Former top Vatican official says pope should resign over abuse crisis

[jax7]

Dude. .. I said reflection and change. See if you had reflected on what I wrote before you tried to assert your position you would not have missed that.

I apologize for my oversight.

 

[franklinstower]

I apologize for my oversight.

No problem man. I've done the same plenty. Good will to you.

 

[DIDM]

That's the point I'm trying to make: Forget about the religion aspect. If you strip that away, you're left with a massive organization that has a systemic problem with pedophilia (i can't think of too many things I would really consider 'evil', but pedophilia qualifies) Then consider that there's constantly new cases emerging, and now we know that the highest levels (including the current pope) of the organization had prior knowledge of this behaviour. That's called a cover-up, it's not complicated. If this were any other entity, a secular charity or a business for example, we would shut that shit down fast, it wouldn't matter who was running it. And it's irrelevant in this case as well, there's a problem that hasn't been dealt with (if you believe that only one or two generations of priests indulged in this behaviour, you're simply coming to illogical conclusions), and any leadership that comes from within that organization will not be sufficient to root it out. Hence, open it all up, let independent investigators see how long this has been going on for, and just how extensive it really is.

They are getting folks to joke about it now to try and normalize it

 

[jax7]

@Grenz , @franklinstower , @luckyshot

Don't let this story die. There is a very well backed rumor that Cardinal Wuerl, who is Cardinal (rapist) McCarrick's succesor to D.C. Archdiocese and personal protege of him, is in hiding in Washington D.C. They are trying to secret him off to the Vatican where he will have immunity. This is because of the testimony of the hero Bishop Vigano. They fear there will be a RICO investigation and he will be arrested/testify against many others including the Pope.

 

[luckyshot]

In my opinion it would be good if the whole Catholic Church dismantled. The theology is so far off.

Worship of Mary, and this belief that they need to do works or penance for forgiveness of sins. It's heretical teaching and leads people to believe they are saved by their own works. Not saved by grace, through faith in Christ alone.

The unbiblical requirement of celebacy has recruited priests with "other attractions" besides women that has led to the homosexual and pedo problem that's rampant in the church.

The Catholic church is the perfect example of how money and power can corrupt.

There is only one Church. It has the following characteristics-- all supported explicitly by scripture-- catholic, apostolic, perpetual.

"Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answering, said to him: Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-Jona: because flesh and blood hath not revealed it to thee, but my Father Who is in Heaven. And I say to thee: Thou art Peter; and upon this Rock I will build My Church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it." (Matthew 16:16-18)

 

[jax7]

There is only one Church. It has the following characteristics-- all supported explicitly by scripture-- catholic, apostolic, perpetual.

"Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answering, said to him: Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-Jona: because flesh and blood hath not revealed it to thee, but my Father Who is in Heaven. And I say to thee: Thou art Peter; and upon this Rock I will build My Church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it." (Matthew 16:16-18)

Instead of shooting the metaphorical fish in the barrel replying to ripskater. Why dont you respond to the issue I just posted about? You still have not responded in any way to the facts I presented about the Pope's inner circle of homosexuals who have protected abusers.

 

[Ripskater]

There is only one Church. It has the following characteristics-- all supported explicitly by scripture-- catholic, apostolic, perpetual.

"Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answering, said to him: Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-Jona: because flesh and blood hath not revealed it to thee, but my Father Who is in Heaven. And I say to thee: Thou art Peter; and upon this Rock I will build My Church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it." (Matthew 16:16-18)

There is one church, one body of redeemed believers. However the Catholic Church has a very high percent of attendees who are not saved. It's the same with other churches as well.

 

[zebby23]

There is one church, one body of redeemed believers. However the Catholic Church has a very high percent of attendees who are not saved. It's the same with other churches as well.

So many religions and they cannot all be right... but they can all be wrong

 

[jax7]

There is one church, one body of redeemed believers. However the Catholic Church has a very high percent of attendees who are not saved. It's the same with other churches as well.

Thank you your holyness pope ripskater the first, for your elaborate theological exegesis. We are grateful that God himself has proclaimed you the infallible interpreter of scripture.

 

[jax7]

Let's stick to real issue Catholic or not. We need to keep pressure on these men to get the truth and punish them with the full force of the law.

