Law Grandmother dies after spending last five months of her life in jail on $300 bond without trial

[ObamaPhoneLady]

Seems to be just a thread to invoke an arguments with out trying to come up with a solution

He's just reacting to the dog whistle.

 

[Seano]

A mentally ill person who is not guilty of any serious crime being detained in a small room 24/7 for 5 months without their medication is absolutely a sterling example of "rotted in a cell."

Sorry that you ran out of arguments and deflections and had to go pedantic about word choice.



And, here, we have finally arrived at the reason you came to participate in this thread. To try and make it about race.

Shocking.

The story in your OP is racially charged. Racism is mentioned in like the first sentence and then the story does nothing to actually link the woman's death to any sort of racial issue.

 

[JDragon]

Do European countries have bail?

I can only speak for Germany. The measure to free an accused under bail bond does exist, but is only used under rare circumstances. The main reason for Untersuchungshaft (i.e. pre-trial detention) is a) flight risk (i.e. does the suspect have a family, a job, strong social connections or not? Does he have connections to abroad? Is the sentence that might be expected high enough to assume the suspect will try to disappear?) and b) risk of tampering with evidence. If a) or b) are given, courts usually won't accept bail bond, and if not, there usually won't be pre-trial detention. I have only seen bail used as a measure in cases where the detention is somewhat questionable (e.g. in the case of Carles Puigdemont).

There's consequently also no bail bond business.

 

[bobgeese]

Thief?







But seriously, if you think the mental health system is in any better shape than the “Justice” system, well, you’re a dumbass.

 

[Seaside]

Because you are racist and assume black people can't afford bail?

Trotsky is white and sekf hating and loves any story about a persin who is black anf broke the law. He can then scream "racism"

B-b-but @Trotsky

At least be consistent. I can dig up those posts of theirs. But i bet you dont care since your liberal friends said it.

 

[HockeyBjj]

At the least the bail should be scaled according to the persons income.

Down to 30 bucks (after bondsman) this was and in most cases I see that is the case.

I would definitely be open to hearing alternative solutions to money buying your pre trial freedom as that a concept I just realized I'm uncomfortable with. Unfortunately there aren't any other systems I know of

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

I can only speak for Germany. The measure to free an accused under bail bond does exist, but is only used under rare circumstances. The main reason for Untersuchungshaft (i.e. pre-trial detention) is a) flight risk (i.e. does the suspect have a family, a job, strong social connections or not? Does he have connections to abroad? Is the sentence that might be expected high enough to assume the suspect will try to disappear?) and b) risk of tampering with evidence. If a) or b) are given, courts usually won't accept bail bond, and if not, there usually won't be pre-trial detention. I have only seen bail used as a measure in cases where the detention is somewhat questionable (e.g. in the case of Carles Puigdemont).

There's consequently also no bail bond business.

I visited my sister's family when she lived in Germany and they have some crazy laws for homeless people.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/12/19/fines-homeless-germany/965174001/

 

[JDragon]

Down to 30 bucks (after bondsman) this was and in most cases I see that is the case.

I would definitely be open to hearing alternative solutions to money buying your pre trial freedom as that a concept I just realized I'm uncomfortable with. Unfortunately there aren't any other systems I know of

As I wrote earlier, if there is a flight risk or a risk that you might destroy evidence or tamper with witnesses, there should be no option of bail imo (as is the case here in Germany). And if those are not given, well, why have pre-trial detention?

 

[Trotsky]

The story in your OP is racially charged. Racism is mentioned in like the first sentence and then the story does nothing to actually link the woman's death to any sort of racial issue.

It does not mention racism. It mentions that this phenomenon disproportionately affects persons and communities of color. It may presume that the reader already knows that black people are more likely to reside in urban pockets where aggressive community policing is more common and justice system funding is less adequate, or that black people tend to be poorer and less able to afford cash bail, or that black people have higher incidence of mental illness. To that end, any topic of criminal justice can be racially charged. It does not, however, mention racism.

 

[Trotsky]

Seems to be just a thread to invoke an arguments with out trying to come up with a solution.

I specifically mentioned strategies toward solutions.

If you weren't a previous ban on a month-old throwaway account, you probably wouldn't be purposefully ignoring them, though.

Also, lol @ "easy solution would be having a compassionate family." That's the go-to for conservatives who are incapable of thought. Just like the "promote family values" shtick that never accompanies any actual policy suggestions and is only used to ignore others.

