for those who don't compete

[SuperSuperRambo]

that doesnt have anything to do with it

if youre good at sport bjj, youre the best at combat bjj, plain and simple

if youre the best at sport bjj, you can sweep people, get to control positions and submit people, how is that not good for combat or self defense ???

I'm talking about focusing on scoring, and time restrictions, and techniques that are more sport-oriented. I'm not interested in training for those kinds of things.

Again, I never said I wouldn't compete, just that I don't train with a focus on sport competition.

 

[Cardio King]

I don't buy that arguement. I think that the anxiety level of an MMA fight or a street fight would be much higher than a BJJ tourny and by a lot. I don't think there is anything wrong with not wanting to compete and it sucks that you are getting pressured to, but the way you worded your statement it sounds like an excuse or something.

The pressure of a street-fight is the highest.
Then MMA competition.
Then BJJ competition.
Then highschool wrestling.

 

[eclipse]

Cool,so you have not tested it yet? As we have seen good bjj guys in comp do not mean good bjj in mma which is closer to a street altercation but still not the same.So actually the only way to prove your techniques are more affective is to fight a guy outside on the pavement and do you stuff.

I am not against comps. I have competed in the past and may do again. I compete in kickboxing. I have used bjj in street altercations in my job. But I am not going to go saying my bjj is more effective than Jo blows because he doesn't test it on the street. Each to his own.
Winning bjj comps means nothing more than you are good at BJJ comps IMO. And bjj comps require no more courage than it does to get up and sing in front of a large crowd. Some people just are not keen on getting up in front of crowds.

I am guessing that you a successful bjj competitor. Seems that guys that have some success hate when people deny them that they can kickass better on the street because they have gold.

haha yeah i understand your point
i have had some success with bjj comps and of course i understand that doesnt relate at all to mma or the street.
i dont think i can kickass better on the street because i have won some bjj comps, id be the last person to get into a street fight anyway.

i do think the things that make someone succesful in a bjj comp will make them better at mma or in the street tho, if they choose what to do intelligently

 

[eclipse]

I'm talking about focusing on scoring, and time restrictions, and techniques that are more sport-oriented. I'm not interested in training for those kinds of things.

Again, I never said I wouldn't compete, just that I don't train with a focus on sport competition.

for me actually training for sport or points doesnt have anything to do with it tho

i just try to get the takedown, get on top, pass my opponents guard, get to a dominant position and submit him, and if im underneath, sweep or scramble and get back on top, get to a dominant position and submit him

these are just the things you would want to do in any situation with bjj, whether its on the street or in mma

the only thing i or anyone else would do that is sport orientated is stall to win a match

 

[Graunie]

haha yeah i understand your point
i have had some success with bjj comps and of course i understand that doesnt relate at all to mma or the street.
i dont think i can kickass better on the street because i have won some bjj comps, id be the last person to get into a street fight anyway.

i do think the things that make someone succesful in a bjj comp will make them better at mma or in the street tho, if they choose what to do intelligently

Let me say it back a different way to see if I understand correctly. You take 100 guys that compete on a regular basis, and 100 guys that have never competed. Now because comps and street fights don't relate at all you are saying that the two groups would perform equally if caught up in a street fight?

Personally, I got my money on the guys that compete. But hey, to each his own I guess.

 

[eclipse]

i think the comp guys will do alot better i was just saying i personally dont think i can kick ass on the street better just because ive won a few comps....

 

[BoneSnapper]

Let me say it back a different way to see if I understand correctly. You take 100 guys that compete on a regular basis, and 100 guys that have never competed. Now because comps and street fights don't relate at all you are saying that the two groups would perform equally if caught up in a street fight?

Personally, I got my money on the guys that compete. But hey, to each his own I guess.

