Has Israel already surpassed Anderson Silva?

The corpse of Anderson Silva and Romero should be removed from that list
 
he's already better than Anderson in his prime.

I'm really having trouble recalling anyone going back and forth on the feet with prime Anderson, like Kelvin (who is with all due respect a good, but fat WW) did with Israel.

Also, Israel went to decision with Tavares and Vettori...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
Izzy got to beat Weidman first.

Silva's destruction of fighters is basically mythical. Izzy just talks to much and ruins it all. Silva was a man of few words, respect, and I'd argue, had some fights won before they even started simply because of the fear he put into opponents. The way he demolished Leben and Franklin was more memorable than anything Izzy has done.

Not to mention, Silva beat legitimate LHWs Griffin, Irvin, and Bonnar. Griffin is a former LHW champion for fucks sake and he KO'd him with a jab.

From 2006 to 2012, Silva was the scariest fucking dude in the UFC and the best fighter of that time period. Izzy isn't. He is overshadowed by Khabib and he doesn't scare anyone. And no one, not even for fight promotion, was going to call Silva a "pussy African" because they liked life.
 
I'm really having trouble recalling anyone going back and forth on the feet with prime Anderson, like Kelvin (who is with all due respect a good, but fat WW) did with Israel.

Also, Israel went to decision with Tavares and Vettori...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Chael dropped Anderson.

And a lot of people controlled prime Anderson on the ground, something Izzy has yet to show such a weakness to.

Yes, Israel had a couple decision wins, Anderson straight up lost to cans in the first half of his career.
 
Not even close. Recency bias is insane around here.
I remember some people claiming Woodley was better than GSP. Also Usman went from being called a bum right before winning the belt to a GOAT contender after becoming champ lol. Also I love how people like to claim fighters who were dominant champs a few years ago would lose to everybody in the top 10 of their division now. A lot of it has to do with how dominant the champ is. People think the divisions got way better because nobody is able to hold the belt for as long as Silva or GSP. Divisions look way more stacked when there isn't 1 guy dominating everybody.
 
well it’s about what you do in actual fight, not what you have on paper.

costa doesn’t use his bjj much

yoel is 40 and lost 2 in a row before Israel’s fight

Whittaker was getting peiced up in ww division

Gastelum is just a fat ww fighting at mw

And Anderson was 45 when they fought...

Again it’s a solid list, but let’s not act it’s much better than Anderson’s

Still Costa is far from one dimensional. Guys like Askren and Maia are one dimensional.

Some argue Yoel won both of those and that was against best guys in the division.

Rumble was getting pieced up at WW as well. Does it mean he sucks as a LHW?

DC is a fat LHW fighting at HW. One of the best HWs of all time though.

Anderson was 43, no need to exaggerate.

Anderson has more good wins, but Adesanya definitely has fought better opponents than Anderson
 

Again, I really am having trouble remembering when prime Silva ever had a back and forth striking match with anyone in the UFC, like Kelvin vs Israel. Please remind me what match this was.
 
Oh yeah, absolutely. 100%.

I'm solely discussing where these guys make/made their mark... 185.... Adesanya is closing in real quick on Silva due to being a more active fighter than Silva was.
i dont think his mma resume is better than silvas but this is a good point. isreals activity shouldnt be over looked or scoffed at. reminds me of when jon jones was younger. that dude was fighting 3-4 times a year for like 5 years.

Still Costa is far from one dimensional. Guys like Askren and Maia are one dimensional.

Some argue Yoel won both of those and that was against best guys in the division.

Rumble was getting pieced up at WW as well. Does it mean he sucks as a LHW?

DC is a fat LHW fighting at HW. One of the best HWs of all time though.

Anderson was 43, no need to exaggerate.

Anderson has more good wins, but Adesanya definitely has fought better opponents than Anderson
costa is one dimesional. he cant grapple or at least hasnt desplayed this. not even a clinch inside the ufc. yes askren annd maia are one dimensional too but what does costa bring to the table outside of punches and kicks?
 
Sure, a guy who has defended his belt twice has surpassed the record holder (Lutter should count)? I’m guessing you haven’t watched MMA for that long.
 
Sure, a guy who has defended his belt twice has surpassed the record holder (Lutter should count)? I’m guessing you haven’t watched MMA for that long.
its a bit crazy right?. im not argueing who is more skilled, but wins alone anderson has the better wins. someone in this thread made it seem like trt vitor is a lesser win than costa. thats down right insane.

True, it wasn't back and forth, he flat out was outstruck (and outgrappled) by Chael lmao:

http://ufcstats.com/fight-details/bcab3ebdc21b0b64
i know all fighters play dirty pool(peds). but chael was 16 times over the limit, and broke the record for amount of things to pop for. chael never replicated that performance again.
 
Still Costa is far from one dimensional. Guys like Askren and Maia are one dimensional.

Some argue Yoel won both of those and that was against best guys in the division.

Rumble was getting pieced up at WW as well. Does it mean he sucks as a LHW?

DC is a fat LHW fighting at HW. One of the best HWs of all time though.

Anderson was 43, no need to exaggerate.

Anderson has more good wins, but Adesanya definitely has fought better opponents than Anderson

- costa only has 1 sub win and never goes for td. So again on paper he might not be one dimensional, but that’s how he fights and he proved it on Saturday.

- Yoel is also 40 years old and didn’t do anything in his fight vs Israel.

- who says Whittaker sucks? He’s just overrated, the same you could say for rumble who chokes if he doesn’t get a quick finish.

- dc has literally 2 wins as hw in ufc...

- yeah 43 is almost prime years... no need to exaggerate.

- you’re judging Anderson competition in retrospect and Israel’s in the moment. Of course right now Israel’s competition will look more impressive, but let’a see how it looks 5 years from now. When those top guys he beat have another 5 fights or so. What if romero loses another 2 and retires, costa and Whittaker become .500 fighters, Gastelum drops permanently to ww. Are you still view his competition as much better then?
 
Chael dropped Anderson.

And a lot of people controlled prime Anderson on the ground, something Izzy has yet to show such a weakness to.

Yes, Israel had a couple decision wins, Anderson straight up lost to cans in the first half of his career.
this is something thats gonna be debated with these 2 alot. anderson has the better bjj no doubt about that. but isreal has far better tdd. this is the reason for some of his lack luster fights. he cant get the pop in his strikes like anderson could because he is worried about the takedown. take away the takedown threat, isreal starts dropping fools. anderson never had to worry about that because he has great bjj.
 
Not even 1/100th of silva, he cant grapple at all he's a kickboxer that makes money fed to strikers by dana to milk him
 
Fighters also get worse over time too... why does this fact elude so many ppl?

Again Whittaker has a solid tdd and ability to get back up if taken down, however he got overrated in last 5 years cause he was mostly facing grapplers.

How many good strikers did he face?

also it’s comically you mentioned all those wins for Gastelum. Most of those guys were near retirement or were old and battle worn.

Whittaker faced Uriah Hall, Derek Brunson who KO'd Machida and beat Anderson Silva (while past their primes they were still dangerous, Machida would go on to have a very close fight with Mousasi again), ran circles around Jacare who beat prime Moose on the feet and also KO'd Weidman who outstruck prime Machida on the feet, and Yoel Romero who was a big threat to Adesanya on the feet and also outstruck Machida on the feet among others. Guys with striking backgrounds aren't always the best strikers in MMA.

Jacare was still at the top when Gastelum beat him, and Bisping had just lost his title. And it doesn't require Teddy Atlas level of knowledge to see that Gastelum is one of MMA's best boxers.
 
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