GSP is not GOAT pick for mma fans out of North America

Barcelona is not my team. I rate Messi as a neutral soccer fan. I dont even watch much soccer these days except the big matches and yeah, Messi is close to excellence. Its a very consensual opinion among coaches and players

Fedor was for sure a decade ago..today, he may remain as the most popular pick idk but I would guess Silva has surpassed him since 2010. Silva's career extends 20 years; has been exposed to a wider audience
MMA:

http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/your-fighter´s-goat.3730621/

If you wanna update:

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-33-the-undisputed-goat.3961171/

SOCCER:

In 2011 the sports newspaper Olé made a poll with 95.000 respondents. 56% valued Messi as better than Maradona. The poll was online.

In 2015 a poll made by an agency of political consulting gave that 66% of respondents valued Maradona as the best football players of all times, and 21% did so for Messi.
 
MMA:
In 2015 a poll made by an agency of political consulting gave that 66% of respondents valued Maradona as the best football players of all times, and 21% did so for Messi.

You completely stopped watching soccer for some reason in the 90s - hard to believe you were and avid fan before it - and you come now with a "poll made by a political consulting" hahahah gono take a break
 
You completely stopped watching soccer for some reason in the 90s - hard to believe you were and avid fan before it - and you come now with a "poll made by a political consulting" hahahah gono take a break
ah I was tho... could even talk about pre-WW2 soccer... stopped when Nigeria lost against Italy in 94...

Anyway, you asked about recognition, who gives a fook about who made the poll. If you ask the true OGs, they will all give the nod to Pelé & Maradona.
 
are you 10? you know it since the beggining - you get into threads like this 20 times a day every day nerd
suck off GSP a bit to pump this thread or indeed get the fuck "outta" here to suck elsewhere hahaha

You seem a bit mad that i made you admit that you based your bullshit thread on pure bias and opinion rather than facts.
 
MMA:

http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/your-fighter´s-goat.3730621/

If you wanna update:

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-33-the-undisputed-goat.3961171/

SOCCER:

In 2011 the sports newspaper Olé made a poll with 95.000 respondents. 56% valued Messi as better than Maradona. The poll was online.

In 2015 a poll made by an agency of political consulting gave that 66% of respondents valued Maradona as the best football players of all times, and 21% did so for Messi.

Some loser knows how to use google... from his mother's basement. I won't name him but heres an hint : he refers to himself in the third person. Paaaaaathetic.
 
Some loser knows how to use google... from his mother's basement. I won't name him but heres an hint : he refers to himself in the third person. Paaaaaathetic.
I mean, puh-lease, dude. You´re probably an adult, and are still into Marvel shits... I literally stopped readin´these shits when I was 10 yrs old...

Lousy nerd.
 
ah I was tho... could even talk about pre-WW2 soccer... stopped when Nigeria lost against Italy in 94...

Anyway, you asked about recognition, who gives a fook about who made the poll. If you ask the true OGs, they will all give the nod to Pelé & Maradona.

You could even talk about preWW2 tennis or cycling and Federer and Merckx, from small European countries, are still the best eva. Same for Messi in fútbol at this point.
A guy who refuse to watch the best player of s. XXI in a team that is the opposite of Italian catenaccio is not to be taken serious
 
You could even talk about preWW2 tennis or cycling and Federer and Merckx, from small European countries, are still the best eva. Same for Messi in fútbol at this point.
A guy who refuse to watch the best player of s. XXI in a team that is the opposite of Italian catenaccio is not to be taken serious
Indeed, Im not to be taken seriously since I no longer watch it, obviously.

But it´s like MMA/Vale Tudo.. You have to study its history if you´re indeed interested.
 
I mean, puh-lease, dude. You´re probably an adult, and are still into Marvel shits... I literally stopped readin´these shits when I was 10 yrs old...

Lousy nerd.

Nice comeback. But you're still living in your mother's basement watching pride dvd's for the 300th times.
 
Nice comeback. But you're still living in your mother's basement watching pride dvd's for the 300th times.
Hey... Do I look...

A baby-sitter?

babalu eye.gif

Now, get off my boots, sit down & stay quiet. Your fat momma´s gonna call you soon for the next Marvel anime.
 
It was absolutely the height of his career, and he had yet to catch Anderson Silva's title defense record. (Speaks for itself).

28 fights in 12 years is pretty chill compared to most fighters, barely over 2 fights a year. Especially for someone who dominated with such ease and took very little damage, right?

