In light of Cormier/Mir announcement...

[Jay Jay]

I am glad the majority are favoring Cormier to beat Mir, although Mir definitely is capable of pulling off this upset. But there's still a sizable contingent who claims Mir is going to outclass Cormier simply because of his long UFC tenure against "proven" competition as if that's the be-all-end-all in a match-up (it's more-so their rationale than the fact that they are favoring Mir)

Case in point:

People forget that in the past 5 years, Mir has only lost to the very best HW's in the world (Carwin, JDS and Lesnar), 2 of whom are former UFC champions. He broke Nog's arm, KO'ed Mirko, choked out Kongo, picked up a win over Nelson and subbed a relatively green Lesnar. Mir has beaten and lost to much stiffer competition that Cormier has faced.

At 5'11", Cormier is a tiny HW with great wrestling and decent striking. Mir, OTOH, is a big HW with great submissions and solid striking. He's a former world champion and a proven quantity.

If you pick Cormier in this fight, it means you like Cormier, dislike Mir or you don't know the definition of the word hype.

My question is: why aren't we capable of showing more depth in fight analyses beyond comparing "who has more UFC wins"

It's funny how people in MMA can't come to grips with fight skill and a fight record not being necessarily synonymous. Like Renan Barao is going to lose to Urijah Faber because Barao has only beat Brad Pickett and Faber has lost to everybody. Sometimes, it's a red flag if a fighter has beat nobody, but if the actual skills are there, seems silly to cry about the resume.

Then again, I heard a million people talking about Jon Jones getting trashed by Shogun for the same reason. It's like, you know, whatever.

Boxing fans, by comparison, appear to have a more nuanced understanding of their sport. I understand that MMA as a sport is relatively young, but we can still definitely step up our game. Just my $0.02

 

[aquamanpunch]

Boils down to the simple fact that Cormier is fast with power and Mir is slow with a questionable chin. Eventually Mir is getting tucked in.

 

[countswagula]

Considering this will more than likely be a stand-up battle, I do think people are counting Mir out a little too soon. Cormier may be faster and more heavy handed, but Mir isn't a slouch on the feet.

 

[solyhhit]

I think when it goes to the ground Cormier will get outclassed. If Nog gets his arm broken, Cormier has no chance.

If it stays standing, Cormier picks Mir apart.

 

[Emporio Alnino]

Boils down to the simple fact that Cormier is fast with power and Mir is slow with a questionable chin. Eventually Mir is getting tucked in.

can't sum it up any better than this.

 

[Evangelion]

Considering this will more than likely be a stand-up battle, I do think people are counting Mir out a little too soon. Cormier may be faster and more heavy handed, but Mir isn't a slouch on the feet.

Mir looked fucking awful on his feet in his last 2 fights.

 

[JKS]

I think its a lack of knowledge of MMA fans, but also that MMA is a far more unpredictable sport then pretty much every other sport. Boxing is more predictable and has genearally more educated fans.

Its not easy to asses a MMA fight based on skills unless you have a very good undertanding of what both guys can do very well...there are so many variable to consider, in addition the unpredicability factor.

In this fight, its hard not to favor one guy over the other. Mir is a very proven HW, good striking, grea subs and ground game, experience. Cormier on the other hand has less in all those things.....but he has shown to dominate a guy in Barnett that does all those things Mir does, he has shown ability to KO a guy like Silva and if he does hit Mir, same thing will happen IMO. So again....we are going back to that way of picking a guy based on prior fight and who he's beaten..........which is what TS said not to do, but it counts for a lot. I mean how can somone not say Cormier isnt the fav....based on what he did vs Barnett or SIlva.

Its a close fight.......I havent picked anyone.

 

[melvinj0]

Mir always struggles with strong wrestlers, Cormier is probably one of the strongest wrestlers in MMA right now, I just don't think Mir will be handle what Cormier is going to bring.

 

[countswagula]

Mir looked fucking awful on his feet in his last 2 fights.

Only one man on the planet has not looked awful on the feet against JDS, and that was only in one of two occasions.

 

[iwhoopedbatman]

I was a lot more certain about Cormier winning this before his last fight. I hope he was just looking past that Stary fight because if he shows up with a performance like that, particularly what passed for top control in that fight, he'll probably lose an arm. That said, I think he shows up better focused and likely puts Mir away early.

