Holly has been fighting Pro MMA longer than Rousey?

[YaWannaGoEh]

Don't listen to the haters and trolls. Holly is more decorated in combat sports than Rousey and has been training MMA longer. They can't handle the fact that Ronda is just that good.

Shertrolls consider athletes with this combat resume and undefeated in MMA cans.


WBF Female World Light Welterweight Championship

WBF Female World Welterweight Championship

2012 Female Fighter of the Year

2012 Female Fight of the Year vs. Anne Sophie Mathis on June 15

WBAN World Welterweight Championship

WBAN World Junior Welterweight Championship

WBAN World Junior Middleweight Championship

2012 Biggest Comeback of the Year

2011 Fight of the Year vs. Anne Sophie Mathis

2010 Fighter of the Year

2009 Most Accomplished of the Year

2008 Highest Achievements of the Year

2007 Fighter of the Year

2007 Most Improved Boxer of the Year

2006 Most Improved Boxer of the Year

2005 Hottest Rising Star of the Year

2005 Upset of the Year vs. Christy Martin on September 16

WBC Female World Welterweight Championship

NABF Female Light Welterweight Championship

GBU World Welterweight Championship

WIBA World Light Welterweight Championship

WIBA World Welterweight Championship

IFBA World Welterweight Championship

IFBA World Light Middleweight Championship

2006 Fighter of the Year

WBA Female World Welterweight Championship

IBA Female World Welterweight Championship

IBA Female World Light Welterweight Championship

AwakeningFighters.com
2012 AOCA / Awakening Outstanding Contribution Award

BadLeftHook.com
2012 Female Comeback Fighter of the Year

The Ring
2006 Female Fighter of the Year
2005 Female Fighter of the Year

New Mexico Boxing
2013 Hall of Fame Inductee
2010 Fighter of the Year
2009 Fighter of the Year
2008 Fighter of the Year
2007 Fighter of the Year
2006 Fighter of the Year
2005 Fighter of the Year

Albuquerque Sports Hall of Fame
2005 Female Athlete of the Year

So what are you trying to say?

 

[Lie Detector]

Right it had nothing to do with what you said, but it makes about as much sense as what you said.

Just because Holm won a split against Pennington doesn't mean she can't beat Rousey.

So don't site the Pennington fight as some excuse to bash Holm's chances. Use better logic than Sherlogic.

Well, why don't you suggest a better alternative?

You've conveniently ignored everything I wrote herein (by saying something that had nothing to do with it, as you just admitted):

Spoiler

Fighter A vs Fighter B is being discussed.

A thread serves as an avenue to discuss the outcome.

What seems more reasonable to you?

1. Saying, as you did, Fighter A can run into anything so xyz about Fighter B means nothing

and/or

Saying, as you did, Fighter B can run into anything so abc about Fighter A means nothing

2. Finding at least some sort of pivot point that appeals to the fighters' overwhelming habits and body of work

If you select #1, then why insert yourself into a discussion about predictions? All you're doing is vacating every variable just because anything can happen.

Well, I guess if anything can happen, no one ought to ever discuss predictions again.

Whatever I wrote in there still works even considering what you said now:

I entirely recognize that SDing Pennington doesn't preclude Holm from success against Ronda. My above point still works.

If we want to insert ourselves into discussions about predictions, we already know anything can happen in MMA. It needn't be said. It governs every discourse.

Repeating that doesn't detract from anything, because as it turns out, there's nothing else to which we can appeal other than a fighter's body of work and their habits, twitches, highs and lows within that body of work. So again, if you have an alternative suggestion, I'm dying to hear it.

 

[Emjay]

Well, why don't you suggest a better alternative?

I think the better question is, why is that the best you can come up with?

 

[Lie Detector]

I think the better question is, why is that the best you can come up with?

You were dismissive of a fighter's prior performances and habits in favour of parroting "anything can happen" in a discussion about predictions.

I'm not in too bad a shape being told that by you.

Number of times you've ducked this: 2

Spoiler

Fighter A vs Fighter B is being discussed.

