How 'WWE' (pre-planned) are the UFC champions? Ferg no shot with 12w, Chandler with 1

[g*r*b]

Neither did Chandler.

I didn't say Chandler was champ at the time he defected from Bellator to join the UFC. I said "former champ", I didn't specify how far former.

 

[drbolony]

I didn't say Chandler was champ at the time he defected from Bellator to join the UFC. I said "former champ", I didn't specify how far former.

Lol OK, that's how it works

 

[BobsyaUncle]

This thread is lacking so much context.

 

[immyaxl]

It's not comparable to Pro Wrestling lol

Chandler was deserving of the shot, it could've gone to someone else, but there wasn't another obvious contender with Dustin fighting Conor

It's definitely comparable to pro wrestling. Exact same business model. Chandler was in the right place right time and he's still a top 10 level fighter so I didn't have a problem with it.

 

[2004 account]

It's been getting worse lately with these unwarranted title shots, punctuated with Jorge getting an immediate rematch after losing a lopsided first fight. At least we got a nice KO out of it

Fedor esque finish similar to what he did to Brett Rogers

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

So Ferguson pointed that a 12 fight win streak never earned him a title shot, but Chandler got one after one UFC win

Nonsense. Ferguson's streak did earn him a title shot. It earned him several.

 

[Herwald]

Tony's situation is more complicated. He wasn't very active on paper. He fought in November 2016, for example - shortly before the Conor's MSG LW win - and proceeded to bitch about Conor's inactivity while he himself did nothing for a whole year. His fault. Then he was granted an interim title fight, won, but had injury set backs combined with Khabib fights continuing to fall through. No one's fault. And then he lost to Gaethje when it mattered the most. There was a belt on the line with guarantees and everything, but he lost.

Meanwhile, Chandler showed up down for whatever. Super agreeable, down to promote and easy to do business with. When Gaethje fought Khabib, Chandler was down to be a replacement - Tony declined. Then Chandler agreed to take on anyone on the Conor/Doostin 2 card. He won. UFC then jerked the title picture guys around, pitting them against each other in terms of money - Chandler had no issues with that, was down for whatever. So they gave it to him.

Chandler just kind of put the right amount of work in and showed up at the right place at the right time. Seriously, Tony was on a losing streak, Doostin/Conor 3 booked, Khabib gone, Gaethje coming off a loss - add in him being game for anything UFC suggested - it was the perfect shortcut.

This myth that Tony was never given any chances when he literally fought for 2 different interim titles and scheduled for 2 others vs Khabib during his streak is a very inaccurate statement. There are a ton of guys streaking at LW - how many shots at anything have they gotten? Dariush is on a 7 fight win streak, same with Islam Mak; Ferreira was on a 6 fight streak, but had to fight Beneil; Gillespie was 13-0 before Kevin Lee - now 14-1 - you think he's getting anything soon? Any of these guys? Look at Gaethje - dude loses to a guy who everyone loses to and suddenly Justin's yesterdays news. RDA, the former champ, comes back strongly to LW - with one of the best LW resumes and a loss to Khabib before fast food even existed - people shit on him. Oliveira himself had to go on an 8 fight win streak and have the top guys leave or fight each other to get this opportunity. It's just a tough division for everyone.

 

[immyaxl]

Its sports entertainment so naturally if you can but bums on seats you will have an advantage.

Not sure what that has to do with scripted WWE?

If UFC was scripted / fixed, pretty sure we wouldn't see Dana look pissed off so often when his boys get finished.

The only difference is the fights aren't scripted. Although there's been a few fights over the years I've thought were suspect. Everything else promotion wise is the same. The one sided contracts, no co-promotion, burying talent that has fallen out of favor.

 

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

Let's not pretend that the matchmaking and title shot choosing/rankings of the UFC is in anyway fair or representative of a proper sport.

no one does.

as in, literally no one who follows this sport is under that misconception.

that being said, oversimplifications like "like OMG Tony 12-0 no title shot Chandler 1-0 title shot" isn't doing anyone any good either. There is such thing as context. Like Tony was an interim champ, Conor bottlenecked the division (which actually helps prove your point not diminish it), etc. I'm not accusing you of making that statement, just using it as an example. Cheers.

 

[sapporo ichiban]

Bisping was a top 10 gatekeeper and never an elite champion level fighter.
He had already lost to Rockhold a year and half earlier so it makes even less sense.
GSP was a money fight but just shows the point of two underserving fighters being there to begin with.
And I am not against money fights, it was nice to see GSP challenge himself. But when the division itself and champion is based on the same principle the whole thing has to be looked at differently.

People on here think they are watching some kind of legit sport with rankings, the discussion about who should fight who and all the trash talk between fighters and drama is altogther far closer to pro wrestling than people want to realize and is largely orchestrated in advance.

-"We want the fans talking about this fight in one year between these two."

-"Sure, will be arranged"


When you have some kind of pink leprechaun doing a dance in your av, is it possible to take you seriously?

Mousasi is one clear example but the same is true across the divisions if you look at it.

No doubt that at times there are match ups that make less sense than others if we are talking pure integrity of ranking systems. Some fighters do have a far harder road to the title shot than others, I will not dispute that at all. I was only suggesting that Bisping was not a bum off the street. As you just said, he was a top ten gate keeper, I would expand that statement by saying he was in that position for many years.
Top ten gate keeper is still top 10 of the very best people in that weight class. He was not actually ranked 10 but held a few different rankings within the top 10, also, a gate keeper at the elite level can still win and knock out the champion which he legitimately did. GSP gets to cherry pick a bit being that he is the greatest ww of all time and there was not really anything else going on at the time. People can argue either way about timing and intentions but that is nothing more than debate.

Champions can draw from the top 10 to defend based on availability and what the company wants within reason to be legitimate in my opinion. I do have some complaints but for the most part, given the circumstances at the time, Bisping was not one of those for me.