Has any MMA/ UFC Fighter ever been truely world class at 2 arts

If MMA is excluded? No. There have been guys that were world-class in one art, and regionally elite in another (American, Euro, Brazilian champ, etc.), but not world class.

People under-estimate the amount of dedication it takes to be world class. Any time spent training one art, means you're neglecting another. Skills deteriorate, everything doesn't just stick after you've acquired them, you have to hone them all the time to stay at the elite level.
 
This is stupid.

The moment you decide to do MMA you stop training one art 100% thus obviously you're never going to be a top 10 guy unless you're remarkably talented. Because the top 10 guys generally practice that art 100%

If by world class you mean say top 50-100 then i'm sure there are many who are qualified.

Not exactly true...Overeem won the K1 Grand Prix while fighting in MMA, Fedor won multiple gold medals in Sambo while fighting in MMA, there are grapplers/BJJ guys who compete and win at high level Grappling tournaments all the time, while fighting in MMA.
 
I think if Jones trained for it he possibly could be world-class in both BJJ and Kickboxing but at this stage I doubt it. If he wanted to be world-class in Boxing or Wrestling he'd just have to focus on one, that's even less likely.

Yea he's like the Michael Jordon of BJJ
 
Well those were mostly guys that were world class in that art BEFORE they took up MMA. but of course there are exceptions. Besides i meant you would never be top 10 in TWO artes (Not counting mma). But there are probably some that are top 10 in one and maybe top 50 in another,
 
We never got to see how good he really was, as Pride refused to let him go to ADCC proper. They booked him a fight instead.

The level of submission grappling in Europe was horrible back then, though.
 
Chaeel Sonnen is champ in all kinds of martial arts

Brock Lesnar holds a degree in breakdancing

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Well, we all know Anderson Silva's striking accumen. I remember reading an article saying that he would do well in K-1.

Add to that, he submitted a BJJ Black Belt in Travis Lutter.
 
Overeem comes to mind. GSP at wrestling/BJJ?
 
Well, we all know Anderson Silva's striking accumen. I remember reading an article saying that he would do well in K-1.

Add to that, he submitted a BJJ Black Belt in Travis Lutter.

matt lindland submitted lutter too. he was also a silver medalist in greco roman.
 
Maybe not care so much but GSP and Anderson will be remembered by MMA fans.

Just as PRIDE legends are remembered by MMA fans - the ones who are familiar with that time period. The new fans from the TUF or FOX era most likely don't know much or care about them.

So in that same regard, I believe new MMA fans that will come to the sport in 5-10 years from now will barely know or even care about GSP or Anderson.

I wouldn't be surprised if history will repeat itself, and the new generation of MMA fans will say that GSP and Anderson fought in a time period when "fighters were not evolved and competitions were easier" or "fighters were mostly jacks of all trades and masters of none". :icon_chee
 
Just as PRIDE legends are remembered by MMA fans - the ones who are familiar with that time period. The new fans from the TUF or FOX era most likely don't know much or care about them.

So in that same regard, I believe new MMA fans that will come to the sport in 5-10 years from now will barely know or even care about GSP or Anderson.

I wouldn't be surprised if history will repeat itself, and the new generation of MMA fans will say that GSP and Anderson fought in a time period when "fighters were not evolved and competitions were easier" or "fighters were mostly jacks of all trades and masters of none". :icon_chee

I agree with pretty much everything except I think new fans wil remember gsp and silva because they fight in the ufc and will be in the hall of fame. Its like people that never have seen ali fight and say he was the greatest boxer of all time
 
BJ Penn could have been a world class boxer IMO, and was a BJJ world champion in his day--Nick Diaz is world class in boxing and BJJ as well. But you're asking the wrong question IMO, because seeing an art in action in it's pure form you get the benefit of ignoring the reality of a real fight-- Its the ability to transition between arts that produces the best MMA fighters anyway-- As the saying goes, it's not always the best fighter, it's who fights best.

It's why you don't see the best guys in individual arts necessarily excel at mma, their arts often fail to take into account the strength of other, different arts, and have strategies that make them succeptible--wrestlers have the best shot at adapting and becoming proficient at a second art of all outside arts, because they can generally control the transitions and often have spent their entire life learning how to learn an art.

A great striker is never so great with the looming threat of a double leg... A great pure boxer is often using tactics that don't take into account defending against grappling, for example a very sideways stance that makes them a more narrow target in boxing but also a sitting duck for leg kicks and single leg takedowns-- A great kickboxer will have to be much more careful with their kicks, particularly body and head kicks, for fear of ending up on their back. The muay thai straight up and down stance has no answer for wrestling, so it must be addapted in the same manner as a boxing stance for actual mma-- MMA easily exposes the holes in individual martial arts, thus it is in many ways a superior form of competition and proof of what Bruce Lee belived--take the best from each, discard what doesn't work.
 