A thread serves as an avenue to discuss the outcome.

What seems more reasonable to you?

1. Saying, as you did, Fighter A can run into anything so xyz about Fighter B means nothing

and/or

Saying, as you did, Fighter B can run into anything so abc about Fighter A means nothing

2. Finding at least some sort of pivot point that appeals to the fighters' overwhelming habits and body of work

If you select #1, then why insert yourself into a discussion about predictions? All you're doing is vacating every variable just because anything can happen.

Well, I guess if anything can happen, no one ought to ever discuss predictions again.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Fighter A vs Fighter B is being discussed.

A thread serves as an avenue to discuss the outcome.

What seems more reasonable to you?

1. Saying, as you did, Fighter A can run into anything so xyz about Fighter B means nothing

and/or

Saying, as you did, Fighter B can run into anything so abc about Fighter A means nothing

2. Finding at least some sort of pivot point that appeals to the fighters' overwhelming habits and body of work

If you select #1, then why insert yourself into a discussion about predictions? All you're doing is vacating every variable just because anything can happen.

Well, I guess if anything can happen, no one ought to ever discuss predictions again.

You know Holly Holm throws a lot of kicks, right? So he predicted that Rousey could possibly run into one of those kicks. What exactly are you arguing against?

You compared Holm to Correia, which is a bad comparison. Correia is inferior to Holm. I think Rousey beats Holm handily, but one can at least imagine a path to success for Holm that doesn't involve Ronda spontaneously combusting.

 

[Emjay]

You were dismissive of a fighter's prior performances and habits in favour of parroting "anything can happen" in a discussion about predictions.

I'm not in too bad a shape being told that by you.

Number of times you've ducked this: 2

Spoiler

Fighter A vs Fighter B is being discussed.

A thread serves as an avenue to discuss the outcome.

What seems more reasonable to you?

1. Saying, as you did, Fighter A can run into anything so xyz about Fighter B means nothing

and/or

Saying, as you did, Fighter B can run into anything so abc about Fighter A means nothing

2. Finding at least some sort of pivot point that appeals to the fighters' overwhelming habits and body of work

If you select #1, then why insert yourself into a discussion about predictions? All you're doing is vacating every variable just because anything can happen.

Well, I guess if anything can happen, no one ought to ever discuss predictions again.

Appealing to my perceived message board ego doesn't work.

It's a fight, anything can happen. This is proven time and time again.

 

[thx113x]

It could be an interesting fight. Holm is the better striker. Ronda has more power. But I think Holm is capable of hurting her. She's been boxing a long time if Ronda gets reckless charging in throwing sloppy punches she could get caught flush on the chin.

If Holm gets taken down she needs to defend and survive the initial offense. Especially in the 1st round. If she can do that she can make this a fight and start to pick her apart. We've never really seen Ronda go into deep waters. I think it would be smart to get her to those championship rounds and see how her conditioning holds up.

I think Holm can win a decision. The fans won't like it but it could happen. Of course I would bet on Ronda, she's more well rounded and has more ways to win. But I am excited about this fight.

 

[LayonJesus]

And she has been in fight sports for about as long as Ronda has been doing Judo.

3 less pro MMA fight, 40 or so more boxing matches- so while Ronda has been working on her striking for the last 4 or so years, Holly has been working on her grappling.

Jackson-Winklejohn train also.

It is a miss match but people should stop acting like Holly is just some James Toney vs Randy type fight.

Only the sherdog idiots are saying anything of the sort.

Holm is the best fighter Ronda has fought and that is a fact.

If Ronda beats here great but to act like Holly Holm is worse then Zingano is just laughable.

Holly Holm was beating woman up before Zingano even knew what WMMA was. She was beating woman up before Tate got those breast implants and had her ass kicked by Ronda twice.

Holm for sure was beating woman up before that woman with 3 years of training got a title shot.

The fact people even try to hate on Holm and this fight is the single most laughable thing Sherdog has done this year.

