Holly Holm lost because she doesn't have a jab

[UL]

She doesn't have a jab

Lol

She used to be a boxer?

 

[fortheo]

Ali actually had boxing gloves though, Nate literally open hand slaps in the face.

In mma, a slap is easier on the hands than a punch, and it frustrates the fuck out of your opponent. And yes, you're right-- it's an open hand on a face. That is indeed a slap.

Notice the point of contact when it lands ideally:

It's the bottom/hard part of his palm and it serves as a perfectly acceptable check hook.

 

[Aluminati]

And that's different from Holly how exactly?

Holly has a lead left?

 

[Tormund]

And that's different from Holly how exactly?

Well she doesn't wing overhands and she doesn't block punches with her face, dumbass. Ever heard of something called lateral movement?

 

[King of Fists]

Holly has a lead left?

K...she's still a shitty boxer by men's standards.

 

[King of Fists]

Well she doesn't wing overhands and she doesn't block punches with her face, dumbass. Ever heard of something called lateral movement?

She's a shitty boxer by men's standards, deal with it white knight.

 

[Tormund]

She's a shitty boxer by men's standards, deal with it white knight.

No she isn't, by male boxing standards maybe but not my male MMA standards, most of the men don't know how to box for shit. All you have to do is land 1 combo and you'll be treated like the next Duran.

 

[Aluminati]

K...she's still a shitty boxer by men's standards.

No disagreement, just being a smartass.

 

[sgtrocknroll]

Holly is a southpaw who is used to fighting orthodox fighters, she seems to be dependent on her lead left hand and that southpaw angle where you have the foot on the outside and then pivot out to the right which is a good weapon to have when you're fighting orthodox fighters but can easily be neutralized when fighting another southpaw.

When you're fighting someone with the same stance as you are (orthodox vs orthodox, southpaw vs southpaw) the jab becomes much more important, that's why so many boxing coaches obsess about it. It's pretty much a necessary punch unless you have some flashy style like Roy Jones Jr., among other things because it helps you find range which is what Holm was unable to do during the entire fight.

Holly was unable to get the jab going and didn't feint the jab properly (her feints are horrible) in fact she didn't even try, she was trying to land some of the most telegraphed lead left hands I ever saw which was embarrassing to watch. She got countered by Valentina's right hand all the time. She's a really one dimensional boxer with exactly one good punch.

I love Holly for what she did to Ronda but people who claimed that she has "P4P" best technical boxing in MMA always seemed ridiculous to me. A 155 lbs male fighter with Holly's technique gets jabbed to death by Nate Diaz in a pure boxing match.

 

[sgtrocknroll]

Holly lost because her boxing sets up her kicks. She was afraid of the counter and let the other fighter dictate the exchanges. Hence she lost. Pretty simple. In the Rousey and Tate fights it was the other way around. Tate got lucky with the sub. Pretty simple.

 

[Polish Punisher]

No either her boxing just isnt that good or she has picked up bad habits. Its a cop out. The jab is extremely important to left handed fighters and the only time it becomes that difficult when you are fighting someone more than 2-3 inches taller then you have to get creative to get it around a taller fighters lead hand. But this is MMA whre you can parry, trap, and redirect your opponents hands.

Crocop had the same issue because he got into a mindset. counter, straight left, circle left, fire left kick. Its a great way to beat 98% of the fighters out there but the jab is still your baseline punch and can set up your entire striking game.

 

[Polish Punisher]

Slapping down your opponents lead hand then firing the jab is the perfect technique for lefties especially with MMA gloves because your opponent has less time to recover and get their hand back into defensive position. A taller lefty like Holm could use it to devestating effect considering she is 5'9 and one of the tallest in the division. Holm lost because she got countered all night by a counter hook for 5 rounds by a shorter fighter. Holm also looked slow and not very explosive with her kicks perhaps masking an injury or this being the post USADA era.

 

[King of Fists]

No she isn't, by male boxing standards maybe but not my male MMA standards, most of the men don't know how to box for shit. All you have to do is land 1 combo and you'll be treated like the next Duran.

No, she has shitty boxing by male mma standards because she is extremely deficient in speed and power. She would lose a straight boxing match to 90% of male BWs in the UFC. If you disagree you clearly haven't seen how women fare vs men in head-to-head competitions.

 

[Tormund]

No, she has shitty boxing by male mma standards because she is extremely deficient in speed and power. She would lose a straight boxing match to 90% of male BWs in the UFC. If you disagree you clearly haven't seen how women fare vs men in head-to-head competitions.

How can you say that when you've never seen 90% of the male division box? Novices like you don't understand the difference between boxing range and kickboxing range.

 

[Cro Cop Is Back]

She should have followed BJ Penn's game plan.
*jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab double jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab double jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab*

 

[King of Fists]

How can you say that when you've never seen 90% of the male division box? Novices like you don't understand the difference between boxing range and kickboxing range.

