is defending the RNC *that* hard??? (Trigg)

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by p0gi.g, Aug 21, 2005.

  1. p0gi.g

    p0gi.g OG MMA Fan

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    mmmm for those of you that watched the UFC yesterday... i felt mighty sorry (kinda) for trigg who still can't figure out how to defend a RNC

    i don't personally train.. but is it really that hard to escape a RNC once someone's got your back? or is he just retarded and doing stupid things like standing up with his hands out pretty much giving it away?... because the way i've been seeing it, once you got someone's back, it seems pretty much inevitable that eventually you will tap to a RNC (or armbar from mount/tap out strikes if they turn around)

    so to make it short, is escaping the RNC as hard as Trigg makes it seem?
     
  2. guardpasser

    guardpasser Tudo Bem Bjj

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    during the roll he didnt defend at all, he seemed to concentrate more on the roll over than the defense.
    i thnk he can defend it, but he lost concentration again, maybe due to being tired from posting on all fours and really working too hard at that position.
    St pierre looked really good, he was on top of his game for sure
     
  3. alexgncw

    alexgncw Guest

    first off he defended it several times and did it quite well ... it becomes much harder to defend once you start to run out of gas which he did from constantly defending it and gsp strikes

    the answer to your question is no the move itself is not that hard to defend although it is one of the higher % subs what is hard to defend is everything that might follow after you stop it like arm bars, body locks, etc and sooner or later if you can't get out of this position you will get caught

    so whats really hard is escaping from the back/full mount not the rnc itself
     
  4. colinm

    colinm Brown Belt

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    against someone that has a bunch of little tricks up their sleeves for getting the rnc it can be pretty fucking hard. add in strikes in mma...trigg was getting a pretty solid beating and was stuck in bad positions the whole fight and obviously didnt like it. gsp looked really good.
     
  5. wenispinkle

    wenispinkle Skankin' It Easy...

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    its especially hard to defend is when your getting hit in the sides of the head.....you cant just take those punches all day, eventually your going to be forced to do something stupid like stick your arm out.....its also very hard to defend him from getting his forearm in your throat when you roll (which is where gsp locked it in) because he had his hands on the ground during the roll.......i think trigg could at least take both arms and pull down on the choking arm before immediately tapping out though....
     
  6. blanko

    blanko Guest

    this could be said about any submission in mma..
     
  7. Smorra

    Smorra Blue Belt

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    Does anyone know of an escape to the palm-to-palm version of the RNC? I have been able to get out of the more common RNC where they grab their non-choking arms bicep and put the other hand behind my head, but I don't know of any escapes if they switch to the palm-to-palm grip (choking-arm's hand on top.) If they get this grip, I can't grab their non-choking arm, because the forearm of it is against my back, with the elbow pointing toward my lower back (e.g. Fedor v. Fujita.) I haven't had anyone attempt this on me in sparring or at a tournament, but I would like to be prepared for it.
     
  8. flyingknee16

    flyingknee16 Brown Belt

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    90% of the time it is not hard to defend against the RNC, but when it starts getting sweaty, it's way easier to slip your arm underneath the neck and choke your opponent.
     
  9. Darwinist

    Darwinist Super Simian

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    Also, wrestlers tend to have diffrent instincts when someone
     
  10. demolidor77

    demolidor77 Blue Belt

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    its very hard, but like in everything depends of the skill level of both oponents.
     
  11. TwIsTeD&BrOkEn

    TwIsTeD&BrOkEn With These Hands I Control The Fate of Millions

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    I hate this thread.
     
  12. I-Shoji

    I-Shoji Green Belt

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    I'm not sure why noone seems to have shown him the neck-pull escape. When a guy has your back and you're on all 4's, reaching up behind your head and grabbing the back of their head allows you to pull them over you and roll your shoulder into them making it impossibly to hold your position or consider the choke. Its like getting can-opened.

    I always know its coming when I roll with this one guy who does it so well and I can really seem to stop it unless I abandon the RNC effort to get my head away.
     
  13. Dedicado

    Dedicado Machetero

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    ^^ This is probaly th most effective way to break any RNC attempt. The opponent is fighting gravity and trying to grab on to you when you're sweaty, sure you get tired, but that's why you're training hard, right? Right? * Sound of Nightclubs in back *

    Trigg getting hit in the head really didn't help. GSP was very patient with the choke, he just pounded on Trigg till Trigg rolled and then it was all over!
     
  14. guardpasser

    guardpasser Tudo Bem Bjj

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    just watched the two fights he had with Matt Hghes again.
    He seems to be going for the wrong arm to defend also, and not tucking the chin very much, bioth guys are very sweaty and that seems to allow it to sink in a lot easier also.
     
  15. kimurense

    kimurense Brown Belt

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    it's harder if you are getting pounded in the head at the same time... I have'nt seen this fight though, I did see the hughes x trigg fights, one would assume after getting beat in this position he would train harder to escape this position, but mabe that did'nt happen
     
  16. devante

    devante Silver Belt

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    i think the prob is when u are a fighter who depends on controlling positioning as much as trigg does the rnc is really hard to def, it comes from an area he is not strong in and it has only happened when his opp could control him or out position him.
    He has never been subbed by a good sub person, because their overall groundskills are not good enough to put him in a bad position plain and simple..hughes out positioned him..as did gsp; in both instances he gassed either cus he shot his load via hughes or was exhausted from abuse and trying to rev...
    exhaustion will bring the move home; but if ur not comfortable being in that situation u don't know how to handle/counter.
     
  17. Gsoares2***

    Gsoares2*** Banned Banned

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    If the hooks are in and the Rnc is in place.. he is screwed... Event he best of the best cant escape it once its on...There are always exceptions or lucky situations but for the most part.. if its in... Its in.

    The good guys dont get put in that position... you should be defending the entire positione the is needed to set up the submission...
    Not the actual choke.... But who the hell are we to tell a professional fighter how to defend. The guy is leeps and bounds ahead of any one on this bored when it comes down to techqniue... save a couple of the pro fighters who post.

    When you put two guys of that calliber together then YES the RNC is that hard to defend... If you disagree let me know when your next pro fight is so i can watch you avoid and escape it.
     
  18. TheHighlander

    TheHighlander Green Belt

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    I think a lot of Trigg's problem was that he tended to give up the back in a panic. No plan, just getting his face away from the punches. Most everybody does this to an extent, but he really seemed to lose composure for a moment. GSP has a slow/methodical, orthodox set of submissions and Trigg's panic gave him some openings he had difficulty making on his own (GSP looked like the gloves threw off his RNC attempts a little).
     
  19. jjmuaythaiguy

    jjmuaythaiguy Brown Belt

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    Yup, I agree, and by that time, he was defending, getting punched and was tired, with the hooks in and sweat on the arms and neck, its only a matter of time. It was a great battle.
     
  20. kimurense

    kimurense Brown Belt

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    john miller escaped pretty much every sub GSP had to offer... his hooks escape is somewhat espectacular, trigg should start learning somestuff from him :)
     

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