His body was breaking down? Really? Pretty sure he says he's currently in the best shape of his life. It seems like you're making more excuses?

GSP actually denied USADA testing, and pushed for VADA. His camp refused to submit to USADA when they couldn't know the random test dates in advance. Is that what you meant?


You do know that is not true? And hopefully you'll even show the leaked emails as some kind of proof, because it doesnt say it in there either.
 
The alleged "GOAT" changes every week in MMA. Who gives a shit. It's too young a sport to be certain who the best ever is anyway.

not really. Most of the candidates aren’t fighting anymore, at least against meaningful competition. Anderson, GSP and Fedors legacies are pretty much a wrap at this point with Jon and Aldo still adding to theirs. I think these 5 have done plenty to deserve such recognition. There’s never going to be a time when a GOAT can be unanimously agreed upon. There will always be haters and dick riders no matter what the future holds. The age of the sport* is irrelevant.
 
@pankrat
Fought in a division which is way more stacked than middleweight, let alone light heavyweight and literally beat everyone he's stepped in the cage against, but allegedly is no legitimate GOAT candidate.
<36>
Sure thing, bud.
(Coming from a german, by the way.)
Heights4.jpg

Fought in the weightclass with arguably the second largest talentpool ever and his UFC-wins looked like this:
  1. Parisyan, at the time 10-2...............21 yo (GSP: 22 yo)
  2. Hieron, at the time 4-0.....................27 yo (GSP: 23 yo)
  3. Miller, at the time 11-3......................24 yo (GSP: 24 yo)
  4. Trigg, at the time 12-3.....................33 yo (GSP: 24 yo)
  5. Sherk, at the time 31-1-1.................32 yo (GSP: 24 yo)
  6. Penn, at the time 10-2-1..................27 yo (GSP: 25 yo)
  7. Hughes I, at the time 41-4...............33 yo (GSP: 25 yo)
  8. Koscheck I, at the time 9-1..............29 yo (GSP: 26 yo)
  9. Hughes II, at the time 42-5...............34 yo (GSP: 26 yo)
  10. Serra, at the time 10-4.....................34 yo (GSP: 26 yo)
  11. Fitch, at the time 19-2......................30 yo (GSP: 27 yo)
  12. Penn II, at the time 13-4-1................30 yo (GSP: 28 yo)
  13. Alves, at the time 17-5.....................25 yo (GSP: 28 yo)
  14. Hardy, at the time 23-6.....................28 yo (GSP: 29 yo)
  15. Koscheck II, at the time 15-4...........33 yo (GSP: 29 yo)
  16. Shields, at the time 26-4-1...............32 yo (GSP: 29 yo)
  17. Condit, at the time 28-5....................28 yo (GSP: 31 yo)
  18. Nick Diaz, at the time 26-7...............29 yo (GSP: 31 yo)
  19. Johny Hendricks, at the time 15-1...30 yo (GSP: 32 yo)
  20. Michael Bisping, at the time 30-7.....38 yo (GSP: 36 yo)
  • The guys he has won against were on average 29.85 years old.
  • When they've faced GSP, they had an average win-percentage of 85% - in comparison: the opponents Demetrious Johnson has won against had won on average 83% of their fights, Jon Jones' opponents' have won 81% of their fights, Jose Aldo's opponents have won 80% of their fights, Anderson Silva's opponents have won 79% of their fights and Emelianenko's opponents have on average won 72% of their fights when he beat them.
Another thing, which is important when looking at the level of opposition, is the number of wins and losses the beaten opponents of the above mentioned fighters had when they've beat them until the point where they've started losing repeatedly. Note: I have left draws out:

Mighty Mouse's UFC/WEC/One opponents:
312-64 in 20 wins. (30-3 record himself)

Jose Aldo's UFC/WEC opponents:
317-78 in 18 wins. (28-4 record himself)

Georges St-Pierre's UFC opponents:
392-70 in 20 wins. (26-2 record himself)

Anderson Silva's UFC opponents:
298-75 in 16 wins. (33-4 record himself)

Jon Jones' UFC opponents:

362-83 in 20 wins. (26-1 record himself)

Fedor Emelianenko's opponents:

362-139 in 31 wins. (31-1 record himself)

So if we base the strength of the opposition these guys have beaten on how high their win-percentage was when they've been beaten, the ranking looks like this:
  1. Georges St-Pierre (85%)
  2. Demetrious Johnson (83%)
  3. Jon Jones (81%)
  4. Jose Aldo (80%)
  5. Anderson Silva (79%)
  6. Fedor Emelianenko (72%)
Ranking the opponents of each fighter by their average experience (number of pro fights):
  1. Anderson Silva: 23 (23.3)
  2. Georges St-Pierre: 23 (23.1)
  3. Jon Jones: 22 (22.3)
  4. Jose Aldo: 22 (21.9)
  5. Demetrious Johnson: 19 (18.8)
  6. Fedor Emelianenko: 16 (16.2)
But at what point in their career did those fighters losses happen? At which age and at what level of experience? And against who?