 

[Emporio Alnino]

Only one man on the planet has not looked awful on the feet against JDS, and that was only in one of two occasions.

but he looked terrible in the nog fight too.

 

[Evangelion]

Only one man on the planet has not looked awful on the feet against JDS, and that was only in one of two occasions.

well thankfully for Cormier he trains with and fights much like that one person

 

[Badworker]

Cormier is favored for a reason, but those who think that Mir has no chance are just being idiotic.

As a Mir fan, this is a match-up that I fear, but this wouldn't be the first time if Mir pulled off the upset

 

[fitedoc]

Boils down to the simple fact that Cormier is fast with power and Mir is slow with a questionable chin. Eventually Mir is getting tucked in.

That is the best synopsis I've seen yet!

 

[countswagula]

well thankfully for Cormier he trains with and fights much like that one person

Kongo touched Cain on the feet, Mir knocked Kongo down. Simple MMAth should tell us Mir > Cain

 

[BrandDC]

Unfortunately Frank's punch defense is relatively poor and he appears to fight lethargically unless he's on the ground with a limb in his hands...

I wish Mir fought with a sense of urgency. I'd love to see him beat Cormier but I wouldn't bet on it. I hope Frank subs Dan.

Considering this will more than likely be a stand-up battle, I do think people are counting Mir out a little too soon. Cormier may be faster and more heavy handed, but Mir isn't a slouch on the feet.

 

[Evangelion]

Kongo touched Cain on the feet, Mir knocked Kongo down. Simple MMAth should tell us Mir > Cain

yeah mmamath always works so well. Chuck dropped Overeem, Overeem torched Hari, clearly Chuck is the best striker in combat sports, or not.

 

[RP3X]

How many times can mir be knocked out only to grab hold of a limb while unconscious

Only thing Mir has going for himself is this, and the fact he derailed Mr Brocks debut and a come back victory from big nog.

Against Cormier even less chance, we saw Cormier being so smart with his take downs and top control and striking and gnp last week, and expect to see the same if mir aint knocked out from 1st 2-3 minutes.

 

[Lincoln Hawk]

I am glad the majority are favoring Cormier to beat Mir, although Mir definitely is capable of pulling off this upset. But there's still a sizable contingent who claims Mir is going to outclass Cormier simply because of his long UFC tenure against "proven" competition as if that's the be-all-end-all in a match-up (it's more-so their rationale than the fact that they are favoring Mir)

If you don't go by a fighters experience, record, matches and what they've shown / proven against competition, what do you go by?

My question is: why aren't we capable of showing more depth in fight analyses beyond comparing "who has more UFC wins"

Perhaps you'd care to enlighten us. What sort of objective measures do you use to come by your 'in depth' fight analysis?

Choosing Cormier because he looked good against Bigfoot and Barnett is the same as choosing Mir because he KTFO'd Cro Cop and broke Nog's arm.

 

[BiggThump]

I am glad the majority are favoring Cormier to beat Mir, although Mir definitely is capable of pulling off this upset. But there's still a sizable contingent who claims Mir is going to outclass Cormier simply because of his long UFC tenure against "proven" competition as if that's the be-all-end-all in a match-up (it's more-so their rationale than the fact that they are favoring Mir)

Case in point:


My question is: why aren't we capable of showing more depth in fight analyses beyond comparing "who has more UFC wins"

It's funny how people in MMA can't come to grips with fight skill and a fight record not being necessarily synonymous. Like Renan Barao is going to lose to Urijah Faber because Barao has only beat Brad Pickett and Faber has lost to everybody. Sometimes, it's a red flag if a fighter has beat nobody, but if the actual skills are there, seems silly to cry about the resume.

Then again, I heard a million people talking about Jon Jones getting trashed by Shogun for the same reason. It's like, you know, whatever.

Boxing fans, by comparison, appear to have a more nuanced understanding of their sport. I understand that MMA as a sport is relatively young, but we can still definitely step up our game. Just my $0.02

Since Cormier is being schooled by Steven Seagal I am going to give him the edge in this matchup.