I just dont understand this Brady-Rodgers stuff. Sorry

[tdluxon]

Its pretty simple.

Aaron Rodgers is the most talented/gifted QB ever.

Brady is an absolutely incredible QB and far and away the most accomplished. The combination of which makes him the undisputable GOAT.

Its not the same thing.

If you want to talk most talented/gifted, mahomes has Rodgers smoked. Obviously too early to say where he’ll stand when it’s all said and done, but as far as pure talent, he’s more athletic, quick release, accurate and he’s got a gun.

 

[JackWhite]

If you want to talk most talented/gifted, mahomes has Rodgers smoked. Obviously too early to say where he’ll stand when it’s all said and done, but as far as pure talent, he’s more athletic, quick release, accurate and he’s got a gun.

I don't know, man. I like Mahomes a lot because he does remind me of a younger Rodgers. Let's see what Mahomes does in the playoffs and in a couple years when he has to carry a depleted team like A-Rod has the last 4 years.

Chiefs vs Packers SB would be fire in 2020.

 

[Madmick]

So one guy plays on a better team than the other? This is groundbreaking news.

One of the teams is better because one of these guy plays on it while the other doesn't, alright.

 

[Corona]

One of the teams is better because one of these guy plays on it while the other doesn't, alright.

One team held opponents under 20 points 8 time this season and the other did that twice(against afc east teams ironically). Brady must be the best defensive qb of all time then. One has the best coach of all time and the other fired theirs mid season. There are stats One could use to support the Brady > Rodgers debate that are perfectly valid. Both guys had eerily similar seasons statistically this year so w/l should be taken with a grain of salt.

This is the problem I have with Brady fan boys. When he puts up an mvp level season and his team goes 11-5/12-4 he gets all the credit. Then this year he has a good season but nowhere near his best and you still want to give him credit for the 11-5 record. Hes a big part of that but ultimately he simply plays on a better team.

 

[Madmick]

One team held opponents under 20 points 8 time this season and the other did that twice(against afc east teams ironically). Brady must be the best defensive qb of all time then. One has the best coach of all time and the other fired theirs mid season. There are stats One could use to support the Brady > Rodgers debate that are perfectly valid. Both guys had eerily similar seasons statistically this year so w/l should be taken with a grain of salt.

I have a big problem with Brady haters, and it's that they try to stigmatize rational fans who recognize Brady's unquestionable GOAT status as "Brady fanboys" simply because the facts reached a point where nobody takes their lost arguments seriously, anymore.

Field position plays a huge role in not giving up points. It helps your defense not get scored on if you control the ball, and don't go 3-and-out. Green Bay ranked 23rd in 3rd down conversions this season. New England ranked 13th. Green Bay ranked 22nd in average time of possession. New England ranked 7th. Green Bay was 17th in punts per score (higher fewer punts per score). New England was 6th.

I wonder who might be most directly responsible for all of that?

 

[tdluxon]

I don't know, man. I like Mahomes a lot because he does remind me of a younger Rodgers. Let's see what Mahomes does in the playoffs and in a couple years when he has to carry a depleted team like A-Rod has the last 4 years.

Chiefs vs Packers SB would be fire in 2020.

Yeah, with mahomes it’s too early to say, could be a flash in the pan but he’s definitely coming out hot. Losing Kareem hunt will be a good test, we’ll see if he can carry more of the offense.

 

[Corona]

I have a big problem with Brady haters, and it's that they try to stigmatize rational fans who recognize Brady's unquestionable GOAT status as "Brady fanboys" simply because the facts reached a point where nobody takes their lost arguments seriously, anymore.

Field position plays a huge role in not giving up points. It helps your defense not get scored on if you control the ball, and don't go 3-and-out. Green Bay ranked 23rd in 3rd down conversions this season. New England ranked 13th. Green Bay ranked 22nd in average time of possession. New England ranked 7th. Green Bay was 17th in punts per score (higher fewer punts per score). New England was 6th.

I wonder who might be most directly responsible for all of that?

New England also gave the ball away 3 more times than the packers and had a turnover differential of +10 to the packers 0. I wonder who’s responsible for that? Surely one player not the entire team.

The fact that people just completely refuse to admit that Brady plays on a better team and has for the majority of his career is amazing. If you’re legitimately trying to say that Brady is the reason the patriots defense is better than the packers then I’m done here.

 

[Madmick]

New England also gave the ball away 3 more times than the packers and had a turnover differential of +10 to the packers 0. I wonder who’s responsible for that? Surely one player not the entire team.

