How good is Tito's record and resume really?

If you think that because you're older me that it somehow vindicates your opinions and makes them facts, it doesn't impress me lol.

Who on that record outside of Saku, Hendo and Cro Cop were elite fighters? I was under the impression that you don't really become an elite fighter unless you beat some elite fighters, and I don't see many elite fighters mate.

Henderson was a wrestler but he didn't have much striking did he? It's MMA after all, Cejudo didn't look like the finished article with Olympic level wrestling did he? Jones is nowhere near the level of Henderson in the wrestling world but he handled him fine in a grappling match. More to wrestling than just credentials, you need some element to mix it up. Henderson was a whole lot less explosive than Tito too, and didn't seem as juicy to me :)

You follow up the point that Tito took him down at will, Henderson couldn't. What are you attempting to insinuate? That Tito was better than Hendo? Really bro? We really going in that direction? and if so, then if anything it proves my point that actual MMA experience matters. Tito knew how to kick, to punch, the ground and pound element of the game, knew BJJ. Henderson knew nothing and probably didn't learn all that much in 3 years, it takes time, practice in the real world.

Wand in my opinion was in glorified street fights in Brasil and other bingo halls prior to the UFC. He might be the tougher SOB, he may have known how to eat shots, take damage and was ready for the battle, but technique wise he was behind others for a while. It wasn't until PRIDE that he showed somewhat of a diversified game, alongside the beserker approach.

I respect your opinion bro, not arguing at all, but I just think you're wrong here. Tito was a product of his era, he'll retire being a little overrated in my opinion.
You just said tito was JUST a wrestler 2 post ago , so what is it ? Can he the total package now or just a wrestler like hendo ...

No I'm not saying because I am older it's because I loved it and watched it and I do not have to look at fight finder at names and be all like all those guys are cans because they were not at all .

sakuraba is the main example he beat rampage and lots of guys and in that first wand fight nobody knew what was gonna happen ..

it seems you are shitting on hendo and wand now too even more so than Tito. . Just stop talking about a time you don't know much about and talk about the Conors and max holloways that's your generation ....

and in 12 years when someone tells you max holloway fought shitty fighters you can do what I'm doing now ...
 
Ya different era with shitty comp. Lost to a middleweight Shamrock.

Yeah... Overall comp wasn’t as stiff..

Frank was pretty ahead of the game back then and a naturally skilled fighter...

Tito was good at the time, but still pretty much an athletic wrestler that was hard to tap... Not that Tito ever developed into a GSP type mma fighter... But his “mma striking” offensive and defensive got much better as did his offensive submission wrestling/

Chuck got tapped by a MW Jeremy Horn... Actually put to sleep... shit happens..

But again, I agree - The comp was different no doubt..
 
Look I cant stand Tito but hes had a good career and on paper, hes put a lot of top guys in the coffin.
 
From 1999-2005ish he was among the best at his weight division. I don't think there was a time period where was ever considered #1, and his resume reflects that.
That's about it. He has some good wins in there.
 
Lol you count that a win? What happened twice when they fought in their prime? Chuck looked 60 and mentally slow in that fight

Chuck looked the same as always in that fight. Tito was finally healthy and proved he was better.
 
Wanderlei didn't look very elite when he got smoked in like 50 seconds by a novice in Belfort, did he? Was he elite then? Was it a fluke? Was Belfort also elite with like 6 fights? Wanderlei took a while to really get going in terms of resume. If you grabbed Wanderlei's record midway through his PRIDE tenure it would look like this.

Win 23–3–1 (1) Hidehiko Yoshida
Win 22–3–1 (1) Kazushi Sakuraba
Win 21–3–1 (1) Hiromitsu Kanehara
Win 20–3–1 (1) Tatsuya Iwasaki
Draw 19–3–1 (1) Mirko Cro Cop
Win 19–3 (1) Kiyoshi Tamura
Win 18–3 (1) Alexander Otsuka
Win 17–3 (1) Kazushi Sakuraba
Win 16–3 (1) Shungo Oyama
Win 15–3 (1) Kazushi Sakuraba
Win 14–3 (1) Dan Henderson
Win 13–3 Guy Mezger
Win 12–3 Todd Medina
Win 11–2 Bob Schrijber
Win 10–2 Daijiro Matsui
Win 9–2 Carl Malenko
Win 8–2 Tony Petarra
Win 7–2 Eugene Jackson
Win 6–2 Adrian Serrano
Win 5–1 Mike van Arsdale
Win 4–0 Egidio da Costa
Win 3–0 Sean Bormet
Win 2–0 Marcelao Barbosa
Win 1–0 Dilson Filho

23-3-1 (1) - is a fantastic record to look at, but 90% of these guys are "who da fook is that guy" worthy.

In the space of 2 and a half years Wand fought Saku 3 times, he smashed him half to death in all 3 fights. What type of ridiculous matchmaking results in you getting him 3 times in 2 years, Saku is a legend, but he was also somewhat of a human punching bag who belonged at 170lbs.

.

"90% of these guys are "who da fook is that guy" worthy."

Ya serious?

"Saku is a legend, but he was also somewhat of a human punching bag who belonged at 170lbs."

SAKU G. was still elite and not a "punchin´bag" when he faced Wand, he was even game vs HWs Crocop & Igor.

On a side note, it´s not very well-known, but Vitor Gracie was actually cryin´ b4 the fight, backstage, and Carlson had to
snake.gif

Wand´s reputation was legit by then.
 
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