If DC beats Jones

Sherdog is filled with stupidity.

I can't disagree with you there. But really, I am just trying to have a conversation.

And I really dislike Jones, but if we're being honest, he is a legit piece of the GoAT conversation. He has destroyed many top tier fighters and does not have a real loss in over 20 pro fights. He was a dominant champ (8 consecutive title defenses) and no man who tried could take his belt from him in the cage.
 
I can't disagree with you there. But really, I am just trying to have a conversation.

And I really dislike Jones, but if we're being honest, he is a legit piece of the GoAT conversation. He has destroyed many top tier fighters and does not have a real loss in over 20 pro fights. He was a dominant champ (8 consecutive title defenses) and no man who tried could take his belt from him in the cage.
LHW sucks, bad, but he's looked great. He is probably goat LHW, and maybe halfway to the actual GOAT discussions.
 
LHW sucks, bad, but he's looked great. He is probably goat LHW, and maybe halfway to the actual GOAT discussions.

When he took the LHW belt, that division was considered a shark tank. It was only after he dismantled it that people started claiming that the division was terrible/the fighters are washed up/everyone is too old.

But I do hear you. I don't feel that he is the GoAT, either. I have to stop here, because now I'm defending Jones and this is not something that I really feel comfortable doing.
 
When he took the LHW belt, that division was considered a shark tank. It was only after he dismantled it that people started claiming that the division was terrible/the fighters are washed up/everyone is too old.
Considered by who? Pride fanboys? I considered it very weak, it had been for a long time. Machida could likely make WW if he really wanted to and he was LHW champ. It's still very shallow. Imagine if DC did not move down and Rumble did not move up .. it would be Jones / Gus and .... 10 levels below there is everyone else. LHW is still crazy shallow outside the top 4.
 
Considered by who? Pride fanboys? I considered it very weak, it had been for a long time. Machida could likely make WW if he really wanted to and he was LHW champ. It's still very shallow. Imagine if DC did not move down and Rumble did not move up .. it would be Jones / Gus and .... 10 levels below there is everyone else. LHW is still crazy shallow outside the top 4.

When he took the belt, Shogun was still looked at as great. Rampage, Machida, Rashad were all still considered legit top level guys. It's easy to look back in hindsight and say he beat washed up fighters, but it's disingenuous. He was the reason the LHW division was exposed. Back in 2010-2011, those guys were all widely lauded as beasts.
 
When he took the belt, Shogun was still looked at as great. Rampage, Machida, Rashad were all still considered legit top level guys. It's easy to look back in hindsight and say he beat washed up fighters, but it's disingenuous. He was the reason the LHW division was exposed. Back in 2010-2011, those guys were all widely lauded as beasts.
Except I am telling you I am not saying it in hindsight, I said it all along. The only difference is people who did not believe me then are looking back and seeing I was right. It's not a knock on Jones, he would be the top guy even if the division was great, it just isn't, and it wasn't. It's better now though than it was .. at the very top at least. Again 2/3 of the top LHW guys not named Jones moved to LHW, without them the division would have almost no depth anywhere.
 
If he compiles a few more wins, i have no problem calling Jones the LHW GOAT, even if he loses to DC. As much as it pains me, because i can't stand the guy, he changed a lot of things, and has shaken the entire division. So many great fighters have remained ruined before him.

He's skilled, athletic, absorbs knowledge like a sponge, and is very creative in his defense and attacks.

If DC beats Jones, half the forum will make excuses while the other half talks about how he's washed up now and was never that good anyway.

Only an idiot can make that statement.
 
Except I am telling you I am not saying it in hindsight, I said it all along. The only difference is people who did not believe me then are looking back and seeing I was right. It's not a knock on Jones, he would be the top guy even if the division was great, it just isn't, and it wasn't. It's better now though than it was .. at the very top at least. Again 2/3 of the top LHW guys not named Jones moved to LHW, without them the division would have almost no depth anywhere.

Not sure i agree.

Jones, Evans, Teixeira, Gus, Rampage, Shogun, Bader, Rumble are all great fighters. Davis, Manuwa, St. Preux to name a few other. Fighters normally at 205, which sometimes decide to switch to 185 - Machida, Henderson, Vitor. Yeah, some fighters are in the twilight of their career or have taken a few tough losses or experienced serious injuries. But you can't expect to have five-six fighters with 15-0 records in this division.
 