BJJ comps do nothing that regular hard sparing cant teach you for using it in a street defense situation.
If you want to get a better idea if your bjj is affective enter an mma comp. Like I have said before. Top bjj blackbelts have gotten eaten up by lower belt guys in MMA matches. But they would most definitely win in a bjj comp.
Does training MA give you an advantage over the average Jo. Hell yeah. Does bjj comps give you the edge over other grappler's who chose not to compete? No way. Too many factors come in to play. What other skills they have. If they have any fear of serious consequents more than the other guy. How far they are willing to go. How much pain they can withstand. Are they going to use the right technique applicable to a pavement rather than a mat.

Obviously guys who compete a lot will scream how they are superior.

 

[genkisudo69]

the competition is the last and definitive test.
i think is necesary compete and your jiujitsu improves win or lose.
also you work on your psicology and nerves.
just my opinion.

 

[ozyabbas]

Cool,so you have not tested it yet? As we have seen good bjj guys in comp do not mean good bjj in mma which is closer to a street altercation but still not the same.So actually the only way to prove your techniques are more affective is to fight a guy outside on the pavement and do you stuff.

I am not against comps. I have competed in the past and may do again. I compete in kickboxing. I have used bjj in street altercations in my job. But I am not going to go saying my bjj is more effective than Jo blows because he doesn't test it on the street. Each to his own.
Winning bjj comps means nothing more than you are good at BJJ comps IMO. And bjj comps require no more courage than it does to get up and sing in front of a large crowd. Some people just are not keen on getting up in front of crowds.

I am guessing that you a successful bjj competitor. Seems that guys that have some success hate when people deny them that they can kickass better on the street because they have gold.

I think people are more scared of a bruised ego than physical damage (although that can be a legit reason if leg locks come into play). Any fear of the opponent is really only a conduit of your fear of not being as good as you or other people thought you were.

Its also about taking you out of a comfort zone that you normally would have at your club. Hopefully most people should feel safe in their club and will trust their training partners. When a new guy comes to a club from another club with the same belt colour. It can also take you slightly outside of that comfort zone, a big competition gives a magnification of this feeling.

 

[BoneSnapper]

I think people are more scared of a bruised ego than physical damage (although that can be a legit reason if leg locks come into play). Any fear of the opponent is really only a conduit of your fear of not being as good as you or other people thought you were.

Its also about taking you out of a comfort zone that you normally would have at your club. Hopefully most people should feel safe in their club and will trust their training partners. When a new guy comes to a club from another club with the same belt colour. It can also take you slightly outside of that comfort zone, a big competition gives a magnification of this feeling.

Typical bjj competition guy attitude is that if you don't want to compete you must be scared of something. Hence pressuring people to compete. Most people I know that compete including myself feel very nervous getting up in front of a lot of people. Most people do but are pressured into thinking that if you don't your scared.

You have to admit some people feel comfortable more than others in front of crowds.

Another good attitude of guys that compete a lot. " oh, you couldn't get me with that in competition." or "thats not legal in comp" even though its a legit submission.
or "I don't turn on the power much in practice." as if they let you tap them out. BJJ competition guys egos get way over inflated.

Notice nobody is claiming superiority here other than bjj competitors.

 

[ozyabbas]

Typical bjj competition guy attitude is that if you don't want to compete you must be scared of something. Hence pressuring people to compete. Most people I know that compete including myself feel very nervous getting up in front of a lot of people. Most people do but are pressured into thinking that if you don't your scared.

You have to admit some people feel comfortable more than others in front of crowds.

Another good attitude of guys that compete a lot. " oh, you couldn't get me with that in competition." or "thats not legal in comp" even though its a legit submission.
or "I don't turn on the power much in practice." as if they let you tap them out. BJJ competition guys egos get way over inflated.

Notice nobody is claiming superiority here other than bjj competitors.

I hate going up in front of crowds (im even too scared to do karoake) and when people normally all watch me at the club it usually does distract me or put me off my game. I was surprised in my last competition that once the match had started I didn't notice anyone in the crowd apart from hearing bits and peices from my instructor. I was only thinking about the match.

Im lucky in that no one from my club has that kind of arrogance you speak of (well one who sporadically comes to training but for some reason didn't turn up to the tournament he signed up and payed for).

