Half Guard Sweep Variation: Saulo vs Cyborg

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by rgp, Oct 19, 2010.

  1. rgp

    rgp Yellow Belt

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    Or ... to post or not to post on your elbow ?

    Hello fellow grapplers. My first post on sherdog and I need a little help. I've been working on my half guard for quite a long time and I think I have tryed it all.
    I use the LDHG to set the underhook, as Cyborg shows in his DVD. Roberto Abreu's tips have helped me the most, I'm referring to: (1) the way you shot/pendulum your top leg from LDHG and (2) what he calls "dental cloth". The only problem I have with his variation is that Cyborg explaines you need to load him up and come low ( on your side, but glued ) on the mat - after you get the underhook, and then do the footwork for the sweep. I am having problemes with this because my opponen's weight is on me and I don't have space to work. Saulo in his instructional explaines that you need to post on your elbow for leverage, do a leg swich and jump with you knees pinched too straighten the leg. This works best for me. Cyborg says you don't want to stay on your elbow with your head up because you risc getting choked.

    I would apreciate all input on this, especially from the half guard wizard himeself - Oli Geddes and from Hillary, who I belive trains with Cyborg.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2010
  2. bjjaz

    bjjaz Got the Rock...Time to Roll

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    Its kinda hard to picture w/o a picture/video of at least something similiar.

    Maybe try rocking or spreading his legs out to get his base off?
     
  3. padirk165

    padirk165 Yellow Belt

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    There is not going to be a right or wrong way between Cyborg or Saulo's variation. Both will work different for different people. See which works best for you. you might find you need to adjust based on opponents and their body type or the game they play. If you are going against a longer guy with good darce and brabo variations it sounds like you would want to try to work Cyborgs way, if you are against a guy who is sitting back more and has a more solid base who isnt going for chokes you mey need to come up on the elbow to get leverage, if when you do this he starts looking choke then go back to cyborgs stuff as he will unbalance his base some while attacking the choke.

    Really there are countless different minor details in all position that make different parts of the game work you need to try to expose yourself to as many different techniques/variations of them, and try them in practice and determine what works best for you and develop your own game. Try to roll with people close to your level so that you can have a good feel for what you are trying to learn. Experimenting with new tech/variations against the brown belts or new white belts isnt going to let you relaly determine what you need to work on.
     
  4. rgp

    rgp Yellow Belt

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    @padirk165: Thanks and I know what you mean. In my experience half guard and passing are the most individual parts of BJJ - everybody does it different. Just wanted to hear some opinions. I reached this conclusion: the leverage points (posting on elbow) is worth the hypothetical guillotine risk. Plus, you should have you ear glued to his chest when posting on your elbow, so your neck should not be exposed.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2010
  5. rgp

    rgp Yellow Belt

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    @bjjaz: You should take a look at those videos (Revolutions1 and Cyborg's Half Guar) if you can. It's hard to explain exactly and i can't upload them on youtube due to copyright. Here's something similar.

    Galvao's posture under half (similar to Cyborg) -does not post. Note: Galvao does not go for the clasic sweep, the "Old school"


    Frank Mir posting on elbow. Note: Mir does not use LDHG, instead he uses the outside leg as an inside hook, and the inside leg is free - similar to LDHG b/c you are not stuck.
     
  6. Oliver Geddes

    Oliver Geddes Amateur Fighter

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    I do it pretty much exactly the way that Galvao does it. I find that doing it Mir's way gives the guy on top a lot of room to move. That said, if you're looking to stand up and finish a single or some other form of takedown, his way would still work. But if you want to finish a sweep from your knees (particularly in the gi, obviously helped by the knee grip that Galvao uses), I prefer the Galvao version.

    To expand upon the sweep he uses, if you can't get his weight onto you, give a little nudge into the knee you're holding to take his weight away from you, then pull yourself up to your knees (what Eddie would call the Dogfight position) and work from there. Then you can do old school variation with the knee grip and bundle them over with cross hip pressure, and then if they push back, you can go back to the Galvao sweep. Which works much better that way because you have an extra 90 degrees (ish) of rotation as well as a more forced reaction from your opponent.

    ...was that clear?

    Hope so. If I'm expressing myself badly, just shout and I'll do my best to clarify!

    Take care,

    Oli
     
  7. rgp

    rgp Yellow Belt

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    Thanks Oli! Can you please explain more about about that little nudge ? How do I want his weight at that point (not posted on my elbow)? I guess it's feeling thing ... or maybe you can show me in one of your matches.
     

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