You have the best striker in WMMA history against the best grappler in WMMA history and people are bitching and want some mediocre wrestler who cant punch and had her armed ripped of instead.

Bunch of fucking idiots.

 

[LayonJesus]

It could be an interesting fight. Holm is the better striker. Ronda has more power. But I think Holm is capable of hurting her. She's been boxing a long time if Ronda gets reckless charging in throwing sloppy punches she could get caught flush on the chin.

If Holm gets taken down she needs to defend and survive the initial offense. Especially in the 1st round. If she can do that she can make this a fight and start to pick her apart. We've never really seen Ronda go into deep waters. I think it would be smart to get her to those championship rounds and see how her conditioning holds up.

I think Holm can win a decision. The fans won't like it but it could happen. Of course I would bet on Ronda, she's more well rounded and has more ways to win. But I am excited about this fight.

Both fights in the UFC Holm has been fighting like she will be facing Ronda. Not a big surprise that Jackson thinks ahead.

 

[ThePatriot]

And she has been in fight sports for about as long as Ronda has been doing Judo.

3 less pro MMA fight, 40 or so more boxing matches- so while Ronda has been working on her striking for the last 4 or so years, Holly has been working on her grappling.

Jackson-Winklejohn train also.

It is a miss match but people should stop acting like Holly is just some James Toney vs Randy type fight.

it won't be toney vs randy, randy actually had to respect parts of toney's game, he wanted none of that stand up

rhonda isn't going to give a **** she beats her everywhere

 

[Lie Detector]

You know Holly Holm throws a lot of kicks, right?

Sure. Meek and feeble it seems but sure.

So he predicted that Rousey could possibly run into one of those kicks.

He didn't predict it, but he said she could, yes - which I totally accept. As well as accepting that SDing Pennington or her lackadaisical performance against another gal doesn't mean she can't have success against Ronda.

What exactly are you arguing against?

That "anything can happen" adds nothing to a discussion about predictions. That it's a given. That inserting oneself into a discussion about that ought to involve appealing to something more than the obvious and that marking a red flag on a fighter's history to gauge and convey their chances against someone else is perfectly acceptable even though it's not exhaustive.

You compared Holm to Correia, which is a bad comparison. Correia is inferior to Holm. I think Rousey beats Holm handily, but one can at least imagine a path to success for Holm that doesn't involve Ronda spontaneously combusting.

See? Nothing you've expressed is incompatible with what I said about weighing probabilities. Even if you disagree about how big a chance there is for something and how inferior someone is to another, we're at least looking at the same thing but arriving at a different conclusion, right? We're looking at a fighter's body of work and assessing their performances. Saying "anything can happen" when someone's looking there adds nothing.

 

[LayonJesus]

Only the sherdog idiots are saying anything of the sort.

Holm is the best fighter Ronda has fought and that is a fact.

If Ronda beats here great but to act like Holly Holm is worse then Zingano is just laughable.

Holly Holm was beating woman up before Zingano even knew what WMMA was. She was beating woman up before Tate got those breast implants and had her ass kicked by Ronda twice.

Holm for sure was beating woman up before that woman with 3 years of training got a title shot.

The fact people even try to hate on Holm and this fight is the single most laughable thing Sherdog has done this year.

You have the best striker in WMMA history against the best grappler in WMMA history and people are bitching and want some mediocre wrestler who cant punch and had her armed ripped of instead.

Bunch of fucking idiots.

 

[cade187]

Welp, someone just finished their intro to logic course.

 

[jamiehunter]

Don't listen to the haters and trolls. Holly is more decorated in combat sports than Rousey and has been training MMA longer. They can't handle the fact that Ronda is just that good.

Shertrolls consider athletes with this combat resume and undefeated in MMA cans.