Demetrious Johnson
1st loss: UD, 23 yo, 10 pro fights exp, B. Pickett's record then: 18-4, now: 25-14
2nd loss: UD, 25 yo, 15 pro fights exp, D. Cruz' record then: 18-1, now: 22-2
3rd loss: SD, 31 yo, 29 pro fights exp, H. Cejudo's record then: 12-2, now: 15-2

Jose Aldo
1st loss: Sub, 19 yo, 7 pro fights exp, L. Azevedo's record then: 6-2, now: 17-9
2nd loss: KO, 29 yo, 26 pro fights exp, C. McGregor's record then: 18-2, now: 22-4
3rd loss: TKO, 30 yo, 28 pro fights exp, M. Holloway's record then: 17-3, now: 21-5
4th loss: TKO, 31 yo, 29 pro fights exp, M. Holloway's record then: 18-3, now: 21-5

Georges St-Pierre
1st loss: Sub, 23 yo, 7 pro fights exp, M. Hughes' record then: 36-4, now: 45-9
2nd loss: TKO, 25 yo, 14 pro fights exp, M. Serra's record then: 9-4, now: 11-7

Anderson Silva
1st loss: UD, 25 yo, 2 pro fights exp, L. Azeredo's record then: 2-1, now: 15-10
2nd loss: Sub, 28 yo, 12 pro fights exp, D. Takase's record then: 4-7, now: 12-15
3rd loss: Sub, 29 yo, 16 pro fights exp, R. Chonan's record then: 7-4, now: 22-13
4th loss: DQ, 30 yo, 19 pro fights exp, Y. Okami's record then: 13-2, now: 36-14

Jon Jones
1st loss: DQ, 22 yo, 9 pro fights exp, M. Hamill's record then: 7-2, now: 13-8

Fedor Emelianenko
1st loss: TKO, 24 yo, 4 pro fights exp, T. Kosaka's record then: 19-10, now: 27-20


So far so good, but what possible taints the record of those fighters?
  • Demetrious Johnson: n/a
  • Jose Aldo: maybe that urine test? idk.
  • Georges St-Pierre: allegedly had is cornerman rub vaseline on his back (https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/2/2/744379/more-on-the-georges-st-pie)
  • Anderson Silva: has tested positive for banned substances multiple times
  • Jon Jones: has tested positive for banned substances multiple times
  • Fedor Emelianenko: n/a

Conclusion: you don't have to like Georges St-Pierre (or his fans) but his resume couldn't be further from overrated.
Side note for the Fedor fans: the fact that he's beaten lots of sub-par opponents between the all-time greats he has beaten does of course "taint" his record in the terms of the very statistics i've listed here, so i just want to say that he's in my top three best/greatest fighters of all time, consisting of him, St-Pierre and Mighty Mouse.

great post.


Nothing will change the haters minds tho.
 
great post.


Nothing will change the haters minds tho.

GSP is one of the greatest but you don't need to be a hater to not consider him the GOAT.

That post you reply brings a bunch of numbers and stats while, casually, completely forgets to take KO/Subs into consideration

When nº of top wins, nº of defenses, longevity and level of competitions are similar - finshing your opponent instead of let it go to the judges make a huge difference when discussing the GOAT.
 
GSP is one of the greatest but you don't need to be a hater to not consider him the GOAT.

That post you reply brings a bunch of numbers and stats while, casually, completely forgets to take KO/Subs into consideration

When nº of top wins, nº of defenses, longevity and level of competitions are similar - finshing your opponent instead of let it go to the judges make a huge difference when discussing the GOAT.

not really, no. GSPs streak without losing a round carries more weight, imo. People win with Hail Mary KOs and subs after getting their asses beat for 3-4 rounds. There’s no disputing the dominance of that streak. It’s insane, considering the quality of opposition he was facing. Finishes are great, everybody loves finishes. GSPs streak is by far, the greatest indicator of someone purely outclassing the best in the world and just being on another level. These weren’t razor thin decisions like Jon is eeking out. GSP dominates every minute of the fights.
 
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