Is rondas belt anymore legit than cyborgs?

[flanellograf]

I agree completely that Featherweight is a wasteland. However, the OP's question was whether the Invicta belt was just as legitimate as the UFC's belt.

The answer is simple, the UFC belt is fully legitimate in that it represents a division with the vast majority of the best talent the weight class has to offer, and is defended by a champion who has taken on the majority of the highest rank challengers at the weight class. Invicta's is not.

That's without even getting into discussions of value of the belts, economic differences and market presence between the organizations, or that the UFC belt is known and recognized by huge numbers of people and the Invicta belt is obscure and unknown.

Well, I'm not so sure. Who are these top level 145 women that are not fighting in Invicta?

EDIT: Actually, I just checked fight matrix and you are correct. Several girls in the top 10 are fighting (or have been) in Bellator.

 

[CC27]

Ronda has fought better comp, hate on her all you want but nobody can deny that.

 

[bustalilgrape]

don't see why not?

all the people say no just bc its not a ufc belt like for real idgaf

 

[Toxxus]

You aren't going to see Cyborg or another woman running through the competition like Ronda has. She has 4 finishes (3 tkos's, 1 sub) in the last 2 minutes and 10 seconds.

That is insane.

Nobody is approaching that velocity. To have one or two quick wins are real career markers for most. Ronda has stacked 3 of them back to back (16s, 14s, 34s).

Go ahead and show me where Cyborg wrecked people at that rate while holding a 100% finish rate and being undefeated.

 

[djacobox372]

Ronda has fought much better competition. She also has yet to be stripped of her belt for PED use. That said, they are both clearly the best fighter at their respective weights.

Gina is better than anybody that Rhonda has fought.

 

[leto1776]

Why would I bother refuting nonsense? Its a waste of time. Cyborg beat a viable contender? You mean like 5-2 Faith Van Duin? Who had her first MMA fight 2 years ago? Or do you meen Charmaine Tweet before that? The girl who is 6-5? (oh and Tweet is also nearly 40 years old)

People talking shit about Bethe conveniently forget that she is better than 11/13 of Cyborgs opponents

Wow, you seem to be really trying, but you're just not competent at your troll job. Cyborg beat Coenen for the belt. I notice you left out her name, probably because it was who I really meant, and you just wanna troll.

And what exactly makes Bethe a better fighter than Cyborg's opponents? An undefeated record against nobodies and over-the-hill fighters? That's really reaching.

Invicta's belt has not been around significantly longer.

Cyborg was the first Invicta featherweight champion and won the title in April of 2013. She has defended the belt twice. Coenen won the inaugural belt in October, 2014. That doesn't sound like a huge time gap to me.

Are you really going to claim a 1 year gap between two organizations, where the talent is actually superior in Bellator does not have a legitimate claim to being just as credible as the Invicta featherweight belt?

This isn't a super stacked division vs a division that isn't stacked.

And Cyborg fighting 4 times in 3 years against Muxlow, Coenen, Tweet and Van Duinn isn't exactly an argument for "undisputed" or a reign backed up by a lot of title defenses.

Nor is the argument of her beating fighters 4+ years ago after a 1 year lay off and minimal fight production. All the fighters she defeated previously 4+ years ago aren't going to be the same exact fighters.

At best you can say that Cyborg is the best featherweight. To claim that the Invicta belt is the unequivocal, undisputed symbol of supremacy in the weight class is just laughable. Being the best fighter doesn't make the title undisputed, any more than Fedor being the best made the M-1 title undisputed.

bold: vastly superior competition? Their champ is someone who Cyborg beat down twice.
Italics: really? Sure makes a strong argument, especially considering, again, the "other" champ lost to Cyborg twice.

 

[theanticool]

Well, the girl that was ranked #3 at featherweight got her ass beat by the girl that failed to make in on TUF 18, so there's that. I'd also say women like Davis, Tate, Zingano, and Kaufman are light years ahead of the likes of Tweet, Van Duin, and Muxlow. Coenen was a solid win, but even she doesn't seem that interested in fighting these days. So yeah, I'd say it is.

 

[theanticool]

Gina is better than anybody that Rhonda has fought.

What? Carano's best wins were Julie Kedzie (was 8-5 when they fought and best win heading in was Jan Finney), Rosi Sexton (a natural 125lber that moved up to 138lbs), Tonya Evinger (was 4-3), and Kaitlin Young (4-1). I guess there was also Kelly Kobold (17-2) but she's the definition of Midwestern can crusher and was on a two fight skid heading into their fight. What makes her better exactly?

