Funaki's 22 lb theory

[zuffazombee]

The only man I know who had the courage to go heavier was Robbie Lawler.

Please tell me this is a joke.

Is this a gimmick account?

 

[Amerikuracana]

Naw..

 

[Kthankss]

Yoshiyuki yoshida fought significantly overweighing and younger Anthony Johnson in the UFC. If I were his manager, I would have told him to decline to fight.

Yoshiro maeda fought someone in WEC who didn't pass at weigh in. Maeda was crazy enough to say "no problem. Let's fight" and got his ass kicked next day.

They don't understand being Japanese is already a huge physical disadvantage in full contact combat sport against western fighters even when weights match. Giving up additional pounds could be pretty suicidal.

This entire thread is weird and reading this makes me think you are an insecure Asian male trying to find reasons/excuses why they can’t compete...

 

[Xuh]

Has Funaki never heard of Horiguchi?

Does this genetic disadvantage also apply to Koreans and Chinese lol?

Let's ask 'Stun Gun' Kim :

 

[NicholasJBasile]

I have tons of respect for Funaki and am a fan of his... but gosh that is some bullocks lol Maybe I'm taking it out of context?

 

[Richard Fannin]

They don't understand being Japanese is already a huge physical disadvantage in full contact combat sport against western fighters even when weights match. Giving up additional pounds could be pretty suicidal.

I'd be really interested in seeing you finally adress 14.09's points =>

You bring this thing up often. It's almost as if you were obsessed about it. Funaki or anybody can say whatever, but you still haven't been able to address the obvious discrepancy, how East Asians fare so well, and partly even dominate, in such power/explosiveness requiring sports like judo, wrestling, kick-boxing, boxing, weight-lifting, sprinting (they are faster than whites these days), gymnastics, speed-skating, swimming (short distances require explosiveness) etc.

The more likely reasons in MMA seem to be cultural. First of all MMA isn't that big in Japan anymore, and the training methods there never seemed to appreciate strength training like in other countries or even in other sports in Japan. Not to mention game planning. It was always less of a sport and more about fighting spirit, going and killing or getting killed.

&

Also, most of Japanese MMA fighters always fought underweight compared to their opponents, especially in Pride, but it also continued in UFC. Including the succesful ones, like Misaki, Gono, Ishida, Chonan, Yoshida, Nakamura, not to mention the obvious Sakurabas and Minowas. So bringing up two random cases of the opposite doesn't prove much or even seem to make sense.

Thank you

 

[14.09]

I'd be really interested in seeing you finally adress 14.09's points =>



&



Thank you

Thank you. This isn't the first time either. I think I have disproven his "theory" at least twice before here on Sherdog, and every time he just ignores it, and at some point starts a new thread with this same bullshit. I remember I used to like his insight on Japanese MMA, but there's something weird about this thing.

 

[Richard Fannin]

I remember I used to like his insight on Japanese MMA, but there's something weird about this thing.

No problem man; I posted this because I, indeed, do remember you speaking up against his theory in a previous thread, and I was interested in his response back then too.

JacJean just ignoring your posts made me think that, for some reason, he may have blocked you? So he legit didn't see your posts...
But after bumping this thread, I noticed that he liked on of your posts ITT, so that was not the issue...

And just to be clear, I've also always enjoyed reading JacJean's posts (posters like him who speak Japanese and are knowledgeable in JMMA were the reason the WW forum has always been my favorite part of sherdog), so I'm really not writting all that to bash him or gang up on the guy...
Much like you, I'm just a bit weirded out by some of his more recent posts, and I'd like to understand what's up.

 

[JacJeanFinger]

Richie and 1409 cooperating to get my response is more weird than anything written here. I never skipped reading when you guys posted on the threads I had started or gotten involved with, let alone ignoring them.

I actually wrote something in the form of a response to 1409 in 2 paragraphs to discuss contemporary judo and posted earlier when 1409 was viewing this thread. After I assumed it was read by him, I edited the message into completely different contents.

I don't think there's much left to debate because Funaki's wild statement has taken shape with contributions from the posters including 1409.

 

[JacJeanFinger]

I introduced Funaki's 10 kg theory by creating this thread because I found it interesting and true to some extent. Of course it isn't a math formula or any type of scientific discovery. Finding faults may not be the most difficult thing to do but nobody can deny there's some convincing rightness in it.

In America and also in modern china and most of europe, one's intelligence is measured and accredited by his education = skill, knowledge, ability to construct thoughts and directions that he acquired thru courses of academic engagement at known educational institutes. While education is a part of it, Japanese people traditionally believe that intelligence is something you were born with or you gain from inspirations and imaginations, often not associated with learned or trained traits.

Funaki is a secondary school dropout but people still listen to what he asserts and respect his unique way of viewing the world. In elsewhere, a person who rambles on desultory original thinkings is called comedian.

 

[Richard Fannin]

Sorry about the miscommunication JacJean, if I didn't think that you were an interesting poster I wouldn't have insisted like that to get your views...
As much as I appreciate Japanese culture (or at least the small parts I've been exposed to while traveling there), it's indeed something that is hard to grasp for me.