Brady had a fumble/INT differential of +8 versus Rodgers, true, but he also had more touchdowns and a touchdown % that is roughly 20% higher (thanks in part to more yards per pass attempt). As Plissken said above Aaron doesn't take risks until the game is lost. This is why Brady also lost less than half as many yards to sacks, and I'd wager a big part of that is he took 2.61s on average to get rid of the ball (t-5th best) while Aaron was frozen holding it an avg 2.95s (5th worst in the league). So don't whine to me about offensive lines. Aaron eats grass because he sits back there waiting for something to develop while Tom gets rid of the ball, and marches his team down the field. He doesn't throw away passes when he could make a play which is why his completion percentage is a full 3 points higher. That's why his overall metrics are stronger.

If you’re legitimately trying to say that Brady is the reason the patriots defense is better than the packers then I’m done here.

I'm waiting for you to realize that if you're going to hound Brady for mediocre seasons when his team still manages to win you might consider holding Aaron to account for mediocre season when his team doesn't.

Lot more mediocre seasons piling up for Rodgers: teamwise or otherwise.

 

[Corona]

Brady had a fumble/INT differential of +8 versus Rodgers, true, but he also had more touchdowns and a touchdown % that is roughly 20% higher (thanks in part to more yards per pass attempt). As Plissken said above Aaron doesn't take risks until the game is lost. This is why Brady also lost less than half as many yards to sacks, and I'd wager a big part of that is he took 2.61s on average to get rid of the ball (t-5th best) while Aaron was frozen holding it an avg 2.95s (5th worst in the league). So don't whine to me about offensive lines. Aaron eats grass because he sits back there waiting for something to develop while Tom gets rid of the ball, and marches his team down the field. He doesn't throw away passes when he could make a player which is why his completion percentage is a full 3 points higher. That's why his overall metrics are stronger.

I'm waiting for you to realize that if you're going to hound Brady for mediocre seasons when his team still manages to win you might consider holding Aaron to account for mediocre season when his team doesn't.

Lot more mediocre seasons piling up for Rodgers: teamwise or otherwise.

Brady is better at not taking sacks cuz he doesn’t hold onto the ball for sure. Rodgers also throws less picks because he is more careful with the ball. It’s a moot point. One guy had 25:2 td/int ratio and the other had 29:11. Going back to defense, it’s easier to take risks when you have confidence in your defense. The packers defense is clearly worse at both getting turnovers and stopping teams from scoring.

And I’m not holding Brady or Rodgers accountable for anything. I’m holding those who credit Brady for winning in a mediocre year but chastising Rodgers team for losing in a mediocre season. When Brady isn’t at his best it has minimal effect on his team’s record. When Rodgers isn’t at his best it has a big effect on his team. The patriots go in the 11-5 neighborhood with Rodgers at qb and the packers still go 6-9-1 range with Brady at qb.

But agree to disagree I suppose, don’t think anyone will try and tell you that Rodgers has had or will finish with a better career than Brady. Some people just think he is/was better just like people think lebron is better than Jordan.

 

[Bamboozled]

If you want to talk most talented/gifted, mahomes has Rodgers smoked. Obviously too early to say where he’ll stand when it’s all said and done, but as far as pure talent, he’s more athletic, quick release, accurate and he’s got a gun.

Loling at this. Great joke to end the year. If Rodgers had that cast he'd go undefeated.

 

[robertcop2]

has won 5 superbowls, which arguably should be 8....

Sorry. But its the most ludicrous argument in all of sports.

How would Brady have arguably won 8? Explain.

But yes, it’s a ridiculous comparison. Rodgers is not even close. And people forget Manning, Montana and Brees, who are all far ahead of Rodgers, and arguably ahead of Brady too.

It’s as ridiculous as comparing Lebron to the true GOAT MJ.

 

[Dizzy]

I think in the GOAT discussion, it’s not remotely close.

But in looking at what both can do on a football field, I’ve never, ever, seen Brady do the type of shit I’ve seen Rodgers do.

If I had one, in their prime, to take on my team, I’d take Rodgers 10/10.

 

[2gps125]

Tom has Gisele running his life - she is wealthier and more famous - so no way she would accept half ass from her husband. Aaron is a closeted gay guy with a troll family.

 

[XThe GreatestX]

LOL

RODGERS IS THE GREATEST!!!

 

[Lord Commander Palis]

Another year Rodgers watches a better QB (Brady) run around in the playoffs.