WBF Female World Light Welterweight Championship

WBF Female World Welterweight Championship

2012 Female Fighter of the Year

2012 Female Fight of the Year vs. Anne Sophie Mathis on June 15

WBAN World Welterweight Championship

WBAN World Junior Welterweight Championship

WBAN World Junior Middleweight Championship

2012 Biggest Comeback of the Year

2011 Fight of the Year vs. Anne Sophie Mathis

2010 Fighter of the Year

2009 Most Accomplished of the Year

2008 Highest Achievements of the Year

2007 Fighter of the Year

2007 Most Improved Boxer of the Year

2006 Most Improved Boxer of the Year

2005 Hottest Rising Star of the Year

2005 Upset of the Year vs. Christy Martin on September 16

WBC Female World Welterweight Championship

NABF Female Light Welterweight Championship

GBU World Welterweight Championship

WIBA World Light Welterweight Championship

WIBA World Welterweight Championship

IFBA World Welterweight Championship

IFBA World Light Middleweight Championship

2006 Fighter of the Year

WBA Female World Welterweight Championship

IBA Female World Welterweight Championship

IBA Female World Light Welterweight Championship

AwakeningFighters.com
2012 AOCA / Awakening Outstanding Contribution Award

BadLeftHook.com
2012 Female Comeback Fighter of the Year

The Ring
2006 Female Fighter of the Year
2005 Female Fighter of the Year

New Mexico Boxing
2013 Hall of Fame Inductee
2010 Fighter of the Year
2009 Fighter of the Year
2008 Fighter of the Year
2007 Fighter of the Year
2006 Fighter of the Year
2005 Fighter of the Year

Albuquerque Sports Hall of Fame
2005 Female Athlete of the Year

Holly's a very accomplished boxer. I don't think there's any denying that. With that being said, I firmly believe Ronda's judo credentials are far more impressive than Holly's boxing credentials. Holly may technically have more accolades (world championships and such) but I think women's judo is more developed and Ronda faced a higher level of competition.

TL,DR: I don't think women's pro boxing is on the same level as women's international judo.

 

[Luvhawky]

I don't know if I have ever seen anyone owned as bad as Emjay was by Lie Detector

 

[NinjaNiK]

And she has been in fight sports for about as long as Ronda has been doing Judo.

3 less pro MMA fight, 40 or so more boxing matches- so while Ronda has been working on her striking for the last 4 or so years, Holly has been working on her grappling.

Jackson-Winklejohn train also.

It is a miss match but people should stop acting like Holly is just some James Toney vs Randy type fight.

100% agree, the ole "she used to be an accountant" shit is not gonna fly here. Besides, she has 4 months to work on sumthin.

 

[lsa]

I find it a bit funny that when HH was fighting outside the UFC people claimed she would beat Ronda and that UFC was protecting Ronda from Holly.
Holly gets signed by the UFC and are no facing Ronda, which makes her a can or with out any chance.

To my knowledge Holly has been with Jackson /Winklejohn since the age o 16 she turned pro in mma approx the same time Ronda.

 

[Paradigm]

Don't listen to the haters and trolls. Holly is more decorated in combat sports than Rousey and has been training MMA longer. They can't handle the fact that Ronda is just that good.

Shertrolls consider athletes with this combat resume and undefeated in MMA cans.