Get back to us all when you figure out how to pass a policy that entitles everyone to a compassionate family.

 

[Lord Coke]

This is a completely ordinary, unremarkable story in the United States of an un-convicted person dying in police custody because they don't have bail money and/or the mental faculties to fend for themselves. Frankly, the only thing remotely unusual about it is that, usually, persons who die in debtor's prison do not have family to remember them or to bring attention to their deaths, because those families would have eventually scrounged together the money to get them out.

Let’s talk about the injustice that is inherent in the cash bond system and how it disproportionately impacts people of color. Let’s discuss the criminal justice system’s inability to properly deal with those suffering from mental illness. Let’s talk about how those two things combined recently contributed to the death of a 61-year-old black grandmother who was arrested on a misdemeanor trespassing charge and held in jail for five months.

KSAT confirmed via court records that Janice Dotson-Stephens died in the custody of the Bexar County Sheriff’s Office Friday. She had been held in jail since July on a $300 bond.

Dotson-Stephens was arrested July 17 on a misdemeanor charge of trespassing on private property—her first brush with the law according to Bexar County Court records.

BCSO officials told KSAT that Dotson-Stephens had been held at the infirmary at the annex detention center and appeared to have died from natural causes.

The most shameful part about it is that most bail bond companies require a 10 percent payment to bail you out, meaning Dotson-Stephens could have been set free for just $30.

According to court records, Dotson-Stephens refused to be interviewed about her case the day after she was arrested and again on four straight days in late July, KSAT reports. She refused once again on Aug. 4.

On Aug. 8, a court-appointed attorney was assigned to her case, and when she refused to make a court appearance on Aug. 17, she was ordered to go through a psychological evaluation on Aug. 27.

Family members said they were unaware Dotson-Stephens was in jail. They thought she was being treated at a state hospital.

Dotson-Stephens’ daughter-in-law, Leticia Dotson, told KSAT that she and her husband were devastated to find out that Dotson-Stephens had died in jail.

“We just felt that she shouldn’t have died as a criminal in the jailhouse,”Dotson said. “She wasn’t a criminal. She had mental health illness.”

Dotson told the station that her mother-in-law had a history of mental illness. She said that in previous encounters with police, Dotson-Stephens was evaluated and transferred to the state hospital.

Dotson said that none of her mother-in-law’s family members had been contacted, something she thinks could have saved her life.

“If it changed and we had to bail her out before the process of getting her to the state hospital, we would have done that,” Dotson said.

“She had people who loved her and family who would have easily paid the $30 to get her out of jail if that’s what we had to do to take the next step,” she added.

Dotson told KSAT that she hopes the staff at the Bexar County Jail and at the state hospital will communicate in the future so this will not happen to other families.

“If your family has a mental illness, it’s not in their control,” she said. “She shouldn’t die as a criminal. They should die as, ‘This person had a mental illness and this is what happened.’”

Bexar County officials told KSAT on Monday that they couldn’t confirm if Dotson-Stephens was diagnosed with a mental health condition. They also said that she did not have a next of kin listed and that a transfer to the state hospital requires a court order.

The family told Refinery29 that it wasn’t unusual for them to go long stretches without hearing from the mother of four and grandmother of 10. She often became irrational when she was off her medication. Her father reportedly called the Bexar County Jail looking for her in August, but he was told she was not in their custody. The family feared that she had been released onto the streets and only found out her whereabouts when they were notified of her death.

The situation has caught the attention of California Democratic Sen. Kamala Harris, who tweeted about it Tuesday morning.

“A woman was held in jail for six months because she couldn’t afford to pay her $300 bond. She just died in custody. This is tragic and exactly why we need to reform our money bail system,” Harris wrote.

In a separate email to Refinery29, Harris said: “The death of Janice Dotson-Stephens is a tragedy. No one should be held in jail for months before they have been convicted of a crime because they can’t afford to pay a few hundred dollars for bail. Our system of justice is supposed to be blind. It is an injustice that a person with money who has been accused of the same offense and can pay to get out of jail, but a person who can’t pay sits in jail with residual consequences, and in this case, tragically dies in jail. We must reform our broken money bail system.”

The Sheriff’s Office Criminal Investigations Division and the Bexar County Medical Examiner are investigating the death along with the Converse Police Department—which is involved in the investigation because of the Sandra Bland Act.

The Sandra Bland Act requires the Department of Public Safety to appoint a law enforcement agency other than the one operating the jail where an incarcerated person’s death occurred to investigate the death.

