How good is Tito's record and resume really?

TysonandKhabib said:
Sure Bro...
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Hypnotizing...thx
 
He was never the best (Randy and Chuck showed that) but he was quite good. He beat young versions of Wand and Vitor, and some other good fighters. He arguably beat and outwrestled and up-and-coming Rashad Evans in their first fight. And while the Bader win was kind of a late career Matt Serra moment, he still gets credit. Not a GOAT but a pioneer and legend, and he's had pretty good longevity. I thought he should've retired after losing to Matt Hamill, but he went on to beat Bader, Sonnen and manlet WW/MW Schlemenko after that, so maybe not. He had an interesting career with a lot of ups and downs.
 
Don't be disrespectful.
He made the UFC interesting when it was wasting away. And he is legit.
Guy has spent his life in the gym.
You probably know nothing about that life.
 
No one who was following mma back then can't deny the impact of Ortiz in the game. He literally was the face of American mma until Wanderlei took the game by storm...
but long story short Ortiz was a beast and one of the very first mma superstar.
 
TheMaster said:
So really, how good is Titos record and resume?
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His best years were over 15 years ago. After that, he beat Vitor and split a couple with Forrest. And during his best years, he didn't beat anyone of Chuck's skill level, and when he did, he lost.

But he did carry the UFC on his back during the dark years. And he fought often, and battled through injuries, and is still fighting 20 years after he started.

So if you're arguing with someone who think he's a GOAT, yes you are right. But almost no one does. Most think he's not even top 10 LHW ever. So all you're really doing is agreeing with most people.

Many respect him regardless of not being a GOAT. Others think he's just a loud mouth. But no one calls him GOAT, or thinks he sucked. He was a solid fighter, and had a couple years between Frank & Chuck where he defended his belt a few times. Respect.
 
TheMaster said:
I mean, the guy is basically a heavyweight who fought smaller guys at lhw and even middleweight. You can see how huge he is next to Fedor. He was an expert weight cutter which is his success. Doubt he would have been a top 10 guy fighting his actual weight class.

So beat up smaller guys except still got spanked by 5"9 Frank Shamrock and 40 yr old Couture.
Then loved to beat up the shell of Ken but still apparently refused to fight him at hw even well past his prime.
Tapped against Chael but pulled a fast one.
Then beat up geriatric Chuck in his usual pattern.
Also got son'ed by Mitrione in a real life argument, the guy is his size and age afterall - something he never faced before.

Also there is no way in any reality that any version of Tito beats this dude in his prime at open weight.
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So really, how good is Titos record and resume?
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How is Tito a hw? Didn't miss weight weight ever, never fought hw.
 
The man is legit AF.

GOAT
 
He had a single win his last six years in the UFC. That's kind of impressive in its own right; it puts him up there with B.J. Penn.
 
Spiderbite said:
Tito is not one of the greatest anymore.

However, aside from the obvious players on the business end. Tito is pretty much responsible for you watching this sport on cable television.

The Bad Boy, but just good enough that normal people are willing to give it a watch, and also he, along with a few others pretty much set the blueprint for success in the cage.

He may not have been Wayne Gretzky or Jordan, but he was a pretty good standard bearer in retrospect.

Also, he was on the cover of MMA Video games WAY WAAAY before that shit was mainstream.

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No one is denying he was the face of the sport in the dark ages, arguably inheriting that title in a mainstream way from Ken.

But his record is what is questioned. The guy walked around in the 230-240's and had a knack of picking on smaller guys and later much older and beatup guys during his career which is what bothers me.

When he fought guys his own size, he lost.

Nonetheless his contribution as marquee face for a few years is clear but the quality of his resume is a different issue.
 
He is a true pioneer of the sport and was one of the UFC's first big stars. He is a deserving member of UFC-MMA hall of fame for sure.....and I don't even like him!:(
 
He smooshed Wanderlei before he went on his pride run. Before we get into a young Wanderlei or not. I don't think results would change if they fought in Japan barring some jenky standup by the ref. It's just the striker vs wrestler matchup. Wanderlei doesn't wrestle and he would just run out of time.
They could fight now in Bellator but I think the size difference is more pronounced now since one guy is obviously off the sauce and the other person is in "shape"
 
NoSmilez said:
He smooshed Wanderlei before he went on his pride run. Before we get into a young Wanderlei or not. I don't think results would change if they fought in Japan barring some jenky standup by the ref. It's just the striker vs wrestler matchup. Wanderlei doesn't wrestle and he would just run out of time.
They could fight now in Bellator but I think the size difference is more pronounced now since one guy is obviously off the sauce and the other person is in "shape"
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Wanderlei out grappled Hendo in their first fight.
 
Tito is the man. Like it or not he moved the sport forward and was a beast in his day.
 
Ok so he cut weight so he’s discredited? Yeah I can see that, since no other fighter cuts weight. You seem to be all in on Ken here, did you WATCH the first fight!? Ken didn’t walk into that fight washed, he walked out that way. The beating he took left him never the same.
 
His career hasn't aged well, partly because he spent a portion of it making himself look like an idiot, but in his day he was a good fighter and has several quality wins.

Tito is an easy target, again because of some (most) of the shit that comes out of his mouth, but he was the UFC's only decent draw for a considerable stretch of time.

The UFC's biggest PPV by a consoderable stretch in the pre-TUF era was Tito vs. Ken. Back in 2002-2003ish Tito was the only UFC fighter most people knew the name of.
 
TheMaster said:
No one is denying he was the face of the sport in the dark ages, arguably inheriting that title in a mainstream way from Ken.

But his record is what is questioned. The guy walked around in the 230-240's and had a knack of picking on smaller guys and later much older and beatup guys during his career which is what bothers me.

When he fought guys his own size, he lost.

Nonetheless his contribution as marquee face for a few years is clear but the quality of his resume is a different issue.
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Ya, there's something to that. Rumor has it they basically invented 205 for Tito. And he was one of if not THE first to take weight cuts seriously in this sport. Guys like Evan Tanner couldn't drop down yet.

So sometimes it weight.

But sometimes he was just a better fighter. Guys like Vitor, Matyushenko, Metzger, and W Silva were his size too.

Few are celebrating him as a GOAT. But he's definitely a legend, with all the subtlety that word brings.

PS I wish people would just forget about Tito v Shamrock II and III. They were dumb then, and dumb now. Circus matches with no historical relevance. They don't prove Tito was overrated, but they also sure as shit don't prove anything positive. Just like Chuck III.
 
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