I do get some people telling me that x move/grip is not allowed in tournies. They are normally benign things like gripping the inside of the end of the gi pants or grapevining the leg too far. I am guilty of telling people who im training with who know im going to compete to stop doing some kinds of leglocks which aren't legal in the competitions.

 

[BoneSnapper]

I hate going up in front of crowds (im even too scared to do karoake) and when people normally all watch me at the club it usually does distract me or put me off my game. I was surprised in my last competition that once the match had started I didn't notice anyone in the crowd apart from hearing bits and peices from my instructor. I was only thinking about the match.

Im lucky in that no one from my club has that kind of arrogance you speak of (well one who sporadically comes to training but for some reason didn't turn up to the tournament he signed up and payed for).

I do get some people telling me that x move/grip is not allowed in tournies. They are normally benign things like gripping the inside of the end of the gi pants or grapevining the leg too far. I am guilty of telling people who im training with who know im going to compete to stop doing some kinds of leglocks which aren't legal in the competitions.

What about calf crushes, bicep crushes spine and neck cranks. All mostly illegal especially purple down. I personally love them all. Comp guys complain though that they are illegal in comp.
Also have you competed in an MMA event? If not what if guys at the club that compete kept saying that your BJJ is not effective because you don't use it in MMA. Or you must be scared. Maybe guys at bjj clubs that don't compete MMA are not the real deal. MMA is the only test. I am sure it would get annoying.

 

[georgejjr]

I think people are more scared of a bruised ego than physical damage (although that can be a legit reason if leg locks come into play). Any fear of the opponent is really only a conduit of your fear of not being as good as you or other people thought you were.

You're young. You'll learn about injuries, work and family when you get older. Take it from a guy who competed in judo and wrestling for years ... there's a reason not many still do it once they get past their thirties. Competition intensity throws and takedowns are bad enough when you're young (for competitive judoka and wrestlers bad knees and shoulders are almost a given) and heal relatively quickly. Once you get older the mats get harder and gravity stronger :icon_cry2

Rolling and doing randori in club? Not a problem, its less intense and you can ask guys not to do certain throws if you've got long term injuries. Competition? No thanks, I'll just referee at the tournaments. Which isn't much fun either actually, but as you'll find, once you're no longer competing its expected that you do it, just like the old guys used to do for you ... actually getting out of refereeing is the best argument I can think of for competing again :icon_twis

 

[eclipse]

You're young. You'll learn about injuries, work and family when you get older. Take it from a guy who competed in judo and wrestling for years ... there's a reason not many still do it once they get past their thirties. Competition intensity throws and takedowns are bad enough when you're young (for competitive judoka and wrestlers bad knees and shoulders are almost a given) and heal relatively quickly. Once you get older the mats get harder and gravity stronger :icon_cry2

Rolling and doing randori in club? Not a problem, its less intense and you can ask guys not to do certain throws if you've got long term injuries. Competition? No thanks, I'll just referee at the tournaments. Which isn't much fun either actually, but as you'll find, once you're no longer competing its expected that you do it, just like the old guys used to do for you ... actually getting out of refereeing is the best argument I can think of for competing again :icon_twis

age is a weak excuse to stop competing

you should be able to easilly go till youre 40, after that you can still train bjj just fine, but dont have to think about mma or bjj competitions anymore

 

[BoneSnapper]

age is a weak excuse to stop competing

you should be able to easilly go till youre 40, after that you can still train bjj just fine, but dont have to think about mma or bjj competitions anymore

Why do people need an excuse to not compete? Whats wrong with not competing? If people want to compete they should just do so. If they enjoy it and think it improves their game why make a big deal to complain about people not competing?

Maybe people don't enjoy competing and just want others to suffer like they do.

Maybe they want more spectators to see their brilliance

I really don't know. But I am gonna flip if people get on my back about going in the next comp.