Iold @ 'novices like me'

The fact is women can't compete with men head to head in athletics, the differences are too great. It's why women Olympic sprinters get beat by HS boys, women's national soccer teams get destroyed by U-16 boys squads, the Williams sisters get shut out by some random male tennis pro smoking cigarettes, etc.

She might beat your scrub ass but she would get ktfo by any male UFC fighter, that's just how it works.

 

[Tormund]

Iold @ 'novices like me'

The fact is women can't compete with men head to head in athletics, the differences are too great. It's why women Olympic sprinters get beat by HS boys, women's national soccer teams get destroyed by U-16 boys squads, the Williams sisters get shut out by some random male tennis pro smoking cigarettes, etc.

She might beat your scrub ass but she would get ktfo by any male UFC fighter, that's just how it works.

If they went head to head as female vs. male then yes obviously she'd lose, but if you give Holms skill set to a male they instantly beat anybody on the UFC roster in boxing because the average UFC fighter throws winging overhands and has no boxing acumen whatsoever. You think I care about some internet tough guy calling me a scrub? You're probably a 300lbs neck beard.

 

[aerius]

If she wanted to play the counter-striker game, she should have really used her range over Valentina and simply kept back forcing Valentina to engage. It's potentially boring but eventually one of them gets frustrated and cracks.

She tried that, it didn't work since Valentina was still able to get in and whack her with just enough inside low kicks to force her to do something about them. Even though Shevchenko doesn't want to lead, she still can, and she has the tools to do it if she has to. She has the front leg low kicks, a crisp jab, the superman punch to low kick combo which GSP used back in the day, and a few other things that she can use to score hits from the outside to put Holm down on points, and once that happens Holly will have to respond and start leading.

 

[Hi-Tech]

Nah, Womens boxing actually has an organized amateur system unlike MMA. If Holm was a man and got put against Nate she'd embarrass him because Nate wouldn't be able to land his basic 1-2 on somebody who actually knows how to roll punches and use lateral movement and footwork, there's more to boxing than just being able to land a 1-2 while taking 3 or 4 punches in the process. If Nate fought somebody with Vals pedigree in striking he'd get his shit pushed in and probably get finished.

Landing a one-two with consistency requires a lot of boxing knowledge. Look at Klitschko and Kovalev, by your logic they're robotic one-two fighters too... It's like saying Palhares only has leg locks. When did Holly manage to land a one-two during the entire Valentina fight? She's not good at it because she doesn't even have a jab to measure distance and even if she had it doesn't look like she has the speed or the timing to follow it up with a cross. One-two is only referred to as "basic" because it's one of the first things you learn in boxing but actually landing it on a top level is a different story and requires a lot of "upgrades" in your boxing game.

Nate wouldn't be able to land his basic 1-2 on somebody who actually knows how to roll punches and use lateral movement and footwork

Holm knows how to roll with punches? Against Valentina she looked like a punching bag. I never saw her using any fight efficient lateral movement either, back-pedaling and doing a poor Ali impression is not "lateral movement", it's literally running away and she could get away with it because her opponents (Ronda) didn't know how to cover the ring/octagon efficiently and close her down. Holm doesn't have any footwork, she stood there in front of Valentina totally clueless, she didn't even try to find new angles and doesn't have the footwork to close the distance either. If Nate only has a one-two then Holm doesn't have anything because she can't even land her best punch (lead left hand) against a southpaw who knows how to counter.

I won't even talk about those air-hitting 3-4 punch combinations that only work on the mitts, find me a male boxer who's starting his offense by throwing this sort of combos without any set up whatsoever.

Nate Diaz would be landing one two at will against someone as flat footed and clueless as Holm even if you gave that person the strength of a 170lbs man.

From what I know Holm never even trained at a serious pure boxing gym but was coached by a kickboxer and MMA coach her entire career. Nate sparred with elite boxer Andre Ward, an ATG-level fighter.

If Nate fought somebody with Vals pedigree in striking he'd get his shit pushed in and probably get finished.

So now Valentina is the next "greatest technical striker" in MMA? LOL. She couldn't do anything for 2 rounds against Amanda Nunes, the same Nunes who was beaten by soccer mom Zingano who doesn't even know how to punch correctly. That entire division is a joke.

 

[King of Fists]

If they went head to head as female vs. male then yes obviously she'd lose, but if you give Holms skill set to a male they instantly beat anybody on the UFC roster in boxing because the average UFC fighter throws winging overhands and has no boxing acumen whatsoever. You think I care about some internet tough guy calling me a scrub? You're probably a 300lbs neck beard.

Now your just talking fantasy. By that logic I'm the greatest fighter in the world. Why? Because I'm smarter than Jon Jones and if you gave me all his physical attributes combined with my intelligence, I'd be unbeatable.