Is there a MW who you think could drop and do better at WW?

[RemoWilliams1a**]

With the recent thread about whether Lombard can make into the WW top 10 it made me think...is there any MW you can think of who you think can make the drop to WW and do better at MW and achieve more then they did at MW?

I guess one could argue Kampmann but it would be a hollow argument. Kampmann only ever lost one fight at MW, to Marquardt, before dropping to WW so we simply cannot rank him at MW to say.

Maia, Marquardt and a few others have tried and failed. We will see where Lawler can take his run but I don't have a ton of faith.

So Kampmann aside what say you?

 

[KyouLose]

Marquardt failed? Why? Because he got knocked out by Ellenberger? He still won the Strikeforce title and has beaten some guys...

EDIT:

and to answer your question: I can't think of anyone haha

DOUBLE EDIT:

I guess Marquardt has only beaten Woodley at WW... So my post is shitty.

 

[istay]

How did Maia fail? He lost one fight and he's still a top 10 fighter. I'd say he's doing better in WW right now then he was doing in MW. Also Jake Shields dropped to WW and is doing fine.

 

[edisraw]

Costa seems kinda small for a striking based 185'er, IMO.

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

Marquardt failed? Why? Because he got knocked out by Ellenberger? He still won the Strikeforce title and has beaten some great guys...

EDIT:

and to answer your question: I can't think of anyone haha

Marquardt failed to do as well at WW as he did at MW. Is there any doubt about that? I mean does anyone not think Marquardt when at MW could not have held a MW SF title if instead of fighting in the UFC he was there?

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

How did Maia fail? He lost one fight and he's still a top 10 fighter. I'd say he's doing better in WW right now then he was doing in MW. Also Jake Shields dropped to WW and is doing fine.

Maia was a perennial top 10 and top 5 at MW who fought for the title.

If he has done more then that at WW list it just like above.

Maia could work his way back in but I think he has been exposed by exactly what I said would expose him at WW.

 

[melvinj0]

Marquardt failed to do as well at WW as he did at MW. Is there any doubt about that? I mean does anyone not think Marquardt when at MW could not have held a MW SF title if instead of fighting in the UFC he was there?

I doubt he would have beat Jacare or Rockhold.

 

[dieknowsore]

Maia was a perennial top 10 and top 5 at MW who fought for the title.

If he has done more then that at WW list it just like above.

wasn't fitch #2 at some point and he got completely dominated?

rankings don't mean much. maia is WAY better at WW than MW.

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

I doubt he would have beat Jacare or Rockhold.

Marquardt was a much higher rated MW during his run then those guys were at that time. They really were not in the discussion when he was making his run at MW, from his loss to Anderson up to and around the time he lost to Chael.

 

[melvinj0]

Maia was a perennial top 10 and top 5 at MW who fought for the title.

If he has done more then that at WW list it just like above.

Maia could work his way back in but I think he has been exposed by exactly what I said would expose him at WW.

He still didn't fail at WW though.

 

[melvinj0]

Marquardt was a much higher rated MW during his run then those guys were at that time. They really were not in the discussion when he was making his run at MW, from his loss to Anderson up to and around the time he lost to Chael.

Doesn't matter, I still doubt he could have beat either of them.

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

wasn't fitch #2 at some point and he got completely dominated?

rankings don't mean much. maia is WAY better at WW than MW.

completely unproven assumption with nothing to base it on.

Fans have short memories. Fans forget how dominant Maia was over top 11-25 MW's during his run. He also dominated SOnnen when he was at the start of his best run and getting better. he beat Fitch similarly who was at the end of his run and becoming irrelevant at WW. All in all those two are a wash.

I stated pre Shields and I will say again, that fans seem to not understand the type of fighter top bjj guys have been feeding on and struggling with since MMA started.

Give a top bjj guy a wrestling whose bread and butter is td and control and who does not have great defensive wrestling nor the striking to make the bjj respect them and that is a top bjj guys easiest fight.

give that same top bjj guy a wrestler with strong defensive wrestling, the ability to keep it standing and striking to make him respect him and those guy become a top bjj worst nightmare.

You guys saw Maia dominating type 1 (at MW and WW) and you lost your mind saying he was better. FALSE. He was the exact same. He did or accomplished NOTHING at WW that he did nto at MW.

Give Maia Ellenberger and Hendricks and watch them Munoz and Weidman him.

