrestling you can get your Hulk Hogan, Kevin Nash and Scott Hall and have them on TV performing twice a week. With MMA even if you get Conor Mcgregor, Jorge Masvidal and Nate Diaz you still only get them in the cage maybe twice a year each.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

Yes. Absolutely.

MMA is nowhere NEAR fully saturated. Tthere will never be another major MMA promotion is a tad short sighted.

It's of course possible. Are any of the major promotions today going to be that secondary promotion? No, probably not, none are designed in a way to do that.

As the poster above me said, there are a lot of TNA's right now. The UFC has a lot of blind spots and all it takes is a couple of crossover stars from social media to get people to at least try out other products.

Think of it like this, the WWE was the biggest promotion for decades and THEN in the 80s became way more popular than the UFC ever was (Hulk Hogan in the 80s dwarfs McGregor and Rousey) - yet years in WCW, which was as popular as Bellator became a viable commercial alternative and was even more popular than the WWE for a couple of years.

So yes, if someone rich enough wanted to make a promotion to challenge the UFC they absolutely could do it. Or it's entirely possible that an org in another region that has good capital grows their brand globally adjacent to the UFC. Even a place like France just opened up with in the last year or two. A LOT can change between now and 2032.


It's actually more likely than not there is going to be a second major MMA promotion. If MMA does become more popular world wide the UFC doesn't have the infrastructure or reach to consolidate all of that.

If MMA's popularity becomes insanely large in a timezone that is not friendly to American audiences think about how easy it would be to capture that market with the right finance and marketing. The only way this doesn't happen is simply if MMA's fan base never grows from this point forward.

I think again it depends how you measure success. I think you can absolutely have more successful regional shows like KSW who do very well in their market but I doubt anyone challenges UFC on a global scale.

I think it'll be like basketball which is a pretty popular sport with a lot of leagues but most people only really care about the NBA.