History of the guard

pa33

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Hi,

I'm curious if anyone knows the history of the closed guard. I heard from some sources that it was primarily Helio Gracie who invented it, but in the early UFCs, Taktarov used it too and he was a sambo guy. Did sambo develop the guard independently or did they borrow it from the Gracies or what?
 
I think the guard originated in Judo but the Gracies developed it and took it to a completely new level.
 
japanese jiu jitsu im guessing. if not then judo either one.

no helio did not invent it.
 
Helio did not invent the closed guard but Eddie Bravo did invent the rubber guard
 
Hi,

I'm curious if anyone knows the history of the closed guard. I heard from some sources that it was primarily Helio Gracie who invented it, but in the early UFCs, Taktarov used it too and he was a sambo guy. Did sambo develop the guard independently or did they borrow it from the Gracies or what?

if you look closely oleg had a very sloppy and open "closed guard" he really wasn't very good off his back.
 
It probably goes all the way back to the days of pankration.
 
The guard was invented the first time a small guy was knocked on his ass. He put his feet up in front of him so as not to get hit in the face.

I think he learned it from the common house cat.
 
It was used in traditional Japanese jujitsu and taijutsu a long time ago
 
Helio did not invent the closed guard but Eddie Bravo did invent the rubber guard

Maybe the name but not the type of guard.

Nino Schembri was doing that type of guard way before Bravo.
 
From what I understand, Renzo Gracie talked about the origin of the guard in "Mastering Jujitsu". He said it originated with the Fusen Ryu style of Jujutsu in Japan that focused mostly on groundwork.
 
Maybe the name but not the type of guard.

Nino Schembri was doing that type of guard way before Bravo.

Nino did hold his leg to help keep the guy down but it ended there...Bravo took that philosphy and ran with it! I give Eddie 98% of the credit for the rubber guard!

Nino never hugged the knee or did any of the things that make the rubber guard what it is now.

People hate giving Eddie credit...I just dont understand why? Eddie Bravo is in the top 2% of ALL BJJ players! Stop the hate people =)
 
People hate giving Eddie credit...I just dont understand why? Eddie Bravo is in the top 2% of ALL BJJ players! Stop the hate people =)

it's outragous claims like this that make people roll their eyes. Eddie came SECOND ONCE in ADCC. Never did anything else.
 
Nino did hold his leg to help keep the guy down but it ended there...Bravo took that philosphy and ran with it! I give Eddie 98% of the credit for the rubber guard!

Nino never hugged the knee or did any of the things that make the rubber guard what it is now.

People hate giving Eddie credit...I just dont understand why? Eddie Bravo is in the top 2% of ALL BJJ players! Stop the hate people =)

where do you get all these numbers from ? 98 %, 2%, where are these coming from?
 
wow...def did not think my mild sarcasm would lead to all this...
 
Guard was a judo technique and come from ancient jujutsu style like Tenshin shinnyo ryu and Fusen ryu, just like the other ground technique that maeda teached to the gracie.


pics from Judo Kyohan (1906-1915, Maeda lef japan in 1914)

Open guard
Y%20Ashi%20Garami2.jpg


Gyaku juji jime from closed guard

Y%20Gyaku%20Juji%20Jime2.jpg



This are video of judo Sparring from 1922, so about the same time Maeda was teaching to the gracie , show some newaza (groundwork in it)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qasGAXl60Wg


Other pics from judo kyohan

http://www.jigorokano.it/JKORG/Newaza Origini/Tanabe2.jpg

Y%20Juji%20Gatame.jpg


Y%20Hiza%20Gatame.jpg


Kataha%20Jime%20Nagaoka.jpg


Nami%20Juji%20Jime%20Karino.jpg


http://www.jigorokano.it/Imm.Ne Waza/Okuri Eri Jime/Okuri Eri Jime Imai.jpg

http://www.jigorokano.it/Imm.Ne Waza/Ude Garami/Y Ude Garami.jpg



other pics http://www.jigorokano.it/Cartella Yokoyama/Indice.html
 
From what I understand, Renzo Gracie talked about the origin of the guard in "Mastering Jujitsu". He said it originated with the Fusen Ryu style of Jujutsu in Japan that focused mostly on groundwork.

Renzo Gracie is not a historian, so it would probably be unwise to take what he says as the gospel. I'm sure the guard has origins even before Fusen Ryu. So are we saying, the act of laying on your back and locking another person's joints or choking them out is only like 200 years old? Even though there have been unarmed wrestling styles in Japan for well over a thousand years?
 
Nino did hold his leg to help keep the guy down but it ended there...Bravo took that philosphy and ran with it! I give Eddie 98% of the credit for the rubber guard!

Nino never hugged the knee or did any of the things that make the rubber guard what it is now.

yeah but Jean Jacques Machado hugged his knee and did a lot of the stuff we consider part of the rubber guard. The guy didn't invent anything he just marketed it. Its like with his "twister" people have been doing that since the seventies maybe even before. He gave it a new name and put a PR Spin on it.
 
Nino did hold his leg to help keep the guy down but it ended there...Bravo took that philosphy and ran with it! I give Eddie 98% of the credit for the rubber guard!

Nino never hugged the knee or did any of the things that make the rubber guard what it is now.

People hate giving Eddie credit...I just dont understand why? Eddie Bravo is in the top 2% of ALL BJJ players! Stop the hate people =)

dr%20gregory%20house.jpg
 
it's outragous claims like this that make people roll their eyes. Eddie came SECOND ONCE in ADCC. Never did anything else.

Anyone who wins the us trials then went on to the third round of the adcc is a top level grappler in my eyes. He didn't have easy competition either to get to that third round, gustavo dantas and royler gracie arn't easy opponents in my books. Even thou it only happened once, for someone to achieve that means he must have skills. You dont get to the third round of adcc being an ok grappler.

I'm not a huge fan of his game, but if your going to hate on him do it because of his music or his personality, you can't really question him for being a great grappler. He isn't going to win adcc or the mundials, but he is a great grappler.


Getting back on topic, i think the second generation of gracies (rolls etc) really helped develop the guard alot. I think in helios day the guard wasn't really a great position to be in, he didn't even know what a triangle was.
 
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