 

[edisraw]

Maia is still only 2-3 wins from a 170 title shot, loss or not. Anyone that says he failed knows very little about the rankings in contender ship in MMA let alone UFC. I mean he dropped down and beat 3 top 15 fighters (1 top 10 in Fitch.) and lost a debatable SD to arguably the only 170 pound fighter that has the skills to deflect his style of fighting.

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

Doesn't matter, I still doubt he could have beat either of them.

cool. agree to disagree. He was top ranked MW who many were eager and expdected to see a rematch V Anderson with up until Chael derailed him.

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

He still didn't fail at WW though.

read the thread for the entire context. the 'fail' is in context of 'doing better at WW then at MW'. And so far, yes he has.

 

[RemoWilliams1a**]

Maia is still only 2-3 wins from a 170 title shot, loss or not. Anyone that says he failed knows very little about the rankings in contender ship in MMA let alone UFC. I mean he dropped down and beat 3 top 15 fighters (1 top 10 in Fitch.) and lost a debatable SD to arguably the only 170 pound fighter that has the skills to deflect his style of fighting.

lol.wut.

Anyone Maia cannot td will be a challenge for him. Munoz and Weidman were not unique.

Again you guys see him beat the type of wrestlers that since UFC 1 are food for top bjj guys and you way over rate what he has done.

Ellenberger, Hendricks and Kos, likely would be very tough fights for him if he cannot get them down and keep them down. watch his Munoz fight again as Munoz has very good defensive wrestling. He is tough to td and tougher to keep down and has the power in the hands to make Maia not rush in wildly.

Could Maia work his way back with a few wins? Sure. I am not saying otherwise. I am saying no MW to date has done as well at WW as they did at MW. and that is true as far as I can tell, including Maia, to date. He and Lawler could change that however. I am not denying that.

 

[Blond]

completely unproven assumption with nothing to base it on.

Fans have short memories. Fans forget how dominant Maia was over top 11-25 MW's during his run. He also dominated SOnnen when he was at the start of his best run and getting better. he beat Fitch similarly who was at the end of his run and becoming irrelevant at WW. All in all those two are a wash.

I stated pre Shields and I will say again, that fans seem to not understand the type of fighter top bjj guys have been feeding on and struggling with since MMA started.

Give a top bjj guy a wrestling whose bread and butter is td and control and who does not have great defensive wrestling nor the striking to make the bjj respect them and that is a top bjj guys easiest fight.

give that same top bjj guy a wrestler with strong defensive wrestling, the ability to keep it standing and striking to make him respect him and those guy become a top bjj worst nightmare.

You guys saw Maia dominating type 1 (at MW and WW) and you lost your mind saying he was better. FALSE. He was the exact same. He did or accomplished NOTHING at WW that he did nto at MW.

Give Maia Ellenberger and Hendricks and watch them Munoz and Weidman him.

Shields and Fitch are very similar stylistically. Jake is not the "BJJ nightmare" fighter you're describing. In fact he is way more similar to the first type of fighter. Maia is significantly better at WW. As a mw he was a #1 contender, but other then Sonnen most of his wins are mid level fighters and his losses were very decisive. As a WW he dominated 3 guys (Fitch was top ten, DHK has shown that he is very legit), and lost a close decision. He will most likely end up having a very good run.

 

[edisraw]

lol.wut.

Anyone Maia cannot td will be a challenge for him. Munoz and Weidman were not unique.

Again you guys see him beat the type of wrestlers that since UFC 1 are food for top bjj guys and you way over rate what he has done.

Ellenberger, Hendricks and Kos, likely would be very tough fights for him if he cannot get them down and keep them down. watch his Munoz fight again as Munoz has very good defensive wrestling. He is tough to td and tougher to keep down and has the power in the hands to make Maia not rush in wildly.

Could Maia work his way back with a few wins? Sure. I am not saying otherwise. I am saying no MW to date has done as well at WW as they did at MW. and that is true as far as I can tell, including Maia, to date. He and Lawler could change that however. I am not denying that.

I thought he beat Weidman...and despite age his striking continues to improve. Also Story got swept I believe and would;ve been a bitch to take down.

*rewatches fight.*

 

[KyouLose]

Kenny Florian was better at welterweight than he was at middleweight. and he was better at lightweight than he was at welterweight. and some would argue he was better at featherweight than he was at lightweight.

 

[xWesleh]

Kenny Florian was better at welterweight than he was at middleweight. and he was better at lightweight than he was at welterweight. and some would argue he was better at featherweight than he was at lightweight.

He shouldve kept going. Couldve been Flyweight champ.