How do you enter butterfly guard?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by EndlessCritic, Aug 5, 2016.

  1. EndlessCritic

    EndlessCritic Gold Belt

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    I have always been very confident in my basic butterfly sweep once I have grips, however I have always had a lot of trouble actually obtaining a strong butterfly guard position against anyone who doesn't suck.


    Recently, I've been having a lot of success with moving from the knee shield half guard into half butterfly, and then going to full butterfly from there. If my opponent attempts to underhook me while I have the half butterfly, I find I'm winning the battle to get to butterfly, and end up with an overhook allowing me to easily threaten sweeps.

    Anyone else use this entry, or want to share their own entry for actually attaining butterfly guard with grips?
     
  2. jack36767

    jack36767 Brown Belt

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    I use Eddie Bravo's "stomp" (I think it's called from half into butterfly. Usually straight to x
     
  3. Uchi Mata

    Uchi Mata Preaching the gospel of heel hooks and left kicks

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    A lot of handfighting. I typically enter butterfly from a Marcelo sit: back straight, hands in front of my feet, not angled to one side or the other. I don't engage with my feet (as butterfly hooks, I use them on the hips to control distance) until I have either a 2-1 or at least one underhook. Butterfly is tricky because the sweep is not the guard. If you enter into the sweeping position with your feet without good upper body control, you're going to get flattened and passed.

    I don't really like the entries from half, I found that as I got better and my opponents got better that those entries left me very vulnerable to smash passes. As a general rule, I don't want to have butterfly hooks in unless I'm sitting up.
     
  4. Rico

    Rico Franklin Platinum Member

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    I pretty much never actually "engage" my butterfly hooks until I'm actually ready to attempt a sweep. A lot of hand fighting/jockeying for some type of dominant control first. I'm also never ever flat on my back at any point.

    My game has changed quite a bit now, though. Most of the time I'm elevating a leg or their hips as a 1LX entry and either attacking the legs, going full 1lx or capitalizing on an opportunity to come up on a single.

    Butterfly is a "weird" guard as the only real time you're in the actual position, is at the point of attack of a sweep imo.
     
  5. Dogstarman

    Dogstarman Old man jiu jitsu

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    It's about getting to the position. It's an open active guard and its dependent on the distance of your opponent. You go from open guards from far out like spider guard to mid range guard like de la Riva.

    I don't actively search for it but I do recognize the distance my opponent is from me and that determines what type of guard I use. I'll use butterfly but then as my opponent tries to move away I'll switch to a more active open guard instead of fighting for dear life in keeping butterfly. I may even go to closed guard if I need. It's being active and using the proper guard for the position.
     
  6. winterbike

    winterbike Blue Belt

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    I'd help you, but I use the exact same setup :D
     
  7. fanboysareevil

    fanboysareevil Green Belt

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    One of the biggest issues I had early on in development was that the majority of rolls I did started on the knees and guard pulling was disallowed when starting standing. That made it so that when I had a real match or rolled with someone that stood up immediately I was kind of at a loss when I tried to play guard, as I became a butterfly guy pretty early. I ended getting really heavily into a 1LX and shin to shin vs standing opponents, singles and ankle picks vs conservative opponents, and single/double/bowling them over vs retreating opponents. I also developed a DLR game. What I developed isn't really important though. The issue is that you can't (well, you can, but it's way harder) sweep people who are on their feet with a regular butterfly sweep, so if you have create a game that will create a reason for them to kneel and give you way to get there. From there, there are a lot of setups. You can setup butterfly pretty well from both closed and half. You already do the way most people set it up from half it seems, so here's a video on how to set it up from closed by Saulo Ribeiro: There are definitely more entries from established clinching guards, but that should help for now.

    In terms of getting the position when they're low and you're in a disconnected seated guard, just like Uchi said, it's all about hand fighting. Marcelo Garcia is the gold standard for this for a reason, so if you're having issues with that portion of the game I highly suggest you research his stuff and maybe try out MGInaction.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2016
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  8. Ton

    Ton The master of Potato Plata

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    that was awesome. thanks.
     
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  9. Cro Cop Is Back

    Cro Cop Is Back Red Belt

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  10. EndlessCritic

    EndlessCritic Gold Belt

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    I've literally never seen that before.

    As for the Saulo entry, I feel like from an actual fight perspective perspective, if I've got double feet on hips, I'm going to be trying to return to my feet anyways, rather than re-engage.
     
  11. NoGiRonin

    NoGiRonin Orange Belt

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    There are a few ways that I go into the position.

    I'll go from half guard to butterfly.
    I'll go from half to butterfly half to butterfly.
    I'll go from from full guard to butterfly.
    And sometimes I'll just grab a double necktie and sit down into butterfly.
     
  12. GKY

    GKY Green Belt

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    Lots of good information in this thread, especially Saulo's entry. I would also mention threatening to just stand up is a good way to get into butterfly, SLX, etc. Lots of guys who pass standing are actually just disengaging instead of trying to keep you pressed into the mat. Their playing jiu jitsu because they assume you're just going to accept the role of being the bottom guy. If you just stand up or shoot a double a couple times they'll get the idea and start kneeling passing or pressuring into you when they're standing giving you the opportunity to set up various guards including butterfly.
     
  13. loyalyolayal

    loyalyolayal Steel Belt

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    This is my perspective as well. I only go for the butterfly sweep because of the opportunity presented not because I was originally doing the butterfly guard. I treat it like a transitionary position than a guard.
     
  14. Minnja

    Minnja Touch-Butt white belt Platinum Member

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    Most of the time I am in that sitting position I get thrown around like a biotch or I just abandon ship and try to get into x-guard.
     
  15. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    IMO the 'entrances' are largely a waste of time as in the real world 95% of the time you enter butterfly from sitting guard or a scramble where you achieve a good grip position first and then put in a hook to sweep off it.

    I'm honestly not sure there's ever a position where it makes much sense to 'pull butterfly' in the sense of transitioning from another guard into butterfly. You can do it, but normally butterfly is a particular mode of attacking from a situation where space already exists.

    You will still see some guys who play butterfly as a guard where they sit in it for a long time, but it's become rather rare and weird. More of a prelude to getting to your feet in MMA or self defense than a sport BJJ technique.
     
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  16. hanfeng

    hanfeng White Belt

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    unwillingly....lol unfortunately
     

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