Dotson-Stephen’s family said she will be laid to rest on Dec. 28.

https://www.theroot.com/black-grand...B4ub4aNWVpdZou-bX9YbMKOWfD1659SuTc4Y2pPc69NlY​

We definitely need a overhaul in this country of our criminal justice system

 

[MicroBrew]

This is very common in urban poor areas where the officers are from outside the community. But, particularly in Missouri, it's also rampant in rural white areas as well.

If you are working class and especially poor, the system doesn't care much. If you are poor and Black, the system really doesn't give a shit, and many times will just fcuk you over.

 

[Seano]

It does not mention racism. It mentions that this phenomenon disproportionately affects persons and communities of color. It may presume that the reader already knows that black people are more likely to reside in urban pockets where aggressive community policing is more common and justice system funding is less adequate, or that black people tend to be poorer and less able to afford cash bail, or that black people have higher incidence of mental illness. To that end, any topic of criminal justice can be racially charged. It does not, however, mention racism.

Sounds like her issue was poverty and a family that didn't care. Not her skin.

 

[Riberaria377]

I specifically mentioned strategies toward solutions.

If you weren't a previous ban on a month-old throwaway account, you probably wouldn't be purposefully ignoring them, though.

Also, lol @ "easy solution would be having a compassionate family." That's the go-to for conservatives who are incapable of thought. Just like the "promote family values" shtick that never accompanies any actual policy suggestions and is only used to ignore others.

Get back to us all when you figure out how to pass a policy that entitles everyone to a compassionate family.

You didn't propose any policy in this entire thread... I literally asked you what you thought about what policy you thought could prevent this and your answer was vague (more funding). My position wasn't "just promote family values", I said more education for everyone on mental health would help people feel more compassionate to those who have mental health issues. The only solution you proposed was more funding, but how that would be allocated you didn't say. I was asking you an honest question because I saw that you had experience as a public defender, I gave the only solution I feel qualified to give because I am not a lawyer. I was only asking for your opinion, you misrepresented my opinion instead of answering a simple question, because that is a lawyers job, to argue endlessly. That is how lawyers make money

 

[BudKing8806]

What about the countless other persons without family for whom this is the story of their death?

Who else?

 

[Staph infection]

So he family did nothing for 5 months because they thought she was in a mental institution? They did not give a shit about grandma for 5 months but I am sure they care now as they lawyer up.

 

[Cocrehamster]

There's more to this story.

You think Grandma's in hospital for 5 months and don't visit her once?

You’re completely right about the family, but how can you be in jail for 5 months for trespassing? It’s a family and system fail in my opinion.

 

[Trotsky]

You didn't propose any policy in this entire thread... I literally asked you what you thought about what policy you thought could prevent this and your answer was vague (more funding). My position wasn't "just promote family values", I said more education for everyone on mental health would help people feel more compassionate to those who have mental health issues. The only solution you proposed was more funding, but how that would be allocated you didn't say. I was asking you an honest question because I saw that you had experience as a public defender, I gave the only solution I feel qualified to give because I am not a lawyer. I was only asking for your opinion, you misrepresented my opinion instead of answering a simple question, because that is a lawyers job, to argue endlessly. That is how lawyers make money

I specified several, but I'll list them and more to be more explicit:
(1)(a) end cash bail or (b) adjust cash bail and criminal fines based on income, (2) instate mandatory maximum detainment periods for persons charged with misdemeanors, (3) pass more stringent residency requirements for criminal justice employment so that members of a community are policing their own, (4) require minimum number/hours of crisis intervention-trained officers on duty, (5) ban detainment for non-domestic debt collection crimes, (6) increase the funding and presence of traditional psychiatric facilities that are equipped for long-term residence

 

[BEER]

This is sad.

The family wasn't notified but also somehow didn't realize whe was fucking missing for 5 months?

All around shitty situation that could have been avoided with 30 bucks.

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

Wow actually going through that article you linked closely, it's amazing how dishonest you've been this entire thread.

'No racial angle': the title of the article mentions her race.

Then the central message of the whole article is racial 'cash bond system disproportionately affects black people': no, it disproportionately affects poor people.

Then you try to pass of Kamal Harris' ideas off as your own.

And at the end of the day you read an outrage porn clickbait article designed to push the end cash bonds agenda and came to to the 'conclusion' that we should end cash bonds.

What a dishonest and easily led little simpleton you really are.