Frequency related to increase in skill.

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by tiny_pup, Jan 26, 2006.

  1. tiny_pup

    tiny_pup King Carl! Banned

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    I was wondering, probably most from some kind of psychological viewpoint...
    What do you think of the differences in attending grappling class 3times/week for 1h15-30min and attending grappling class 2 times/week for 2 hrs?
    I realize that when you have 3 shorter training periods more time goes to warm-up, etc.
    But are there psychological advantages to doing a little less more often?

    I could imagine that since you do a smaller number of techniques in the shorter sessions that you get more focused than if you'd try to cram in more techniques in succession, but that's just a guess...

    Whaddya think, folks?
     
  2. krellik

    krellik Gimli son of Cisco

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    Yep the 3 sessions should give more. What happens in you head after training is just as important as the training itself if you understand what I mean.
     
  3. clarkgriswold

    clarkgriswold White Belt

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    Maybe it's a slightly different question, but for me the options are kind of whether to take an hour class and roll for close to an hour probably like twice per week, or take class 3-4 times per week and train after class less.

    I'm a bit old, so if I train after class for a significant amount of time, I often feel so beat up that it takes a couple of days before I feel up to going back. Staying for longer times each day doesn't usually mean cramming more new techniques into each day, but rather in class it's the same/similar pattern where (after "warmups") start instruction with one technique and work 3-5 or so variations or other options from the same position, then open mat and train.

    I generally think I improve more by increasing my open mat/free roll time even if it's at the expense of a couple of classes, because if I took more classes and spent less time rolling, I'm working less on all other techniques and basics besides those we work on/drill in that class, if that makes any sense.

    But I still find myself leaving at the end of class rather than staying and rolling more often than I'd like due to soreness/pain/tiredness.
     
  4. Matt Thornton

    Matt Thornton Amateur Fighter

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    Being a young guy (17), and extremely enthusiastic about MMA, the first 8 or 9 months of my training, I just wanted to come in a roll and spar endlessly. I figured I'd take the Straight Blast Gym concept of "Aliveness" to the next level and just maximize sparring and rolling time.

    Now that I've been away from MMA (except for Sundays) for 2 months, I've really started to realize the benefits of drilling and lighter-intensity training. I got the Grappling Drills DVD by Stephan Kesting, and already I am noticing results from it (even though I've barely been using it). Randori (rolling) is what makes BJJ effective, but that doesn't mean repetition drilling and light training are not equally as important.

    My advice to you is varying intensity and including variety in your training regimen. If you just roll hard all the time, no matter what your age, you're eventually going to hurt something, and studies also show that if you do not periodize your training, you will stop benefiting from such hard training.

    For example, if you had 3 classes per week, here would be a VERY basic plan:

    "A" Day: Normal Class, stay after 30-45 minutes and drill
    "B" Day: Normal Class, stay after 30-45 minutes and roll LIGHT
    "C" Day: Normal Class, stay after 30-45 minutes and roll hard

    Just out of curiousity, what level are you at? If you're beginner-intermediate, drilling is extremely important. Staying after just a half hour to do drills and technique repetition will work techniques and grappling movements into your muscle memory. This shortens your synapses, meaning that you will be able to perform the technique CORRECTLY in a shorter amount of time with very little time to think about it. Rolling will give you the timing, resistance, and experience you need to apply the moves, but without drilling, you really are only halfway there. I'm only realizing this now.

    Also, your age might have less to do with feeling "beat up" than you think. I'm known to be one of the most conditioned people in my gym, and even I have trained so hard that I wake up the next morning to feel like I've been hit by a truck. Like I said before, you need to vary intensity, on top of a proper diet and a good sleep schedule. Try mixing up the intensity and type of work you're doing, make sure you're getting 7-8 hours of sleep minimum, and take in a diet of about 60% carbs, 30% protein, and 30% fat. If you're not already doing all that, try that out, and see how much of a difference it makes.


    To answer the original poster, it depends on what you're training for, where you are in your plan, etc. If you're preparing for a fight, you want to be training very short, intense sessions at your peak. If you're at the beginning phase of your plan, longer sessions dedicated more to technique training are better.

    You don't necessarily have to learn "more techniques" in a longer class period. It's really a better approach to limit the amount of techniques you're learning and drill them as many times as possible. Don't stop when you think you "have" the move. Keep drilling it until you can make it instinctive. I forget who said it, but there was a quote I heard once, "The wise man is afraid to learn something new before applying what he has already learned" or something like that.
     
  5. Matt Thornton

    Matt Thornton Amateur Fighter

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    What you're noticing is an improvement in your timing and your ability to deal with a resisting opponent. My progress skyrocketed the first few months of my training just from doing lots of rolling (not to mention my conditioning). I was learning lots of moves off of DVDs and just coming in and rolling endlessly.

    After a while, I hit some noticeable plateaus. For example, I NEVER hit an armbar from guard, or even came anywhere close to it. It's considered a basic movement and I'm only just starting to get the hang of it, because I neglected drilling the basics.

    The basics can get really boring, and we all tend to think we're "above" them, but without drilling them, you're going to have trouble finishing someone. They also make a great workout for when you want to keep it light on your body.

    Also, when you are rolling, and you've designated a "hard" rolling day, push yourself. When you feel out of breath and your brain is thinking "Maybe I'll just go hit the showers..." shut off that little voice and dedicate yourself to at least one more round. Keep doing this and you will notice big gains in your conditioning.
     
  6. Ouch That Hurt

    Ouch That Hurt White Belt

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    Tiny- It all comes down to the instructor. My instructor breaks everything down in to a simplistic strategy based way. He shows us how to do something then the counter and we branch of from one idea for the class which is usually mentioned by a student at the beginning. (2 1/2 hour classes with roll time) Only 2 nights a week

    I have been to other schools and they cover 1 move from 6 different setups and have left thinking that was a waste. So you leave hearing the various ways of doing an arm bar but dont remember it and dont drill it nearly enough to understand it, or what your opponent will do to prevent it. So when you try it you fail almost everytime. (1 hour with no roll time) But they offer 5 nights a week, which you will need to be able to learn anything..

    Clark- If I find myself tired, hurt, sore whatever Ill find someone during the roll time to just drill some stuff in a more rolling format. Set up 1 min drills say of someone trying to pass my guard at 50-60% and they do whatever they want and slowly increase the resistance/pressure they are giving you (to what your body can handle). I think it is actually better than free rolling because you are taking time to perfect your movement with resistance. Because when you learn technique most of the time your partner isn't trying to squish you. And if someone is really going after you, you miss subtle things that make a move work or not work.
     

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