gracie jiu-jitsu vs. bjj/jj

[cgracie14]

Wow, you're not asking for much are you?:icon_lol: If someone can do that maybe they could also come up with a grand unified theory in physics in their spare time.

that is a lot to ask but if we don't make one unbias just straight up answer we're going have to keep asking the same questions.

sorry if we keep saying that same stuff but like ^ said we pretty much gotta deal with it...

 

[thedoc56**]

Some of the Gracies (*cough* Rorion *cough*) would like you to believe that there is only one "real" jiujitsu -- Gracie Jiujitsu, and everything else is an inferior clone.

This is patently ridiculous on the basis that things that work, work, regardless of what they are called.

Rorion may have an argument that a lot of jiu-jitsu schools overemphasize "sport jiujitsu" and underemphasize "self defence applications of jiujitsu", but this is something that is going to differ school by school, and there are probably many non-gracie schools that have a greater emphasis on "self defence applications" than a gracie school.

Historically however, a lot of the Gracie schools have been seen to be a little more "dogmatic" in their teaching of jiujitsu, whereas most non-Gracie's will have a more open mind. The basic question is this, if you had a choice between going to a doctor from 1910 or 2010, where would you go? Similarly, if you want to learn ground fighting from someone in 1910 or 2010, where would you go?

Also, if the school you're going to is not rolling on a regular basis (re: every class), it should not be classified as brazilian jiujitsu period.

nope

 

[cgracie14]

nope

nope to what? thats not the difference? what is then?

 

[Supereem]

traditional Jujitsu (note the spelling): Of Japanese origin and focuses on throws and various submissions such as wrist locks and armbars. Does not have a position hierarchy like BJJ.

Brazilian Jiujitsu: Derived from early Judo (which in itself is an offshoot from Jujitsu). Has a hierarchy of positions (guard, half guard, side control) and focused on ground fighting with minimal takedowns. Also famous for fighting offensively from ones back (guard). Was developed by the Gracie family (the the tutelage of Count Koma) and depending on you're lineage you will be told that either Helio or Carlos Gracie created the unique style. This is the Jiujitsu that is referred to in MMA bouts, and is one of the major disciplines of MMA and submission grappling.

Gracie Jiujitsu: One of the original names for Brazilian Jiujitsu. Now used exclusively by Rorian Gracie to promote his 'style'. Rorian claims that Gracie Jiujitsu is the 'original' Jiujitsu as taught by Helio Gracie and focuses primarily on self defence. This includes defence against strikes and weapons and is focused for street fighting or unlimited Vale Tudo rules. This is opposed to 'sports' Brazilian Jiujitsu that focuses on submission grappling tournaments and MMA bouts, which in his opinion dilutes the art. However this is controversial, as many believe this is a marketing ploy by Rorian (even other Gracie's believe this, such as those from the Carlos' side of the family).

It is also important to note that some other Gracie's might promote their style as 'insert name' Gracie Jiujitsu, for example Cesar Gracie Jiujitsu. This is just their own specific style of Brazilian Jiujitsu, and is not related to Rorian's Gracie Jiujitsu nor is it considered a new martial art. It is similar to how the Machado's promoted their schools as "Machado Jiujitsu", even though it was still considered Brazilian Jiujitsu.

 

[DonkeyKong]

super super rambo, gimme a couple days ill do some research and do a faq. this has been coming up quite often recently

 

[BJJ Coffee Drinker]

Oswaldo Fadda

who do you train with? Do you train with someone from under that lineage or have you had the privilege of training with the man himself?

 

[lechien]

super super rambo, gimme a couple days ill do some research and do a faq. this has been coming up quite often recently

yes, please.

 

[morote gari**]

Judo already had the triangle (sankaku-gatame), the omoplata (ude-garami), and of course the kimura (gyaku-ude garami).

I just looked the ude-garami up and it's a keylock.

 

[SuperSuperRambo]

super super rambo, gimme a couple days ill do some research and do a faq. this has been coming up quite often recently

That first post you made is pretty solid.

Honestly I could do it myself mostly from memory I think. I'm just too busy/lazy to do it carefully.

 

[futang17]

I just looked the ude-garami up and it's a keylock.

yes the omoplata is a keylock and in judo it's also known as ude garami and sankaku garami

 

[KahleyTriangles]

yes the omoplata is a keylock and in judo it's also known as ude garami and sankaku garami

about time you started learning judo names.

 

[ShindoNinja]

Traditional jiu-jitsu seems to focus more on gaining top control and throws. Several submissions from the bottom were invented by Helio I believe.

Name a submission invented my Helio please.

 

[futang17]

about time you started learning judo names.

LOL quit trolling the boards!

 

[el conquistador]

Oswaldo Fadda

Fadda is like a complete different branch of jiu jitsu right? Isn't Fadda the guy who learned Japanese jiu-jitsu from Maeda along with Helio's father? Or am I just nuts?

 

[el conquistador]

Name a submission invented my Helio please.

Didn't Helio name the Kimura after the guy who did it to him? Or is that urban legend

 

[lord_kader]

Didn't Helio name the Kimura after the guy who did it to him? Or is that urban legend

yes, masahiko kimura. but kimura was already beasting guys all around the world with that move before he fought helio. helio just decided to call it the kimura since he didnt keep any of the traditional japanese names and needed a new name for everything

 

[Saenchai]

delete this thread.

 

[Spazzmaster]

^lol, Yeah, it ain't great.

the "was the kimura named after kimura" thing probably flushed it

 

[Spazzmaster]

And for the record, Kimura didn't invent ude garami either