 

[Ripskater]

So many religions and they cannot all be right... but they can all be wrong

Not all religions are correct, but I believe one is.

 

[Ripskater]

Thank you your holyness pope ripskater the first, for your elaborate theological exegesis. We are grateful that God himself has proclaimed you the infallible interpreter of scripture.

I'm not Holy, only God is. I'm a wretched sinner in need of God's grace and forgiveness.

 

[zebby23]

Not all religions are correct, but I believe one is.

Billions of other people believe theirs to be correct, but you're special.

 

[rearnakedchoke]

Catholics around the world need to stage a protest. Since the money they give goes to defending these pedophiles. They need to not give any money for a year or until the church gives in and takes a stand saying any member accused wont be reassigned and will not be given church funds to defend themselves. Like any good business, and they are one of the best, they will have to do something.

 

[luckyshot]

I'm not Holy, only God is. I'm a wretched sinner in need of God's grace and forgiveness.

Then follow his instructions.

Billions of other people believe theirs to be correct, but you're special.

Well, he is a mod's alt-troll account. So...

 

[luckyshot]

@jax7

I pray that the Pope accepts the full recommendations of the USCCB and names a apostolic visitor to investigate the McCarrick matter including the claims in Cardinal Vigano's letter.

However, I fall far short of calling for His Holiness' resignation. One papal resignation per century is enough.

 

[lfd0311]

Just for reference, check out this guy's back and forth political war with his own brother, who is also a priest....

 

[cooks1]

Basically. The conservative wing of the Catholic Church loathes Pope Francis and is trying to pin a problem that is decades— probably centuries— old on him. Pure crap.

Pope Francis has been the most open Pope, by far. He has admitted the scale, depth, and scandal of the abuse, something no other Pope has even come close to doing.

The Church has failed miserably in not expelling these abusive priests much earlier,. but it is simply false, statistically, that Catholic priests are more likely to abuse children than any other group of men

I am an atheist. But I agree that this is the least shitty Pope in LOOONNNNGGGG time.

Without necessarily agreeing to the assertions of your link, I think the covering up is just as much, if not an even greater crime.

It's not merely a matter of failing to expel them quickly enough. It is the matter of deliberating concealing and actively covering up the most heinous of crimes. Which in itself is a criminal act.

In what other entity would this not be prosecuted? If I was a HS principal, and I discovered one of my teachers was sexually abusing their students, and I just covered it up and moved the teacher to a different class, what do you expect would happen to me? I would go to jail.

There were literally hundreds of Catholic clergy involved in these cover-ups. It's not about them just being expelled from the clergy. Every single one of those people is a criminal. This will never be made right until they deal with the same legal consequences that an average person would.

 

[KONG-D'SNT-TAP]

The pope geezer knows how to reduce all the molestation, let priests marry once again.

This wouldn’t change a thing.

People aren’t fucking kids because they can’t get married.

Plus your theory would make sense if married men weren’t molesting kids. But they are.

 

[cooks1]

Per NPR:

https://www.npr.org/2018/08/26/6420...-long-knew-about-abuse-calls-on-him-to-resign

I'm not saying Vigano is a bad priest or a bad man, but he is an ideological conservative who has had an axe to grind with Francis since the beginning of his papacy. This doesn't automatically make his accusations false, but it does make me take them with several grains of salt.

Ummmmm.......Why can't all Vigano's allegations be true and also have nothing to do with homosexuality in the church? Given what we already know to be true, it does not really seem that far fetched, does it?

As far as the brazen insubordination of calling for the Pope's resignation rather than for the situation to be remedied-- only God can judge him, but priests have been excommunicated for less. As a Catholic-- lay or ordained-- you don't just get to call on the Pope to resign, even if you think he has made grave mistakes. That is promoting disobedience, fractiousness, non-orthodoxy, and, ultimately, schism.

Oh, Lucky.......I can't believe you came out with this one. We are normally so close on these things.

People should never, ever, enter an organization or group where the open criticism and scrutiny of it's leaders or doctrine is considered disobedience, or being a 'suppressive person', or whatever they choose to call it. That is, quite literally, one of the fundamental cornerstones of a cult.