Hungary's PM bans gender study at colleges saying 'people are born either male or female'

[TheGreatA]

So ban art, because it isn't science?

Is their anything in between a law that mandates gender studies, and one that bans gender studies?

Who said anything about art? If people want to express their "alternative takes" on gender, they should do so through artistic vision. Fabricating science and "academic work", through twisted and dishonest, ideologically-driven methods, is not the way to do it. It is a mockery of science.

There isn't an alternative, because cutting public funding and artificial propping up of studies that do not amount to shit, will inevitably lead to their disappearance. You will not see people taking "gender studies" in any sort of a competitive environment.

They can only exist in their current form, and any tampering with that amounts to their "banning".

People say that Orban "banned" news magazines with opposite views to his, but in reality he just cut the artificial money flow to them, and it turns out that nobody was buying those papers, so they were forced to shut down.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Who said anything about art? If people want to express their "alternative takes" on gender, they should do so through artistic vision. Fabricating science and "academic work", through twisted and dishonest, ideologically-driven methods, is not the way to do it. It is a mockery of science.

There isn't an alternative, because cutting public funding and artificial propping up of studies that do not amount to shit, will inevitably lead to their disappearance. You will not see people taking "gender studies" in any sort of a competitive environment.

They can only exist in their current form, and any tampering with that amounts to their "banning".

So, just to be clear. You are for banning gender studies in universities?

 

[IDL]

Who said anything about art? If people want to express their "alternative takes" on gender, they should do so through artistic vision. Fabricating science and "academic work", through twisted and dishonest, ideologically-driven methods, is not the way to do it. It is a mockery of science.

There isn't an alternative, because cutting public funding and artificial propping up of studies that do not amount to shit, will inevitably lead to their disappearance. You will not see people taking "gender studies" in any sort of a competitive environment.

They can only exist in their current form, and any tampering with that amounts to their "banning".

People say that Orban "banned" news magazines with opposite views to his, but in reality he just cut the artificial money flow to them, and it turns out that nobody was buying those papers, so they were forced to shut down.

This is true of all the 'SJW' (neo marxist) type ideology that is being spread through the universities. It is very artificially propped up because of how it is funded and supported by governments and other big players.

It is sort of like having communism taught in the soviet union. It's more to do with indoctrination as part of policy to engineer society and on it's own it wouldn't last without the constant life support. It can't stand up by itself.

 

[TheGreatA]

So, just to be clear. You are for banning gender studies in universities?

I think there ought to be a serious review done, to see whether there is any scientific worth to these sorts of studies, or whether they are simply a waste of time, money and effort for the individuals involved, leaving them even less equipped for achieving something in the field of science, or even holding a job.

I do not see an outright ban as necessary, I believe that these sorts of things will implode on their own, when subject to scrutiny. Something that they aren't subjected to, right now, because of the power held by the LGBT lobby, and the difficulty in criticizing anything involved with it.

 

[TheGreatA]

This is true of all the 'SJW' (neo marxist) type ideology that is being spread through the universities. It is very artificially propped up because of how it is funded and supported by governments and other big players.

It is sort of like having communism taught in the soviet union. It's more to do with indoctrination as part of policy to engineer society and on it's own it wouldn't last without the constant life support. It can't stand up by itself.

My mother, as a child, was actually a part of one of these "alternative history" experiments that was done here in Finland, to prop up Communism and the Soviet Union, driven by some left-wing ideologues at the time, who wanted to present USSR as a model state.

We purged that shit then, we shouldn't necessarily have a problem with purging this shit right now.

These sorts of things cannot stand on their own because they rely on false premises.

 

[VivaRevolution]

This is true of all the 'SJW' (neo marxist) type ideology that is being spread through the universities. It is very artificially propped up because of how it is funded and supported by governments and other big players.

It's more to do with indoctrination as part of policy to engineer society and on its own it wouldn't last without the constant life support. It can't stand up by itself.

So, out of curiosity, when you read that college universities were infaltrated by the FBI and CIA in the 60's and 70's after the Vietnam protests, that the motivation was to turn people into marxists, and not to prevent protest movements against our foreign policy?

 

[VivaRevolution]

I think there ought to be a serious review done, to see whether there is any scientific worth to these sorts of studies, or whether they are simply a waste of time, money and effort for the individuals involved, leaving them even less equipped for achieving something in the field of science, or even holding a job.

I do not see an outright ban as necessary, I believe that these sorts of things will implode on their own, when subject to scrutiny. Something that they aren't subjected to, right now, because of the power held by the LGBT lobby, and the difficulty in criticizing anything involved with it.

Cutting off funding is a far cry from banning something.

I don't care if someone wants to cut funding to it.

I care about all forms of censorship.

 

[TheGreatA]

Cutting off funding is a far cry from banning something.

I don't care if someone wants to cut funding to it.

I care about all forms of censorship.