WBF Female World Light Welterweight Championship

WBF Female World Welterweight Championship

2012 Female Fighter of the Year

2012 Female Fight of the Year vs. Anne Sophie Mathis on June 15

WBAN World Welterweight Championship

WBAN World Junior Welterweight Championship

WBAN World Junior Middleweight Championship

2012 Biggest Comeback of the Year

2011 Fight of the Year vs. Anne Sophie Mathis

2010 Fighter of the Year

2009 Most Accomplished of the Year

2008 Highest Achievements of the Year

2007 Fighter of the Year

2007 Most Improved Boxer of the Year

2006 Most Improved Boxer of the Year

2005 Hottest Rising Star of the Year

2005 Upset of the Year vs. Christy Martin on September 16

WBC Female World Welterweight Championship

NABF Female Light Welterweight Championship

GBU World Welterweight Championship

WIBA World Light Welterweight Championship

WIBA World Welterweight Championship

IFBA World Welterweight Championship

IFBA World Light Middleweight Championship

2006 Fighter of the Year

WBA Female World Welterweight Championship

IBA Female World Welterweight Championship

IBA Female World Light Welterweight Championship

AwakeningFighters.com
2012 AOCA / Awakening Outstanding Contribution Award

BadLeftHook.com
2012 Female Comeback Fighter of the Year

The Ring
2006 Female Fighter of the Year
2005 Female Fighter of the Year

New Mexico Boxing
2013 Hall of Fame Inductee
2010 Fighter of the Year
2009 Fighter of the Year
2008 Fighter of the Year
2007 Fighter of the Year
2006 Fighter of the Year
2005 Fighter of the Year

Albuquerque Sports Hall of Fame
2005 Female Athlete of the Year

i get it...shes a boxer with excellent credentials but really more of a kickboxer. have only seen her UFC fights and that gif but if thats how she fights all the time and hasnt improved much since then, im not seeing much to indicate that shes got anything for Ronda besides the LHK. sure, the hands will be there but it doesnt look like she goes for power...more volume (like Bisping). i mean, Pennington actually outstruck her by the numbers:

Total Strikes
51/150 34% Pennington
48/214 22% Holm

Significant Strikes
40/139 28% Pennington
44/210 20% Holm

Holm's striking was far more polished obviously but if someone like Pennington can touch her, Ronda surely can. Ronda has shown that she's decently durable...she usually takes some punches to the face to get into the clinch and Holm hasnt shown that she wants to throw hands with bad intentions.

to be honest, i dont remember much of the Reneau fight but i remember watching it and thinking later that not much of anything happened in it. something something Reneau not getting inside whatsoever.

and this is from someone who wants Ronda to lose. Holly Holm isnt the one to do it though.

You have the best striker in WMMA history against the best grappler in WMMA history and people are bitching and want some mediocre wrestler who cant punch and had her armed ripped of instead.

Bunch of fucking idiots.

striker with the best credentials...not necessarily the best WMMA striker. ive only seen their UFC fights but i think Joanna J is the better/more effective MMA striker. maybe not cleaner than Holm but she's got killer instinct and has no issue with wrecking girls inside with elbows and knees. generally seems to go for speed and volume as well but she is downright vicious with standing elbows. good TDD, angles and is liberal with shots to the body. kinda like Chuck in the sense that she is good at getting back to her feet and throws overhand rights haha. shit...shes a better striker than a lot of guys in MMA.

outstruck Lima and Gadelha.

landed multiple elbows on the numerous sprawls she had against Esparza. generally tooled her on the feet.

and then Penne:

when Holm starts having fights like that, let me know. not gonna happen against Ronda, so maybe against whomever she fights after that.

either way...Holm let Pennington clinch with her at least four times. if that was Ronda, she would have been going for a ride (and probably losing her arm shortly after).

then again, Carmouche actually took Ronda's back and cranked her face pretty hard so anything is possible.

 

[moreorless87]

And she has been in fight sports for about as long as Ronda has been doing Judo.

3 less pro MMA fight, 40 or so more boxing matches- so while Ronda has been working on her striking for the last 4 or so years, Holly has been working on her grappling.

Jackson-Winklejohn train also.

It is a miss match but people should stop acting like Holly is just some James Toney vs Randy type fight.

Unfortunately the sports she's been fighting in have a vastly smaller talent pool than womens fightsport Judo so success in them demonstrates a much lower level of skill.

People need to stop viewing the womens talent pool as beign identical to the mens, in womens sports Judo is the 400lb gorilla in the room whilst things like boxing and wrestling are tiny minority sports.

 

[mindturking]

I find it a bit funny that when HH was fighting outside the UFC people claimed she would beat Ronda and that UFC was protecting Ronda from Holly.
Holly gets signed by the UFC and are no facing Ronda, which makes her a can or with out any chance.

To my knowledge Holly has been with Jackson /Winklejohn since the age o 16 she turned pro in mma approx the same time Ronda.

We got it the first time you posted this exact same thing in another thread