Forcing halfguard - a viable strategy?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by traficante, Oct 10, 2013.

  1. traficante

    traficante White Belt

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    So I've started training Gi BJJ. Since my experience is primarely in No Gi (ADCC type) submission grappling I am having to adapt to the realities of the Gi game. More and more I am finding my self forcing halfguard insted of initiating any pass in particular. What I mean by "forcing" my oponent into halfguard is putting them in halfguard and flattening them onto their back while also having an underhook.
    From there I just do the basic halfguard pass and so far this has been working for me since at the other place where I train we practice it alot.
    So my question is: is this a viable strategy or is such thinking just a rookie mistake that is going to backfire somewere along the line?
     
  2. SuperSuperRambo

    SuperSuperRambo Senior Moderator Senior Moderator

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    Yeah, it's a viable strategy, nothing wrong with that. I would say you want to diversify your passing game in case that doesn't work, but it's fine in and of itself.
     
  3. Dirty Holt

    Dirty Holt Black Belt Professional Fighter

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    For anyone over 6' tall, forcing half guard is my go to game if they are any good. For shorter opponents, I can usually avoid half guard and use leverage.

    Taller guys have an advantage with distance that half guard top can take away.

    Smaller guys have an advantage in half guard bottom in terms of mobility and positioning that using leverage and pressure during guard passes can take away.
     
  4. ijustwannasurf

    ijustwannasurf Brown Belt

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    That's my main passing strategy. I prefer the inside underhook, then smashing to mount.
     
  5. SuperSuperRambo

    SuperSuperRambo Senior Moderator Senior Moderator

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    Just to add something else, if you want to see someone at a high level using that passing strategy, check out DJ Jackson (say what you will, he is high level). I think his game is shit to watch, but he has a consistent passing strategy that works for him, and he usually forces his way into half guard, even against good black belts. And consistent with what Holt said, DJ is more of a stocky build.
     
  6. Lasse

    Lasse Green Belt

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    In theory yes; but it seems like you didn't specify at all HOW you get them on their back or HOW you force half guard.

    Those two things aren't very easily accomplished without you knowing how to pass the knee-shield, tornado guard, deep half guard and possibly even butterfly?
     
  7. nodferatu

    nodferatu Drilling in the south

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    What does knowing how to pass the knee shield, tornado, DHG, and butterfly have to do with how he gets them on their back? :)
     
  8. traficante

    traficante White Belt

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    Thanks for the tip on Jackson, I'm not familiar with his game at all. All I (think) know about him is that he's one of Lloyd Irvin's guys.
    Regarding your other post - drilling and using other passes is something that I'll definently be doing.
     
  9. traficante

    traficante White Belt

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    Well you could be right but I'm 6'3'' and in my expercience it's been easier to pass the halfguards of shorter people.
     
  10. traficante

    traficante White Belt

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    Tornado guard is rarely used where I train so I don't have much experience with it. Infact only two guys use it and one of them gives me as much trouble in just about every other form of guard - he's above my current level and an active competitor.

    Deep Half - I usualy don't let them get there in the first place.

    With butterfly guard I try to neutralize their hooks, lift the legs to put them on their back and then just literally force halfguard.

    Knee-shield or Z-guard hower really hinders this strategy. Currently I am experimenting with leg drags to clear it but I'd take all advice on how else to deal with it.
     
  11. Dirty Holt

    Dirty Holt Black Belt Professional Fighter

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    Well then in theory, why the fuck would you force half guard top if you have no idea on how to pass half guard?
     
  12. TheSubmissionCh

    TheSubmissionCh Green Belt

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    In theory, to win by advantage. - E
     
  13. Dirty Holt

    Dirty Holt Black Belt Professional Fighter

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    If you think putting yourself in a position that you dont know how to score from will somehow get you a win, I would question your competition strategies.
     
  14. TheSubmissionCh

    TheSubmissionCh Green Belt

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    If you think BJJ players go into competitions with even a modicum of strategy in mind, I would question how much time you spent around the average hobbyist. - E
     
  15. berimBOWLoh

    berimBOWLoh Silver Belt

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    DJ is a good example. I also think Gui Mendes is a great example and he isnt that stocky. Passing from HG is just a great strategy if used well for any body type. I believe Gui passes from HG via knee slide over 80% of the time.

    Its one of my fav ways to pass as well but i also like using a "sit out" style top half guard coupled with the Lo style knee slide once the leg is free.
     
  16. Dirty Holt

    Dirty Holt Black Belt Professional Fighter

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    Touch
     
  17. traficante

    traficante White Belt

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    Like I said I've been doing Gi BJJ for a ver short amount of time and am not familiar with the rule set. The only reason why I use this strategy is because I feel comfortable passing halfguard. I'm guessing what you are saying is that in theory (lol) I can get an advantage in a BJJ comp for flattening my oponent in halfguard?
     
  18. Lasse

    Lasse Green Belt

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    You clearly don't understand what I was saying I'll try to rephrase it.

    If you read the OP he seems to think that going from open guard to "flattened out half guard with head and arm control" just happens without the use of technique - "you just force it".

    It is like if someone says "My strategy in BJJ is to submit my opponent, is that a viable strategy?". Well hell yeah it is, but as you ask such a basic question without referring to a single technique - you probably won't achieve it.
     
  19. traficante

    traficante White Belt

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    Well the OP will now tell you:
    this thread is not about how exactly this is done (since there is more than one ways to do it) but whether or not it can be a productive strategy . And I've got a few good posts and even examples of competitors doing it
     
  20. Lasse

    Lasse Green Belt

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    Then I am happy for you as you got a lot of good answers. I just wanted to ask to make sure you got the answers you needed.
     

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