I don't care about records. they could all be 8-7 or 7-8 fighting each other .. I care about depth/talent.

Jones - Yep
Evans - Ahhh no.
Teixeira - Sorry, gatekeeper.
Gus - Yep
Rampage - Prime rampage is not top 4.
Shogun - Prime not top 4
Bader - Gatekeeper
Rumble - changed divisions
DC - Changed divisions

LHW sucked, it just had some good guys near equal skill. Jones would maul any of those other guys in their prime 10/10. So would DC.
 
Knowing Shertard, they'd say he was never good and only fought MWs. Oh wait...
 
Machida was on a roll, Shogun just KO'd him, Rampage was Rampage, Rashad was looking like something else but now that Jones has beaten them and they've all gotten older and more worn, NOW the LHW division was exposed and 'always' weak?

Seriously, you all can get the fuck out.
 
Pretty much.

A domination is a Sherk Florian 50-45 or GSP Fitch 50-44 or 50-43.

A 48-47 is hardly a domination.

I'm not going to argue whether the fight was a "domination" or not. I think that it was a very competitive but clear win for Jones.

However, it boggles the mind that people consistently post the wrong score when referring to the decision.

It was only 48-47 on Sherdog. The judges had it 49-46 across the board.
 
Thats a ridiculous statement. Your comparing college to light heavyweight and HW to NFL? lol. The competition is actually better at LHW these days. Just face it , jones is the GOAT.

Now you've moved on to misunderstanding what "competitiveness" is and misusing the phrase "The competition is actually better".

A "competitive" division is one where "there are many people of similar ability at the top" or "there are many people of similar ability throughout the whole division". Either way, "competitiveness" has no bearing whatsoever on how "good" a division is. You can have one group where everyone is terrible, yet very evenly matched, and you've got a "competitive" group. A different group could have large gaps in ability between all the fighters and have no even matches (very "uncompetitive") - yet, every single one of its fighters being better than any of the fighters from the first group.

To rephrase - "Competitive" is a measurement of skill within a group, relative to each other. It has nothing to do with comparison to other groups.

To move on to comparing groups:
HW fighters would win well over half the time against LHW fighters.
Weight cutting sucks. LHWs don't cut for fun. And they don't cut because the purses or the prestige are better at LHW. They cut for 1 reason and 1 reason only - because they know it's easier there.
 
Except I am telling you I am not saying it in hindsight, I said it all along. The only difference is people who did not believe me then are looking back and seeing I was right. It's not a knock on Jones, he would be the top guy even if the division was great, it just isn't, and it wasn't. It's better now though than it was .. at the very top at least. Again 2/3 of the top LHW guys not named Jones moved to LHW, without them the division would have almost no depth anywhere.

It doesn't matter if you personally thought it, the general public perception was that the division was full of killers. That's what I said, and it's true. That was the general perception of the division when Jones took over.
 
Machida was on a roll, Shogun just KO'd him, Rampage was Rampage, Rashad was looking like something else but now that Jones has beaten them and they've all gotten older and more worn, NOW the LHW division was exposed and 'always' weak?

Seriously, you all can get the fuck out.

qft, bravo sir
 
I'm not going to argue whether the fight was a "domination" or not. I think that it was a very competitive but clear win for Jones.

However, it boggles the mind that people consistently post the wrong score when referring to the decision.

It was only 48-47 on Sherdog. The judges had it 49-46 across the board.


Jones clearly won. Almost no one disputes that.

The judges sometimes aren't the best at scoring. It turns out (last I had heard) that they don't even have monitors and you have camera men all up on the apron, BJM, Miragliotta, or whoever in the way as well as fighters back turned towards the person, the cage itself, etc.

All those barriers obstructing view basically.

Even though all 3 judges gave it 49-46, they gave rounds 2 and 3 different winners.

SD had it right with 48-47.
 
It doesn't matter if you personally thought it, the general public perception was that the division was full of killers. That's what I said, and it's true. That was the general perception of the division when Jones took over.
And I did not dispute that, I am just saying there is no hindsight for me, I thought it was weak all along. Others have come around to my thinking. MW was crazy weak too, Strikeforce being acquired helped MW out a lot.
 

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