Is rondas belt anymore legit than cyborgs?

[Enders]

Simply put, I feel that the advantage Cyborg gained from using PEDs is far more pronounced in females, (as opposed to males,) and far more pronounced in her specifically, (as opposed to Carina Damm.)

So your opinion is based on absolutely zero evidence, gotcha.

 

[YagyuINC]

Yes. Please stop making posts like this, it hurts my brain to read it.

 

[green giant]

It's that way because you're talking a multiplier of base hormone levels.

The average male's testosterone ranges between 260 and 1,100 ng/DL.
The average female's testosterone ranges between 15 and 70 ng/DL.

So a man and a woman take a supplement that increases their testosterone level by 100 ng/DL. For the male it's a 10%-50% increase in the hormone. For a woman it's a 140%-600% increase in the hormone.

Given that testosterone has dramatically higher benefit going from low levels to high levels than going from high levels to slightly higher levels (diminishing returns), it is dramatically worse for women to use steroids than it is for men to use steroids if you're talking about fair competition.

In other words,

one pill/injection for a woman is >>>>>>>> one pill/injection for a man

I tried looking a study up in the past but had no luck. Point me the right direction would you.

 

[green giant]

So your opinion is based on absolutely zero evidence, gotcha.

Yep

 

[green giant]

It's very logical. You have to actually be able to follow the logic tho and not dismiss it.

Plenty of male fighters have been tested positive for PEDs once, so judging solely on that criteria, they're all arguably at the same level. Some have tested twice, so they're all at the same, slightly worse, level, and one person, Josh Barnett, has tested positive three times, so he's worse still. I said that from the get go.

But again, my opinion is that PED abuse is worse in female competitors, and worse still in Cyborg's case.

Hard headed you are. Your opinion is still just as non logical as it was before yet your too stubborn to realize it. Anyway, gotta go.

 

[sdss]

So your opinion is based on absolutely zero evidence, gotcha.

No, there's some science to it as well. But as I said, I was putting it simply. The most powerful evidence is Cyborg's completely unnatural look and the wink wink nudge nudge reaction to it for her entire career in the spotlight.

A lot of people can't seem to grasp that though. Look at the treatment of Overeem over the years here.

 

[sdss]

Hard headed you are. Your opinion is still just as non logical as it was before yet your too stubborn to realize it. Anyway, gotta go.

If you don't agree that PED use is more egregious cheating among women than among men, you're free to explain why.

 

[Bald1]

Not agreeing with the other guy's statement (though she is a bad cheater), but Cyborg was also caught attempting to manipulate a scale because she was overweight

And fought 6 pounds over for her fight with Akano. How many shady things can a fighter pull before you're allowed to question their character?

 

[Enders]

No, there's some science to it as well. But as I said, I was putting it simply. The most powerful evidence is Cyborg's completely unnatural look and the wink wink nudge nudge reaction to it for her entire career in the spotlight.

A lot of people can't seem to grasp that though. Look at the treatment of Overeem over the years here.

Well that's just stupid. Gilbert Melendez has a pretty average looking body but he was caught, but Rumble Johnson is ripped as hell but clean. I suppose then they are just as guilty of cheating using your logic.

 

[LiLoMMA]

The people trying to defend Cyborg's belt remind me of the "it's still real to me dammit" wrestling fan

 

[sdss]

Well that's just stupid. Gilbert Melendez has a pretty average looking body but he was caught, but Rumble Johnson is ripped as hell but clean. I suppose then they are just as guilty of cheating using your logic.

No, I'm talking about proven cheaters. Gilbert, by virtue of failing a PED test, is a proven cheater. In that respect, Anthony Johnson to my knowledge is not. But, I'd consider Gilbert's cheating no worse than any other fighter with a single failed test.

 

[leto1776]

I love the heavies.malways challenging me to add too my ignore list.mthis thread has convinced me to add another.

 

[BiasBEgone]

They are all make believe belts.

In a make believe "sport".

 

[MusterX]

They are all make believe belts.

In a make believe "sport".

That's a strange stance.

 

[Crusader666]

UFC belt you goof

 

[Malthian]

I tried looking a study up in the past but had no luck. Point me the right direction would you.

Ask and ye shall receive....

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2439524/

You might want to skip the science heavy sections and go right to the section on steroids as performance enhancers in sport. Here's part of it.

Particular emphasis was placed on the administration of anabolic steroids to women and adolescent girls, despite the virilizing effects, because of the rapid gains in sporting performance. It is important to note that the GDR scientists established (to themselves) that

 

[rakeleaves]

Here are the current top 30 p4p women MMA fighters in the world (Courtesy Zec1234 who puts a ton of work into these things)

11 of the top 30 fight in Ronda Rousey's division - the UFC women's bantamweight division

1 of the top 30 fight in Cyborg's division - Cyborg herself

Rousey's record against the top 30 p4p in the world is 6-0

Cyborg's record against the top 30 is 0-0 - having not fought any of them.

"They (Rousey and Cyborg opponents) are all just a bunch of chicks so basically it's all the same thing, right?" is not a coherent argument.

Women in the BW division become top fighters with victories over girls that have no top wins. Despite two losses in the UFC, Meisha is ranked #4 because of wins over Mcmann, Carmouche and Eye... who have these girls beaten in the top 10 though? Nobody.

Meisha's best win that pushed her to the top of most rankings originally was MC, the same girl that Cyborg beat in more impressive fashion X2... Cyborg hasn't lost since and despite beating Carano along the way, is somehow ranked lower p4p than Meisha. UFC have done a great job marketing the division, but in reality it isn't that far off from FW in terms of depth.

 

[Guy Smith]

What's this based on exactly? I mean, is Bethe Correia on that list? If so that's pretty hilarious a part-time fighter who has only been training any kind of martial art for a grand total of 3 years is considered one of the top 20 female fighters in the division.

Jon Jones was kind of in that position, but I know what you mean, and your right.

Women's MMA is pretty illegitimate. Nearly all of them are into it part-time and have very limited extensive backgrounds in a starting martial art.

There are a lot of UFC fighters who have a job. Especially after this Reebok deal. They cant make enough money from fighting to make a living. These "bigger" names who have been at it for years, or who are always main eventing can not work and just focus on training since for them it's a career not a hobby. With UFC's base pay you gotta fight numerous times a year before you can really quit a job. And I bet most UFC fighters are doing just under that.

UFC Straw top 10 is full of chicks with extensive backgrounds in grappling/martial arts and you can see it in their technique. Most "pro" fighters in general start out at an "all in one" MMA gym. Of course some come from deep martial arts, wrestling, or boxing backgrounds. As far as SW, Paige and Penne might be the only ones with out years of a martial arts/combat sports experience prior to training MMA.

 

[Taric]

Jon Jones was kind of in that position, but I know what you mean, and your right.

Jones wrestled in high school and college.

Bethe literally didn't do a single thing that had anything to do with martial art training until she was 28.

 

[Charlie77]

They're both legit champions. It's no different from when Frankie Edgar was the lightweight UFC champ while Benson Henderson was the WEC champion. Cyborg might be crushing cans lately, but she also has career wins over Marloes Coenen and Gina Carano.