How did PRIDE champs fighting non-title bouts work?

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by superpunch, Jan 17, 2020.

  1. superpunch

    superpunch Gold Belt

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  2. Rvd Slmr

    Rvd Slmr Silver Belt

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    Yes, Wanderlei lost a middleweight fight against Arona during the 2005 GP, and didn't lose his middleweight title.
     
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  3. GrantB13

    GrantB13 Brown Belt

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    Being eligible to lose the belt if you lose without being eligible to defend it if you won would be a shit deal.
     
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  4. superpunch

    superpunch Gold Belt

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    So what the hell do PRIDE belts and records even mean anything? So if we're being real then Wanderlei actually lost his belt and wasn't really the champion, and Fedor fought straight bums like that 0-2 pro wrestler and that huge fat black guy? ?
     
  5. Rvd Slmr

    Rvd Slmr Silver Belt

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    Non title fights are non title fights, I think it's pretty straightforward. It's just a different system that pushed top fighters to fight more often, just like fighting a bunch of cans between legit opponents did.
     
  6. AmericanMMA

    AmericanMMA Yellow Card Yellow Card

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    Thats the thread.

    Pride did that alot. The champions were active, but did not defend the titles often.
     
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  7. Hank30

    Hank30 Green Belt

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    How are you confused by non title fights? You a fucking idiot?

    Fedor fought legit contenders around twice every 3 years. Just like UFC champs do. Unlike UFC champs he would also have warm up fights in between. It sold ppv, kept talent that wanted to compete often in the ring, and if they ever lost a non title match against someone then the next fight would be a title fight against that same person. Its a really simple thing to understand but it looks like you are trying to make a stink over nothing or are too dumb for the internet.
     
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  8. BFoe

    BFoe Western States Heritage Champion Platinum Member

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    But Fedor also fought Coleman, Randleman, Nog, Cro Cop, and Hunt during that time. I do agree that it’s stupid that all of these fights weren’t defenses, and I’ve had people use the number of title defenses as an argument against Fedor being GOAT. To me, the level of competition is a valid debate, but the number of title defenses isn’t, because he won all of those fights. It wouldn’t have mattered if they were title defenses or not.
     
  9. TheChance

    TheChance Black Belt

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    Yes it was a NON-TITLE fight. I fail to see how the concept is hard to understand
     
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  10. PalmStrike

    PalmStrike Brown Belt

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    Wish I could "like" this post 100 times!
     
  11. Andre Xiong

    Andre Xiong Silver Belt Professional Fighter

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    Pride also did a lot of cross promotion fights so those also made sense to be non-title but they had stipulations like if a nonPride fighter beat a Pride champion, the rematch would be for the title. I recall that being the case in Kondo (Pancrase champ) v Wanderlei but it was a curb stomping so Kondo didn’t get to exercise his stipulation
     
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  12. Aluminati

    Aluminati Oberst der Wolgadeutschen Yellow Card

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    Marcus Aurelio beat Gomi in a nontitle fight, and lost the rematch. It has happened before.
     
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  13. HHJ

    HHJ Fedor Supremacist

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    He fought many of these in a tournament which is every 2 months in a period of 6 months. Twice in one night to win in the finals. Its probably unfair to expect someone to defend their belt that many times,so its incentives for champions to enter these tournaments. They still have value regardless of wether they win or not.

    Fedor,lord and master of everything,never lost any bouts in pride so it didnt really matter with him.
     
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  14. StantsA

    StantsA Brown Belt Platinum Member

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    <escalate99>
     
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  15. HHJ

    HHJ Fedor Supremacist

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    Gomi is a special case. He lost two non title fights (aurelio and diaz) outside of the tourney format. I suspect it's because diaz was prob not contracted for any more fights,but really I dont know. One would think that rematch would have been huge money. Guess they were protecting gomi
     
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  16. Tugboat

    Tugboat Brown Belt

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    Seems like I remember they would fight, but it wasn’t for the title. Something like that.
     
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  17. eiyuu

    eiyuu Silver Belt

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    Yes, when Takanori Gomi was LW Champ, he lost a non-title fight to Marcus Aurelio, but still retained the title.

    EDIT: Sorry, didn't see that this was posted already.
     
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  18. Goatenstein

    Goatenstein Black Belt

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    Stupid non-title fights and lack of weight classes were PRIDE's two biggest problems. RIZIN recently made the same idiotic mistake with Horiguchi's non-title fight. It was a sad reminder of the idiotic Gomi vs Aurelio non-title fight back when MMA didn't suck.
     
  19. Dorkman

    Dorkman Red Belt

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    For what it's worth beating Wanderlei in the non title tournament bout did earn Arona an actual title match. So it's not like he got nothing for it. But yeah non title fights are kind of trash. I loved the tournaments, understood why tournament bouts were non title. But it never really sat well when a champion clearly lost and retained their title of champion.
     
  20. DayV

    DayV Green Belt

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    PRIDE had 2 formal titles. Grand Prix is also world title where lineal champion enters tournament on same terms as all other participants and shares risks equaly. The new search, new proving and race for the best fighter
    begins. If divisional champion loses in Grand Prix, like Wand in 2005, altough he still keeps his divisional belt, he is not the best fighter at that time and context, winner of Grand Prix is.
    Wanderlei lost to Arona in Grand Prix 2005, he stilll had divisional belt at his house, but he lost his no. #1 place, and the winner of Grand Prix Shogun overtook him as the new no. #1.

    If Fedor lost for example to Randleman in 2004 Grand Prix, and if Nogueira won the Grand Prix, Fedor would still be divisional champion, but Nogueira would be the best and no. #1 fighter in the world at that moment.
    When Grand Prix was beeing held, the same value and focus was given to it, as to the divisional title.

    In general, fighting more often is harder, it wears the body and mind more, and you take more risk to be supprised, caught and defeated by lesser fighter.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2020

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