If you cut the funding, you are "banning" it. That is literally all Orban did, he dropped gender studies from a list entitling programs to financial support, yet he is regarded by the international media as "banning" gender studies, the same way he "banned" some bullshit magazines that were funded by NGO money, which nobody was reading, after he imposed restrictions on the money flow from foreign organizations.

At the end of the day, by subjecting such things to capitalist competition, you are in a sense "banning" newspapers and "sciences" that cannot uphold themselves in fair market competition, and which can only stand up when propped up artificially with foreign or government money.

 

[IDL]

So, out of curiosity, when you read that college universities were infaltrated by the FBI and CIA in the 60's and 70's after the Vietnam protests, that the motivation was to turn people into marxists, and not to prevent protest movements against our foreign policy?

I highly doubt it was to turn people into Marxists. There is a geopolitical game that goes on with players trying to subvert universities (among other things) to destabilize and weaken the society of the target, and also to defend against it. So there is more than one 'side' these things. It gets messy because there are players on both sides within the US (it isn't simply a foreign nation doing the subversion. It's more international and oligarchical than that).

I have to assume what you are referring to would either be counter-subversion, or would be unrelated and just the government trying to put the lid on a pressure buildup. Probably both.

In this Hungarian example I would place my bet on it being counter-subversion from the perspective of the government.

 

[VivaRevolution]

If you cut the funding, you are "banning" it. That is literally all Orban did, he dropped gender studies from a list entitling programs to financial support, yet he is regarded by the international media as "banning" gender studies, the same way he "banned" some bullshit magazines that were funded by NGO money, which nobody was reading, after he imposed restrictions on the money flow from foreign organizations.

At the end of the day, by subjecting such things to capitalist competition, you are in a sense "banning" newspapers and "sciences" that cannot uphold themselves in fair market competition, and which can only stand up when propped up artificially with foreign or government money.

Source?

I'm not calling BS, but I'm also not taking your word for it.

 

[TheGreatA]

Source?

I'm not calling BS, but I'm also not taking your word for it.

That is literally what the news is about.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-h...-gender-studies-courses-pm-aide-idUKKBN1KZ1LU

https://thehill.com/policy/internat...bans-gender-studies-an-ideology-not-a-science

There are 44 people enrolled to the program (many of which will continue their courses in America). This is not really a huge deal.

 

[SRN]

LOL What's the difference between Neutrois, Genderless and Gendervoid? Being butch is a gender now? FFS

These people are making a mockery of actual trans people that suffer from something that is very real and we know very little about. All of the other "genders" are either non-sense or someone's personality like that ridiculous Demigirl thing which is basically the definition of a tomboy. Ridiculous.

 

[Scheme]

Hungary is #4 in golds and #1 in total medals in the international math olympics (behind China, USA and Russia) with a population of 10 million people.

Is it chance that such a logical nation would oppose new wave gender theory?

 

[IDL]

Hungary is #4 in golds and #1 in total medals in the international math olympics (behind China, USA and Russia) with a population of 10 million people.

Is it chance that such a logical nation would oppose new wave gender theory?

Their math is at a high enough level that they aren't quite convinced that 2+2=5 yet

 

[VivaRevolution]

That is literally what the news is about.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-h...-gender-studies-courses-pm-aide-idUKKBN1KZ1LU

https://thehill.com/policy/internat...bans-gender-studies-an-ideology-not-a-science

There are 44 people enrolled to the program (many of which will continue their courses in America). This is not really a huge deal.

Fuck CNN sucks. I thought it was TS that said ban, but nope, Fucking shitbirds at CNN.

 

[Bald1]

Cutting off funding is a far cry from banning something.

I don't care if someone wants to cut funding to it.

I care about all forms of censorship.

Dude, that's exactly what happened here. Defunded, not banned.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Dude, that's exactly what happened here. Defunded, not banned.

And also the programs lost accreditation, don't forget that part. Still not banned in a sense but effectively banned as a recognized field of study.

 

[Squarechoke]

Hungary is #4 in golds and #1 in total medals in the international math olympics (behind China, USA and Russia) with a population of 10 million people.

Is it chance that such a logical nation would oppose new wave gender theory?

Their glory days were in the 60s and 70s though. If they had kept it up they might have been able to use it to do OK financially, instead of being one of the biggest charity cases of the EU.

 

[Bald1]

And also the programs lost accreditation, don't forget that part. Still not banned in a sense but effectively banned as a recognized field of study.

To me "banned" means illegal, not without funding. If the story was about folks being jailed or fined for their chosen field of study I'd be up in arms. As they can take online courses and be recognized for it at foreign institution I'm less inclined to worry. Ymmv..

 

[Islam Imamate]

To me "banned" means illegal, not without funding. If the story was about folks being jailed or fined for their chosen field of study I'd be up in arms. As they can take online courses and be recognized for it at foreign institution I'm less inclined to worry. Ymmv..

They're not recognized for it in Hungary though, hence its effectively banned as a legitimate form of study in Hungary. And what's the rationalization? Some politicized hot take by the PM that's clearly just red meat for his base? Yeah let's trust partisan politics to decide what is and isn't accredited, great idea.