 

[georgejjr]

age is a weak excuse to stop competing

you should be able to easilly go till youre 40, after that you can still train bjj just fine, but dont have to think about mma or bjj competitions anymore

Some of us are considerably closer to 50 than 40, and continue to train BJJ, judo and MMA. But once you get older there's a big difference between competing and training. I did my last judo tournament a decade ago, and my last serious one (Canadian nationals) about the time I hit 30. People have it backwards, ego isn't what keeps you from competing, its what keeps you competing long after your body can handle it. Admitting to yourself that you're past your physical prime isn't easy, it generally has to be forced upon you.

You'll see

 

[Graunie]

BJJ comps do nothing that regular hard sparing cant teach you for using it in a street defense situation.
If you want to get a better idea if your bjj is affective enter an mma comp. Like I have said before. Top bjj blackbelts have gotten eaten up by lower belt guys in MMA matches. But they would most definitely win in a bjj comp.
Does training MA give you an advantage over the average Jo. Hell yeah. Does bjj comps give you the edge over other grappler's who chose not to compete? No way. Too many factors come in to play. What other skills they have. If they have any fear of serious consequents more than the other guy. How far they are willing to go. How much pain they can withstand. Are they going to use the right technique applicable to a pavement rather than a mat.

Obviously guys who compete a lot will scream how they are superior.

I am talking about the mental battle. It has to do with standing across from a guy that really wants to hurt you. There was a post earlier about intensity levels.

Your regular gym> BJJ Comp> MMA> Real fight

 

[ozyabbas]

I think something that some of us have to understand is that people train for different reasons and that some people actually like competing and others don't.

If you don't enjoy competing then I don't think people should be pressuring you too. Many times people don't compete just because they don't enjoy it. Whats more important in life than trying to acheive happyness, why should some people try to impose their ideas of whats enjoyable onto others.

To the poster who said I am young, that is really a matter of perspective. Im 27 years old and am getting married soon so I am winding down the training because of more important matters.

Something that I also don't think has been mentioned is that there are different kinds of competitions. There are small interclub competitions, nationals etc. You don't have to necessarily get in shape and serious prepare for a small competition. Its just a bit of fun.

Another reason some people don't compete is that their reputation is on the line. If they are coaches and loose at competitions, it may compromise their reputation and that of their club.

 

[georgejjr]

I think something that some of us have to understand is that people train for different reasons and that some people actually like competing and others don't.

If you don't enjoy competing then I don't think people should be pressuring you too. Many times people don't compete just because they don't enjoy it. Whats more important in life than trying to acheive happyness, why should some people try to impose their ideas of whats enjoyable onto others.

To the poster who said I am young, that is really a matter of perspective. Im 27 years old and am getting married soon so I am winding down the training because of more important matters.

Something that I also don't think has been mentioned is that there are different kinds of competitions. There are small interclub competitions, nationals etc. You don't have to necessarily get in shape and serious prepare for a small competition. Its just a bit of fun.

Another reason some people don't compete is that their reputation is on the line. If they are coaches and loose at competitions, it may compromise their reputation and that of their club.

Good point about different kinds of competitions. When I think of competition (and I suspect same for most folks) its state/provincial level or higher, where young guys are trying to make points to get onto the national team - pretty intense and lot's of injuries. Interclub is a different game, much easier to do when you get older (sorry, 27 is mentally an adult but in terms of health you're still young ... enjoy it while it lasts).

Disagree about reputation being on the line. Most coaches are folks who've retired, and no one expects them to be able to win at top levels anymore. Dan Gable would have no chance wrestling against an olympic level guy today, or even most college level guys, he's too old. Same for Yashiro Yamashita in judo (the most successful competition judoka in history, now national coach for the Japanese judo team). They could compete and get blown away, and no one would care, because they proved themselves as competitors during their competition days, and now prove themselves as coaches by what their athletes do.

 

[irc]

The thing I hate about comps is when you spend between $50-$75, go through the real hassle of cutting weight if need be, show up at 9am, wait for hours and hours trying to stay ready with racked nerves, then end up fighting for a few minutes. Spending the whole day.

Going through this routine a lot really gets old. Sometimes I feel like it is worth it, but often I'm like, that was kinda lame.