 

[KONG-D'SNT-TAP]

You can keep Aarons stats all you’d like I’ll take the 8 Appearances and 5 super bowl rings. Stats aren’t everything In sports like so many cling to. If that was the case the As would’ve won World Series but they don’t ever win anything.


The super bowl is the culmination of the sport and it’s driven by the QB on the field and in the locker room. He’s the head of the beast on the field. All the talent in the world
Becomes meaningless if you can’t win the dance.

Brady is the GOAT but you can keep your “stats” if you’d like.

 

[Bamboozled]

I love how this argument is Rodgers vs Brady and then people argue Tom Bradys TEAM achievements over Aaron Rodgers as an individual. Never, fucking, change.

You can keep Aarons stats all you’d like I’ll take the 8 Appearances and 5 super bowl rings. Stats aren’t everything In sports like so many cling to. If that was the case the As would’ve won World Series but they don’t ever win anything.


The super bowl is the culmination of the sport and it’s driven by the QB on the field and in the locker room. He’s the head of the beast on the field. All the talent in the world
Becomes meaningless if you can’t win the dance.

Brady is the GOAT but you can keep your “stats” if you’d like.

Bradys defenses and special teams won him his superbowls. From Ty Laws interceptions and Butler picking off Wilson all the way to Vinitiari being clutch as fuck. If you wanna give him credit vs the Falcans sure. That's the only one where he won it. He's failed every other time. He failed vs the Giants, he failed to do it vs the Eagles.

 

[Madmick]

I love how this argument is Rodgers vs Brady and then people argue Tom Bradys TEAM achievements over Aaron Rodgers as an individual. Never, fucking, change.

Bradys defenses and special teams won him his superbowls. From Ty Laws interceptions and Butler picking off Wilson all the way to Vinitiari being clutch as fuck. If you wanna give him credit vs the Falcans sure. That's the only one where he won it. He's failed every other time. He failed vs the Giants, he failed to do it vs the Eagles.

Funny how no other quarterback in the league enjoys this extraordinary 10-Super-Lottos-in-a-row probability of having all these "teams" carry them to a Super Bowl.

Just so strange how when Rodgers is poor, his team is awful, but when Brady is poor, his team wins; yet when Rodgers is excellent, his team wins because of him, but when Brady is excellent, it's because his team made him good. It's even more bizarre how Rodgers and all the rest are so consistently surrounded by weaker teams that live and die on them. Maybe their team's reflective poverty of greatness isn't a coincidence?

So tired of this shit, butthurt logic being forwarded in this thread. Show us on the doll where the Patriots visited you every night for the past 20 years.

 

[Bamboozled]

Funny how no other quarterback in the league enjoys this extraordinary 10-Super-Lottos-in-a-row probability of having all these "teams" carry them to a Super Bowl.

Just so strange how when Rodgers is poor, his team is awful, but when Brady is poor, his team wins; yet when Rodgers is excellent, his team wins because of him, but when Brady is excellent, it's because his team made him good. It's even more bizarre how Rodgers and all the rest are so consistently surrounded by weaker teams that live and die on them. Maybe their team's reflective poverty of greatness isn't a coincidence?

So tired of this shit, butthurt logic being forwarded in this thread. Show us on the doll where the Patriots visited you every night for the past 20 years.

Rodgers has tougher divisional games, has to build a team around competent divisional rivals and cant be as versatile as the Patriots.QB is overrated in the NFL and your analysis proves it. The best QB in the world cant get it done without good coaching and good scheming and talent around them.I can't remember the time Rodgers has had a top 10 defense. If you watch them play, Rodgers is clearly better than Brady. Statistically, mechanically, the eye test, whatever. You're stuck on team merits in a individual player merit discussion.

@Corona has even stated the undisputed fact that when Brady is gone it does almost nothing when it comes to win/loss impact. That means way more than any "muh superbowls" meme when Brady didn't even win his.

 

[Madmick]

Rodgers has tougher divisional games, has to build a team around competent divisional rivals and cant be as versatile as the Patriots.QB is overrated in the NFL and your analysis proves it. The best QB in the world cant get it done without good coaching and good scheming and talent around them.I can't remember the time Rodgers has had a top 10 defense. If you watch them play, Rodgers is clearly better than Brady. Statistically, mechanically, the eye test, whatever. You're stuck on team merits in a individual player merit discussion.

@Corona has even stated the undisputed fact that when Brady is gone it does almost nothing when it comes to win/loss impact. That means way more than any "muh superbowls" meme when Brady didn't even win his.

