Is being the "better" striker overrated?

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by jojoRed, Sep 9, 2018.

  1. jojoRed Aint no stress on me, Lord.

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    Now hear me out before reacting to the title.

    Time and time again we see in MMA, that the "better" striker getting beat on the feet. Isnt being the more "effective" striker more beneficial?

    Ill give some examples, no one will deny WB's striking instincts, diversity is far superior to Woodley's, and yet he got dropped 3/4 times and took a beating on the feet. Woodley's striking was more "effective". Same thing with Till. Theyre "better" strikers but he's more "effective" and thus effective > better. Ill give more examples below.

    Now even if we apply this to say, Khabib, whose striking seems rudimentary, he seems to outstrike "better" strikers on the feet, has better defence on the feet etc. Against guys like Al, Barboza etc. We all know in a boxing/kickboxing type situation, he's far outmatched but he's a more "effective" striker than the all of his previous opponents.

    Now these guys mentioned above have another dimension which allows their striking to be so effective, and thats their wrestling/grappling.

    But the same thing could be said about strikers aswell, everyone knows Conor has a left hand, but its the most "effective" weapon in MMA in terms of standing up. I know a lot comes with that left like the measuring of distance, instincts, timing, power and speed, but lets be reductionist for a moment. Guys like WB, TJ have more weapons and are more diverse strikers, but theyre not as effective. Does that mean theyre better strikers? I dont think so, because "effectiveness" is more important than being "better".


    TL;DR Having "better" striking isnt the advantage, having "effective" striking is & that "better" striking should mean more "effective" in mma.

    EDIT: A lot of fans equate "better" to being diverse, having slick movement etc. Its essentially a catch-all term in mma.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
  2. FleximusPrime I'm a goddamn sexual tyrannosaurus

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  3. LouisBolanos Popcorn tastes good

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    100% agree. In fact I would simply define "better striking" as "more effective striking", i.e. if A can beat B in a striking contest, then A is a better striker than B. It doesn't matter if A is better as a result of superior technical skill, or more diverse skill set, or superior power, or superior cardio, or superior size, none of that is relevant, the only thing that matters is that A can beat B in striking.

    For example, prime Bob Sapp was a better striker than Ernesto Hoost. Was he more technical? Hell no. But he was bigger, more powerful and more effective, and these resulted in him beating Hoost in striking, therefore he was the better striker, end of.

    Similarly, a grizzly bear is a far better striker than prime Sugar Ray Leonard, because if they were to engage in a striking contest, Leonard would do zero damage to the bear, and the bear would break Leonard's neck with one slap.
     
  4. Lorenzo Fertitta Banned Banned

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    Look at Hendo

    The guy had a right hand.

    That was basically his entire striking arsenal, and also rarely used his wrestling.

    But is widely considered a top 10 GOAT
     
  5. Njmma209 Banned Banned

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    Woodley outclassed your boy Till because he’s simply that great. No need to overanalyze.

    Woodley is better in every facet of MMA.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
  6. P4PSHERGOAT Green Belt

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    Yeah it is overrated in MMA. Just like being the more credentialed grappler is overrated. MMA is a whole different animal than ever other combat sport
     
  7. AWilder Brown Belt

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    You can have all the striking accolades in the world, but if you don't have good wrestling/grappling/bjj/sub defense/TDD/etc. You are just a one trick pony. I think we often see strikers lose the striking match because they are threatened with takedowns and are afraid to commit. I didn't watch Woodley v till last night so I'm not speaking on that fight specifically.
     
  8. Chok Sok Te Purple Belt

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    The ‘better strikers’ have more tools, but are afraid to use them against power punchers.
     
  9. HI SCOTT NEWMAN ✔ This Cat had 167,454 Likes Received ✔

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    I was not even convinced Till is a great striker, and I said that many many many times on here in the lead up to the fight. He was hugely overrated and never ever deserved a title shot. Yes his Cerrone fight was very impressive, but apart from that I'm just not seeing it, I see a very tentative and hesitant point fighter in most of his fights. UFC hype machine fail again!.

    But that aside, I do agree with you that being the better striker is overrated. Look what happened only last month.. Saki/Rountree. Now if you seen Rountree's fights his striking is very stiff and slow, but look how he knocked out Saki in like a minute.

    Also the threat of the takedown is a huge thing, if a guy is a really good wrestler then it makes his opponent wary that they might shoot, and it gives the wrestler more chance to land strikes.
     
  10. FleximusPrime I'm a goddamn sexual tyrannosaurus

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    The reverse is also true, you can be a great grappler until you get pinged on the chin, its called MMA and why the UFC was formed and styles make fights, whats the point of this post exactly?
     
  11. yekmurat Silver Belt

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  12. jojoRed Aint no stress on me, Lord.

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    ???

    I just argued that effective striking > better striking and gave examples to start a discussion instead of create threads with troll undertones like you do.

    I actually claimed Tyron is the more effective striker...
     
  13. Vergilius Brown Belt

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    Basically, what you are really saying is that having great variety in your strikes is less important than having one or two really reliable weapons.

    It's like brother Naz said to Badr Hari about the Klitschkos "We've got these two brothers sitting over in Europe and all they've got is an old shotgun. But as soon as you are on their front porch, they blast you through the door. Now, you've got an entire arsenal, but while you are thinking about whether to use the AK47, the assault rifle or the bazooka, the burglars have already cleaned out your house."

    I agree. Getting your jab, cross, hook + footwork to elite level is more important than learning tornado kicks.
     
  14. mortal Purple Belt

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    I'd say "kinda" in MMA in general and "yeah" in UFC but it's really a complicated matter. Btw, if the judging has changed in the UFC then correct me. I did catch an event which took part in Europe (Ukraine maybe?) and the judging seemed less messed up IMHO.
    Saying Khabib is "outstriking" others is wrong and we've seen that before in these parts. It's the TD threat that keeps some fighters from striking in their full potential. If M. Ali is tied on a chair and I start hitting him am I really outstriking him? Some fighters get a lil bit "tied up" by the TD threat, that's all.
     
  15. Jared's picks Tapping to strikes is shameful. Banned

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    Yoel would wreck Saki on the feet in 4 ounce gloves

    There's your answer.
     
  16. jeremyemilio Silver Belt

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    True... but it's always been long known that being the "better" striker doesn't necessarily make you a favourite even in a boxing match. There have been countless guys who have risen to the top by making sure every fight turn into a messy brawl, or just relying on chin and toughness, or outpacing and outlasting opponents, or simply having more grit and will to stay in there no matter how hot the firefight gets.
     
  17. smiles mma Brown Belt

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    People put too much weight in credentials, black belts, world champions, undefeated in all sound good before the fight but time over and over have proved it doesn't always translate
     
  18. jojoRed Aint no stress on me, Lord.

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    Thats exactly what I mean, effectiveness should equate to being better and not just by being "more skilled". I also gave examples of strikers that are "better" than Conor because theyre more diverse, flashy, etc whatever, but he's more effective and thus should mean he's better.
     
  19. UFCBlackbelt Green Belt

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    Stop putting the word effective in quotes, it’s annoying.
     
  20. jojoRed Aint no stress on me, Lord.

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    I kept it just because I like annoying guys like you that get annoyed by such things.


    <JonesDXSuckIt><GrassoBless>
     

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