BJ Penn could have been a world class boxer IMO, and was a BJJ world champion in his day--Nick Diaz is world class in boxing and BJJ as well. But you're asking the wrong question IMO, because seeing an art in action in it's pure form you get the benefit of ignoring the reality of a real fight-- Its the ability to transition between arts that produces the best MMA fighters anyway-- As the saying goes, it's not always the best fighter, it's who fights best.

It's why you don't see the best guys in individual arts necessarily excel at mma, their arts often fail to take into account the strength of other, different arts, and have strategies that make them succeptible--wrestlers have the best shot at adapting and becoming proficient at a second art of all outside arts, because they can generally control the transitions and often have spent their entire life learning how to learn an art.

A great striker is never so great with the looming threat of a double leg... A great pure boxer is often using tactics that don't take into account defending against grappling, for example a very sideways stance that makes them a more narrow target in boxing but also a sitting duck for leg kicks and single leg takedowns-- A great kickboxer will have to be much more careful with their kicks, particularly body and head kicks, for fear of ending up on their back. The muay thai straight up and down stance has no answer for wrestling, so it must be addapted in the same manner as a boxing stance for actual mma-- MMA easily exposes the holes in individual martial arts, thus it is in many ways a superior form of competition and proof of what Bruce Lee belived--take the best from each, discard what doesn't work.

I'm as big a BJ Penn Homer as you'll come across, but you're being ridiculous. What in the world makes you think that BJ could have been "world class" at boxing?

Let's play an imaginary game where Freddie Roach never allegedly (I say alleged because I have yet to read a direct quote from Roach saying this. I've heard a second hand account, but I don't take that as what he said verbatim. Also, when Roach DOES address boxing in MMA, he puts Anderson and GSP above BJ in his top boxers. Also, is it a coincidence his top boxers are actually the entire list of guys he's basically trained? anyway..) said that BJ Penn had the best boxing in all of MMA. Let's Forget that this quote ever existed. Would people really believe independently that BJ had the best hands in MMA? Based on what? His ability to outstrike Diego Sanchez or Kenny Florian?

You know what we DO know? BJ has been outstruck by lots of fighters -- GSP, Frankie, Diaz, Rory all outstruck him. And before you make excuses as to WHEY they were able to outstrike him (GSP's wrestling made his striking better; Frankie's too fast; BJ gassed against Diaz; Rory's too big) let's not forget that at the end of the day, he got outstruck by all of these fighters, regardless of the reasoning. And if he entered boxing, guess what? He'd encounter fighters who are quicker, faster, stronger, and has better endurance. So the same reasons for his getting outstruck in MMA would apply in boxing as well.

There is ZERO evidence to suggest BJ would have been world class at boxing, let alone average. Don't let Freddie Roach's alleged analysis fool you, BJ is FAR from world class at boxing. To believe otherwise is to believe so without any form of proof.
 
I agree with pretty much everything except I think new fans wil remember gsp and silva because they fight in the ufc and will be in the hall of fame. Its like people that never have seen ali fight and say he was the greatest boxer of all time

You made a good point regarding being the hall of fame. I suppose people will remember them - that they fought in the UFC, not "remember them" as in "wow, do you remember how great GSP and Anderson Silva were?"

The reason that I'm saying this is because if we look at other UFC hall of famers such as such as Royce, Coleman (?), Severn (?), Tito, Chuck, or fighters who were worthy but weren't included because of disputes with the UFC brass, such as Ken Shamrock, etc.,... being in the UFC hall of fame seems to have little value when it comes to making a good impression on the minds of new MMA fans who never actually saw them during their glory days.

Yes, new fans might know about them, but they might not remember them.

Here is an example:

To many fans who have seen Royce Gracie back in the days, he is remembered as the first fighter to introduced BJJ to MMA, beating guys much bigger than he was, and got the sport started. To newer fans of perhaps the TUF era, Royce is regarded as a one dimensional fighter who was only successful because, and I quote, "no one else knew what BJJ was".
 
As far as doing well in actual competitions, Mark Kerr deserves a mention.

Alongside his MMA career, he won ADCC, and came 7th in the FILA freestyle wrestling world championship and was an Olympic alternate.

Obviously he used his wrestling skills to get most of his success, but it's still 3 separate sports which he reached the top level of competition.
 
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