So, thanks for explaining this.

I remember when Minowa used to give lectures in colleges, and how much I'd love to be able to understand that language & culture.
Sadly I can't find the right key-words to google it right now, but it seemed fun.

 

[rob mafia]

Minowa won a Super Hukl tournament defying this theory

*hluk

 

[plataoplombo]

There might be some truth to what Funaki said. Asian fighters on average do seem to be smaller than their western counterpart but that could be due to weight cutting and training regiment. For those of you that have trained, what did you notice?

 

[Idonotbelieveit]

Funaki along with Suzuki
Are catch gods
Believe what they say

 

[14.09]

I actually wrote something in the form of a response to 1409 in 2 paragraphs to discuss contemporary judo and posted earlier when 1409 was viewing this thread. After I assumed it was read by him, I edited the message into completely different contents.

I actually saw the post, but as I came back to reply to it, it was gone. I thought that you must have realised yourself, how unreasoned and just crazy your claim was. You said something along the lines, that if Americans had a proper program for judo, Japan wouldn't have a single champion. You don't really think that, right? That American judokas would take all the championships away from the Japanese? Because a monster like Shohei Ono is somehow weak or physically inferior?

I don't think there's much left to debate because Funaki's wild statement has taken shape with contributions from the posters including 1409.

I'm sorry, I'm not a native English speaker, so it's not absolutely clear to me, what you think of this all. Or maybe it's not clear to yourself either.

 

[14.09]

There might be some truth to what Funaki said. Asian fighters on average do seem to be smaller than their western counterpart but that could be due to weight cutting and training regiment. For those of you that have trained, what did you notice?

Yes, Japanese are smaller than westerners on average, and yes, the Japanese MMA fighters often overlook weight cutting, and end up being the smaller fighter. But weaker they are not, when compared to people their own size.

 

[Richard Fannin]

There might be some truth to what Funaki said. Asian fighters on average do seem to be smaller than their western counterpart but that could be due to weight cutting and training regiment.

Yes, but to go as far as saying that for a fair MMA bout, a Japanese fighter needs to be 10 kilos heavier than his white/black/brown/etc opponent is a very different story.
There are so many fights in which a Japanese fighter looked more skilled than his western opponent, and ended up losing because he was simply overpowered in the end.

But a 10 kg advantage? From all the fights we've seen in MMA, kickboxing, grappling, etc, it just doesn't seem right...

All that talk of Japanese heavyweights makes me regret more than ever that Naoya Ogawa didn't fight more in MMA.
A true Japanese HW with a strong Judo base, I really wish he did more in PRIDE instead of going full pro-wrestling.

As a kid one of my heroes was the legendary French Judoka David Douillet, who had a rivalry with Ogawa (they competed against each other 3 times in Judo, and apparently really disliked each other),

so I was really pumped when "Captain Hustle" transitioned to MMA... but sadly, he wasn't in for the long run, even if losing to Fedor and one of his other Judo rivals in Yoshida was nothing to be ashamed of.

Let's hope Ogawa's son, the very young and promising Yusei Ogawa (already a decorated Judoka at 24), a heavyweight like his father, will pick up an interest in MMA.
It seems a bit unlikely at the time, but...

 

[JacJeanFinger]

>> There are so many fights in which a Japanese fighter looked more skilled than his western opponent, and ended up losing because he was simply overpowered in the end. But a 10 kg advantage? From all the fights we've seen in MMA, kickboxing, grappling, etc, it just doesn't seem right...

This sums up well. Thanks. Weight gap in question could be adjusted if you know how to adjust on behalf of sensei Funaki.

Takumi Yano travelled to Brazil to prepare himself for ADCC and he wrote something like this on his blog about 20 years ago.

"Hello everyone. I'm here in brazil....to improve my bjj obviously. I was accepted by an awesome team in barra where I grapple so many guys a day. It's great to be here. What surprised me the most in fact is not their skill level.....but conditioning and strength. I think their far superior physicality had developed by long exhausting spar under such high temperatures. Well, I'll write more when I can. Don't tell master horibe I train jiujitsu, all right? "

 

[JacJeanFinger]

Dad of koji murofushi, a hammer throw Olympic gold medalist from Japan says he married koji's slav mother because he wanted his son to not undergo genetic disadvantage for being pure Asian and win world titles. As a result, we know Koji murofushi is a very successful product of natural genetic engineering.

 

[14.09]

Still doesn't prove the claim of East Asians being weaker (or less explosive or what was it before). MMA (and also judo at least before) didn't emphasize strength training in Japan. Add the lack of weight cutting/wrong weight classes to that. The approach was more about mental and technical war. The fighting culture, not genes. And all the other sports I mentioned before prove that. When East Asians actually do train strength, they are as strong as anybody (of their size).

Hammer throwing is another thing. It doesn't have weight classes. You just have to be huge. The likelihood of finding such big man in Japan and him choosing sports for living and then choosing hammer throwing and then getting elite training and competition in a country that lacks men big enough for the scene to strive is slim. So yeah, if you're Japanese and want to design a hammer throw champion out of your son, it could be wise to marry a European (or find a huge Japanese).