 

[Ashenthorn]

Gina is better than anybody that Rhonda has fought.

Better looking.

 

[roventu]

they are the same. Cyborg is in the only legit 145 wmma division out there. if UFC had a 145 division, it would take all the top girls in the invicta 145 division (just like they took most of their 115 division from invicta), maybe some 135s would move up, but there's no one thats really cutting massive weight in 135.

that is why the "champ doesn't chase opponents" doesnt work, they're both champions of their division. and from the fights we've seen in 115, you can say there is no such thing as "UFC-calibre" anymore

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Gina is better than anybody that Rhonda has fought.

No. She isn't. She is prettier and more famous than anybody Ronda has fought. Tate wrecks Gina. Probably Cat does as well.

 

[flanellograf]

Better looking.

Not even that, really. She has a cute, sexy smile, but other than that her face is mannish and not very proportionate, bland.

 

[mkess101]

Gina is better than anybody that Rhonda has fought.

Quick, name Gina's best win. Go ahead. Gina was 7-0 against...?

Now I'll name Cat Zingano's best win: Meisha Tate. Ronda is 3-0 against both. Meisha subbed Coenen who might actually be Cyborg's best 2 wins even over Gina.

Noboby being even remotely objective can think Cyborg has even close to the resume' Ronda does, even if you actually think Cyborg would/will beat Ronda. It's utter nonsense.

 

[skold]

Wow, you seem to be really trying, but you're just not competent at your troll job. Cyborg beat Coenen for the belt. I notice you left out her name, probably because it was who I really meant, and you just wanna troll.

I didn't leave her name out, I mentioned her last 2 fights.. Fine Coenen is the only decent win on Cyborgs resume.. and guess what? Miesha finished Coenen thus making a win over Miesha far more impressive than a win over Coenen.

Thus rendering your entire argument to be false

 

[jamiehunter]

They are all basicly fighting former STRIKEFORCE and invicta girls. It's basicly the same girls just with a diffrent label strapped on top of it

Is Ronda's belt more legit than the Invicta BW belt?

 

[WayneArbeau]

if ppl don't see the difference between the caliber of opponents Ronda's decimating and the cans Cyborg's beat in her last couple fights, y'all are just fucked in the head, sorry.

charmaine tweet? faith van duin? get the fuck outta here.

 

[Malthian]

bold: vastly superior competition? Their champ is someone who Cyborg beat down twice.
Italics: really? Sure makes a strong argument, especially considering, again, the "other" champ lost to Cyborg twice.

Use your head. You're talking the legitimacy of a title, not the actual fighter.

Let's play a game. Take the champion out of each division. No Cyborg, no Coenen. Now look at the talent in both divisions. Which division has the claim to better talent? Which division has better fighters? Invicta or Bellator?

So out of the two promotions, whoever won the title next in each division, which Title would you consider more legitimate? Bellator or Invicta? Would you still say that the winner of the Invicta belt has the claim to being the undisputed champion?

Just because Cyborg is the best at 145 doesn't make the Invicta belt itself any more legitimate or meaningful. It just means that Cyborg is fighting in a fractured weight class and holding one of TWO possible belts for that weight class.

 

[Danespina]

Bethe Corriea might be as legit as every Cyborg win other then Marloes Coenen and Gina Carano, and she's maybe the worst opponent Ronda has faced since her professional debut.

 

[Megatronlee]

Quick, name Gina's best win. Go ahead. Gina was 7-0 against...?

Now I'll name Cat Zingano's best win: Meisha Tate. Ronda is 3-0 against both. Meisha subbed Coenen who might actually be Cyborg's best 2 wins even over Gina.

Noboby being even remotely objective can think Cyborg has even close to the resume' Ronda does, even if you actually think Cyborg would/will beat Ronda. It's utter nonsense.

Yeah but the only reason we rate marloes so high is because she lasted with cyborg. Which elevated Tate's win. Which in turn elevates rondas and cats wins

 

[Ashenthorn]

Bethe Corriea might be as legit as every Cyborg win other then Marloes Coenen and Gina Carano, and she's maybe the worst opponent Ronda has faced since her professional debut.

Bethe and Cyborg both TKO'd Shayna Bayzler in the 2nd round so Bethe = Cyborg.

MMAth.