Gordon Ryan is currently the best No-Gi grappler in the world, Change my Mind

[BIGthingsSON]

This sounds like a white belt discussion. Ppl really comparing buchecha to barnett?

 

[BJJ_Rage]

This sounds like a white belt discussion. Ppl really comparing buchecha to barnett?

No one is comparing their skill set, I’m just saying josh is damn strong and feels like it while grappling...

 

[Foppa21]

He's one of the best, but I don't think he's clearly the best.

I think is most cases at this point in time, anyone can beat anyone on any given day.

 

[yetanother]

He did demonstrate that he can pull something out something new when necessary and rise up to the occasion.
For ADCC when to beat the people who where prepared for leg locks he unveiled his wrestling and roided up. For the no-gi worlds without heel hooks and when he would have been out-wrestled he had his saddle entries.
He isn't the best tho because he gets tapped by Pena every time and doesn't have the most titles.

 

[yetanother]

IThe biggest names Gordon has subbed (not counting EBI overtimes) are Barral, Cyborg, Yuri, Keenan (2x), Aly, Vagner, Duarte, and Jones (2x).

Braulio has subbed Xande, Marcelo Garcia, Andre Galvao and Lovato in a single competition (and beat Vinny).

 

[mataleaos]

Braulio has subbed Xande, Marcelo Garcia, Andre Galvao and Lovato in a single competition (and beat Vinny).

No doubt and I think that Braulio's 2009 ADCC double gold run you are referring to is the single best performance in ADCC history.

But this thread is talking about current no gi grapplers though and Braulio hasn't competed no gi as far as I know since 2014 so I wasn't taking him into consideration. I was just comparing Pena and Gordon in that post you quoted.

He isn't the best tho because he gets tapped by Pena every time and doesn't have the most titles.

Pena took his back in their 2nd match but did not tap him.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Braulio has subbed Xande, Marcelo Garcia, Andre Galvao and Lovato in a single competition (and beat Vinny).

He was talking about present competitors Braulio is semi retired, and Pena didnt subed him every time, he beat him
On points on the last adcc

 

[LugWrenchBjj]

You will obey Gordo Roidin who is the GOAT.

He will come in your gym with his crown on and make your pathetic instructor bow down.
Then tell you to quit jiu jitsu because you suck and are pathetic.

 

[kenetics]

Which is worth not much in a sub only match. Size and power, you said, he just took Barnett, who’s bigger and probably stronger than buchecha...

I don’t think think any of those will be such determinant factor, I do think it will be a great match, but buchechas no gi is not on pair with his gi game...

Barnett is old and nowhere the grappler of buchecha.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Barnett is old and nowhere the grappler of buchecha.

Did I ever said anything about his skills? No I said he’s probably as strong or stronger yhan buchecha... what part in that sentence am I stating he’s as good as buchecha let alone a better grappler

 

[BIGthingsSON]

No one is comparing their skill set, I’m just saying josh is damn strong and feels like it while grappling...

I dont think u can look at josh and kno how a match with buchecha would go. I dont believe in fight math.

 

[kenetics]

Did I ever said anything about his skills? No I said he’s probably as strong or stronger yhan buchecha... what part in that sentence am I stating he’s as good as buchecha let alone a better grappler

OK. He's not stronger too then.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

I dont think u can look at josh and kno how a match with buchecha would go. I dont believe in fight math.

That I don’t agree with

 

[yetanother]

Looks can be super deceiving when it comes to how strong people are but I think it's super likely that if two guys weight about the same the one whose is jacked is stronger the the fat one.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Looks can be super deceiving when it comes to how strong people are but I think it's super likely that if two guys weight about the same the one whose is jacked is stronger the the fat one.

Josh doesn’t weight the same as buchecha though...

 

[yetanother]

Josh doesn’t weight the same as buchecha though...

I'm not sure how heavy they are. Buchecha was 240lbs against Roger, according to some people he is a lot heavier right now because got a real S&C coach instead of doing some crossfity stuff.
Barnett weighted 240 and 256 in his last to fights in 2016.

 

[Ryoto Machida]

To make an argument that Gordon is the best nogi grappler, you'd have to be able to make the statement that Gordon is better than Pena. That simply cannot be done. They've gone at it twice, once under Gordon's ideal rule set, and Pena won handily both times.

You wanna be the man? You gotta beat the man!

 

[mataleaos]

To make an argument that Gordon is the best nogi grappler, you'd have to be able to make the statement that Gordon is better than Pena. That simply cannot be done. They've gone at it twice, once under Gordon's ideal rule set, and Pena won handily both times.

You wanna be the man? You gotta beat the man!

50% of me is with your argument. The other 50% thinks competing in 3x as many nogi matches against better competition, across more rule sets, with 3x as many submissions over high level names should count for something.

They each have one ADCC gold medal each. Gordon has much more recent nogi worlds medals and Pena has never done nogi pans, Ebi, etc.

And yes I know Gordon has lost to him twice.

Pena is the better overall grappler and is better than Gordon in their head to head matches. As a “no gi grappler” I think Gordon has sharper no gi technique and more quality wins in that realm.

But yeah you’re right there’s something to be said for the ric flair approach.

 

[Ryoto Machida]

50% of me is with your argument. The other 50% thinks competing in 3x as many nogi matches against better competition, across more rule sets, with 3x as many submissions over high level names should count for something.

They each have one ADCC gold medal each. Gordon has much more recent nogi worlds medals and Pena has never done nogi pans, Ebi, etc.

And yes I know Gordon has lost to him twice.

Pena is the better overall grappler and is better than Gordon in their head to head matches. As a “no gi grappler” I think Gordon has sharper no gi technique and more quality wins in that realm.

But yeah you’re right there’s something to be said for the ric flair approach.

My thinking is "If they were to fight a third time, who would my money be on?"

And that answer is still Pena.

 

[mataleaos]

My thinking is "If they were to fight a third time, who would my money be on?"

And that answer is still Pena.

Same here man. I will bet on Pena against Gordon until they win.

And this is the way most people look at it. They're probably right.

I'm just playing devil's advocate and presenting an alternate viewpoint. If you put Gordon and Ryan against the 8 best guys you can find, I think Ryan will win at least as many times as Pena and have more subs than Pena. But head the head I think Pena beats Ryan.

For example I think Cobrinha had a clearly better no gi career than Rafa Mendes did. But Rafa beat Cobrinha no gi in 2 out of their 3 matches so most people would disagree with me on that.