I already destroyed this division nonsense in the current NFL thread. There's no refuge in the tougher division apologism for Rodgers:

I'm saying that if the AFC East is so weak it's remarkable how many times their team is the one advancing to the Conference Championships, the Super Bowl, and the champagne room. We can talk about easy roads to the division champion seed all day, but avoiding the WC round does nothing to get you out of the divisional round (or the Conference Championships). I'm dismissing divisional parity and overall performance. I'm saying there's another way to look at this: that a division is only as "weak" as its best team.

This argument is tenable in the NBA where divisional seeding is less significant. It's a fair criticism to point out that Lebron has had a much easier road to the NBA Finals in the East, and that this has benefited his total appearances as well has his career individual postseason statistics. This shakes out because if you look at the past 16 years during his career, specifically those years where Lebron didn't himself carry his team to the Finals, the other teams in the East were getting their asses kicked, too. Notice the similarities, here.

Lebron has been to the last 8 consecutive NBA Finals, but setting aside his own less impressive record there, in the 16 years since Lebron has joined the league, there have been 7 NBA Finals that didn't involve him coming out of the weaker East. The West has gone 4-3 in those NBA FInals (they also won 4 in a row prior to that which takes us all the way back to the final Jordan championship). Now come back to what we set aside: Lebron himself is 3-6 in the Finals. So, even without admitting consideration of the West's domination in the regular season spread during this period, yes, it's fair to say the East is the JV conference, and has been for a couple of decades. They're 6-10 during his career, and they're 6-14 in the last 20 Finals. The weaker road showed its weakness when it came up against the competition. The NBA East sucks. Rubber hit the road.

Meanwhile, is that true for the AFC East in the NFL? In the same period, the past 20 years, the AFC has has gone 12-8 in the Super Bowl. So it's not the weaker conference. It has been stronger by the one-ring-to-rule-them-all metric. The AFC East has represented this stronger conference in the Super Bowl 8x out of those 20 appearances (with three divisions this is a disproportionate divisional share). The AFC East has competed for the honor of representing the AFC in the Super Bowl 14x out of those 20 years in the conference round. That means this year will be the AFC East's 15th Conference Championship appearance in the last 21 years. It has achieved this in the conference that has been turning out more overall Super Bowl winners.

So, really, who gives a shit if it's been easier for them to skip the Wild Card round? That's a flaccid naysay of Brady and Belichik. The Wild Carders have actually have done pretty well in the NFL playoffs. In the last 20 years they have made it to the Super Bowl 5x. More importantly, if that really mattered, then it's a mystery why this big-fish-in-a-small-pond effect isn't showing up on the AFC side of the playoffs for the AFC East.

From a winner takes all point of view, the AFC East has irrefutably been the best division in the best conference over the past two decades Brady has carried them.

Corona has been making the same dumb argument you're parroting less eloquently. When Rodgers wins, it's because he's great; when he loses, it's because that reality reflects a team parched without that greatness. He blames Aaron's game manager tendencies on his defense. Meanwhile, Brady doesn't lose. Nowhere is the coincidence explained why the revolving door of personnel around Brady is always mysteriously able to carry him while po' wil Aaron never has any help. Nowhere is the coincidence explained why Aaron converts so few of those years where he does get help into playoff success.

Aaron never makes anyone radically better. Aaron never gets drafted/sent a receiver that is supposed to be mediocre, or even less than that, and then makes that guy look brilliant. Meanwhile, Tom Brady is the lord of Alchemists up there in Boston turning lead into gold.

It's like those still desperately clinging to argument Kobe is better than Lebron. At least in Kobe's case he had the ring advantage despite those seasons missing the playoffs or exiting in the first round. You can make those arguments for several seasons, but after two decades, it just doesn't sell. It reminds me of the colloquialism, "If you run into an asshole in the morning, you're unlucky, because you ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day...you're the asshole."

That clarifies everything for either man. It's not a coincidence Aaron isn't Rumpelstiltskin, and it's not a coincidence that Tom Brady is playing for the AFC Conference Championship for the 13th time.

Brady >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rodgers

 

[Hollywood Jack]

If you watch Brady and Rodgers at their peak, and think Brady is somehow a better player you're just retarded.

I watched Brady and Rodgers play head to head this season and Brady went 6/6 with a TD and a perfect passer rating while Rodgers choked and went 2/7 with a 39 passer rating in the 4th quarter when the game was on the line.