Television HBO's THE PENGUIN (Premieres Sept. 19)

[RollSonnenRoll]

Spoiler

yeah, I had a feeling Vic wasn't making it. Still though, to go out like he did was rough. Oz taking the money from his wallet after just to rub it in even more as well.

I'm also very glad they didn't go down the Victor Zsasz route. It wouldn't have fit at all

Spoiler

"Oz, please...please......"

I still found myself feeling sympathy for Sofia. The fear and pure terror she sold with just her eyes as she realized she was being arrested and going back was unnerving.

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

Great show. Heartbreaking ending for one of the beloved characters but I love that rerouted the ship before they made Oz too sympathetic or likeable going forward.

As I watching a bounded Oz, I swear they better not pull something so... questionable again like him breaking out of the duct tape with brute strength. Alas...

This show did an excellent job of making everyone unlikable. Even after spending 8 episodes with Oz and learning of his back story and motivations, I will still enjoy seeing Batman beat the shit out of him.

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

That last shot was beautiful

Spoiler

"He gave us the signal!"

 

[My Spot]

I guess Oz was able to rescue enough of his mushrooms from the debris to get on top?

 

[Cole train]

I guess Oz was able to rescue enough of his mushrooms from the debris to get on top?

Think it was more theres no one left to oppose him since all old bosses got killed by youngsters and they were allied with oz, dont need unique product at that point

 

[JaviBrewski]

didnt think anyone could outshine heath ledger's Joker, but man did Colin Farrell match it or come very close to it

 

[fungi]

Spoiler

While I don’t disagree with you, how would Sofia know unless Oz was dumb enough to tell her?

Show has a lot of convenience going on with it as it is… Guess they’d just slap together another flashback to show how Sofia would know.

Spoiler

I think Oz's Mom suspected that all her life. Maybe, even on subconscious level. Even if she didn't want to admit that to herself.

A few McSessions with red lights with dr. Rush may have brought that info to Sofia's attention.

Pretty much...

 

[The Clinch]

Pretty much...

Spoiler

All because of a flashlight.

 

[HenryFlower]

Spoiler

enjoy the show a lot. Surprised as I wasn’t all that into The Batman. I think if you don’t take the series super serious, it was a great show that did a great job focusing on building characters up and not worrying about axing them when necessary. Many shows can’t pull off either.

I think the problem I’ll run into is the movie franchise. I want Oz dead and Batman’s meant to not act in that way. Seeing him catch/ arrest Oz won’t be rewarding. I also forgot there’s cat woman in this reboot and didn’t like it (character is great but her becoming cat woman just seemed dumb).

Arkham is worse than death

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

I guess Oz was able to rescue enough of his mushrooms from the debris to get on top?

Think it was more theres no one left to oppose him since all old bosses got killed by youngsters and they were allied with oz, dont need unique product at that point

Also he got involved with the politicians. They're all paying him under the table to run the underworld. He's making the real money now, not drug dealer chicken feed

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

didnt think anyone could outshine heath ledger's Joker, but man did Colin Farrell match it or come very close to it

He gives off such DeNiro in Untouchables vibes

"You got NOTHING, Sofia. You don't got the bookkeeper, you got nothing!"

 

[Goon Dog]

Jesus what an ending. You knew it had to happen because of all the feels throughout the episodes, but I thought Sofia would do it. This was so much better. Horrible, but better. Overall an excellent season. Some parts slowed a bit, but the character building was worth it.

 

[UberHere]

Oz is gone. He’s the Penguin now

 

[ChosenOne]

Bravo. So many shows struggle to stick the landing, when earlier episodes were so great. This show is in rare company where the closing may well have exceeded what came prior.

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

Oz is gone. He’s the Penguin now

Agreed. His last shred of humanity was the hope for his mother's approval.

 

[ChosenOne]

Agreed. His last shred of humanity was the hope for his mother's approval.

I agree but would slant it slightly different.

i am not so sure it was his 'mother's approval' as much as it was what it represented. 'Winning'.

Oz, 'for reasons', had a sociopathy that required him win at all cost and at any risk. I think 'winning' was truly the only thing that mattered to him.

HIs "mom's approval" represented one of the biggest 'wins' he could achieve, whether by earning or thru deceit. Deceit may even be more satisfying as he did see his mom as smart and shrewd so to outplay her may have been gravy.

Again not trying to be too nitpicky but i think that added distinction is important as this is not just a sad tail of a young man going astray in the attempt to earn his flawed mothers (wife, friends or family) love and approval, which is the arc of many other fictions.

Oz, 'for reasons' was a player in the game from childhood and was always looking to 'win', and if that path required him to kill or see his mom killed, he would not have hesitated as it was really not about her.

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

I agree but would slant it slightly different.

i am not so sure it was his 'mother's approval' as much as it was what it represented. 'Winning'.

Oz, 'for reasons', had a sociopathy that required him win at all cost and at any risk. I think 'winning' was truly the only thing that mattered to him.

HIs "mom's approval" represented one of the biggest 'wins' he could achieve, whether by earning or thru deceit. Deceit may even be more satisfying as he did see his mom as smart and shrewd so to outplay her may have been gravy.

Again not trying to be too nitpicky but i think that added distinction is important as this is not just a sad tail of a young man going astray in the attempt to earn his flawed mothers (wife, friends or family) love and approval, which is the arc of many other fictions.

Oz, 'for reasons' was a player in the game from childhood and was always looking to 'win', and if that path required him to kill or see his mom killed, he would not have hesitated as it was really not about her.

I would agree. I also think he could be lying to himself as well. This relationship with his mother makes him think of himself as a good man. It allows him to buy into the facade of the "noble gangster" like his hero that he talked about in the opening scene. He can glowingly talk about her and it's a very endearing quality that lets people put their guard down. He's done it for so long that he has maybe even convinced himself. When push came to shove though, it was shown that it's really a lie.

I've seen several interpret the ending as him not being able to let her go but my personal thought was that it was punishment for her

 

[JackWhite]

didnt think anyone could outshine heath ledger's Joker, but man did Colin Farrell match it or come very close to it

And we still haven't seen how much of a menace he is going to be in the next two films.

I'm gonna lose my shit if/when Batman tries to roll up on Oz and he pulls out an umbrella gun and starts shooting at him. Let's go!

 

[RollSonnenRoll]

This does get me so much more excited for Batman 2. I'll mark out in the theatre now when Sofia shows up and it gives credibility to Penguin being the big bad of Gotham

I was wondering about what direction they were going. I didn't really like the Joker deleted scene and I'm kind of Joker'd out after the last few years anyways. I wasn't really into their version of Riddler and I don't see fantastical villains like Freeze or Ivy working in this universe. It would be hard to do something like Bane again after he became such a pop culture thing in Rises.

 

[that Indian]

A very philistine take but I can't be the only one to see the similarities between Oz and Trump:

- fat, ugly and narcissistic
- deeply yearning for parental validation; will use others as a proxy
- extremely charismatic; able to persuade people that he has their best interests in mind
- faux champion of the working man
- sees the system as rigged against them
- feel destined to rise
- Messianic beliefs of grandeur
- can and will betray anyone close for survival
- simultaneously demand absolute loyalty
- made of Teflon; their past deeds to not stymie their ability to continue wheeling and dealing