good or bad to train with people much better than you?

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JH34PG

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hey guys...i have previous no gi experience from about 3 years ago...seems like forever...but so only about 5 months or so...

anyway joined a Gi school. ive been training for about a month. def making progression and things are coming back from the 3 years ago..

however at my school...its very small classes...one guys a stripe blue whose won naga many many times, another is a high green who won his division at naga...the other is a three stripe white.

i sometimes get frustrated because when we roll...i cant really pull off too much stuff that we learn...most frustrating part is trying to pass their guard.

do you think this means when i train/compete with white belts i should do well? or not because i dont have experience pulling off subs/sweeps when rolling?
 
Dave Camarillo Message Board :: View topic - Lessons from a Camarillo. Questionable breakthrough?

Posted by Dave Camarillo:

You need three experiences when you train.

-getting dominated
-dominating others
-close battles

I have seen many get really good because their partners are a similar level as they are. I have also seen many get really good when they are up against higher levels.
For the most part you need a good mindset. I have seen many thwart their progress because of cognitive distortions (Cognitive distortion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia).

Like Rambo said, the mind is the most powerful weapon!
 
If you had to choose one or the other...

"People much better than you" is much more beneficial to your game than the "people worse than you".

You can ask the better partners to let you work, you can't ask the lesser partners to be better. You will probably also pick up more things when you are getting smashed, like the saying goes "you tap, you learn".
 
You might find harder to finish your opponents due to lack of practice. But it is better that having a lack of defense due to training against lower belts.

training with all levels is a must.
 
TalkShowOnMute said:
Dave Camarillo Message Board :: View topic - Lessons from a Camarillo. Questionable breakthrough?

Posted by Dave Camarillo:

You need three experiences when you train.

-getting dominated
-dominating others
-close battles

I have seen many get really good because their partners are a similar level as they are. I have also seen many get really good when they are up against higher levels.
For the most part you need a good mindset. I have seen many thwart their progress because of cognitive distortions (Cognitive distortion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia).

Like Rambo said, the mind is the most powerful weapon!
Click to expand...


I agree with this
 
"good or bad to train with people much better than you?"


Not to be a dick, but how can you even ask that?
 
Mumrik said:
"good or bad to train with people much better than you?"


Not to be a dick, but how can you even ask that?
Click to expand...

of course its good...just wish there were some beginners so i can really so my progress on other whites
 
JH34PG said:
hey guys...i have previous no gi experience from about 3 years ago...seems like forever...but so only about 5 months or so...

anyway joined a Gi school. ive been training for about a month. def making progression and things are coming back from the 3 years ago..

however at my school...its very small classes...one guys a stripe blue whose won naga many many times, another is a high green who won his division at naga...the other is a three stripe white.

i sometimes get frustrated because when we roll...i cant really pull off too much stuff that we learn...most frustrating part is trying to pass their guard.

do you think this means when i train/compete with white belts i should do well? or not because i dont have experience pulling off subs/sweeps when rolling?
Click to expand...

I can honestly feel your pain, I was going through the exact same problem. What I did was tell them to just let me practice on them for a couple times. When we start rolling I just basically try to strengthen my defense. I have REALLY good defense because of the fact that everyone I roll with is so much more experienced than I. I try to roll with my brothers at home and teach them as well just so I'm not rolling with noobs. It is better for us though. Just remember to focus on defense. It wouldnt hurt to get beat either. The more I lose, the more eager to win I get.
 
JH34PG said:
of course its good...just wish there were some beginners so i can really so my progress on other whites
Click to expand...

I feel you. you are at a stage where a lot of people quit because they do not see the improvements.

just hang in there and some new guys will eventually turn up.
 
lechien said:
I feel you. you are at a stage where a lot of people quit because they do not see the improvements.

just hang in there and some new guys will eventually turn up.
Click to expand...

i def wont quit...i love the sport...and i am seeing improvements. just id love to be the one with all the experience tooling the new guys...but my day will come
 
The place I train has a lot of people better than me, a few people that give me close fights and a couple people I can beat.

Even if you tap out 30 times in one night, if you tap one person out that night, it makes you feel accomplished.
 
When I was a white belt I trained for several months with a tough black belt whose own school had closed and he was basically floating around gyms for awhile. I got tapped so many times by him, but my defense got amazingly good in a short amount of time. I credit that time more than any other with improving my game. Once I knew I could defend adequately against a black belt I got so much more comfortable with taking risks against others because even if I lost position I knew I wasn't going to get tapped. This totally opened up my game to new things I would have never even thought of trying.
 
The joy of BJJ was reawakened in me when I moved to a school populated by people that could smash me.

Finally, someone to challenge me a make me better than I was when I walked in that day.

Working with people that you can easily beat is useful for development, but it can't be the only thing you do.
 
Once a week, I go to Seattle to train with a different GB gym... just so I can get my ass kicked.
 
I am one of my schools smaller higher ranking purples, and when speaking with very strong white and purples they find it harder to submit me but easier to dominate position.

But with people who are their same weight they have to fight hard to get there but once there their defense is not as strong.

Its kinda like being known for a strong chin. You don't really wanna be known for it but if you do get hit you want it.

I will say that when I was white belt and being 165 I have always been trampled. That lesson has taught me a lot about fining the small wholes in opponents submissions. It is very hard for me to dominate a blue at 255 but that being said I can sneak out of his subs and buy myself time.

Personally I wish I where bigger but if I where 250 I think I would have learned differently. Not better or worse but different.

You learn a whole hell of a lot by getting your butt kicked.
 
I like an even mix of both to be honest. On techigue nights I am top dog and have 10-15submissions as a two stripe white belt and feel great. Then on sparring/rolling nights all our blues, purples and browns are there and I am low man on the totem poll getting tapped left and right. It's a good mix really.
 
JH34PG said:
of course its good...just wish there were some beginners so i can really so my progress on other whites
Click to expand...

Hey man, i used to be in the EXACTLY same boat as you. When i started, i was the smallest guy by at least 20kilos and eveyrone had a few years experiance. I used to get dominated for months, i used to think my game wasnt improving.. but it slowly was. my escapes were getting better, my defense was really good, even though i literally had no submision/attack game. Now after months of domination, i feel i am a considerable threat lol even though i do get tapped alot i put up a good fight, am always on the prowl for sweeps and subs and a majority of the class cant take me lightly.
Stick to it man, you're getting better but you just dont realize it.
You'll see when a new guy comes, how you will dominate them and you will recognize your progres!
keep at it :)
 
When we roll at our school I always go for the best guys in the gym. I do like a 3:1 or 4:1 ratio.

I try and roll with a couple people who are better than I am, then I throw in a weaker opponent.

Rolling with good guys make me play a right tight game. I need to secure positions before trying to advance or else I lose position, get swept, or get submitted.

When I roll with weaker opponents I get to try new things, but my game isn't as tight as it should be.

It's nice to roll with weaker people because you can pull off more moves, but I would focus on the better guys. Tell them to want to know what good and bad things you do and go over it when you are done rolling.
 
I'm lucky because when I train no gi I have a guy who is incredible and has a 10lb advantage who has taught me everything and a guy my size who has learned a bit more than me and a kid that I just roll with whenever his partner takes a break who I dominate. this really helps accomplish the three elements of training in grappling.
 
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