Finland considers giving every adult citizen 800€/months

[frandie2b]

Finland's government is seriously considering the establishment of a universal income of €800 ($870), regardless of wealth or age. In return, all social benefits will be deleted.

A poll commissioned by KELA showed that 69% support (link in Finnish) a basic income plan. Prime minister Juha Sipilä is in favor of the idea and he’s backed by most of the major political parties. “For me, a basic income means simplifying the social security system,” he says.

One of the major downsides, of course, is the cost of handing out money to so many people. Liisa Hyssälä, director general of KELA, has said that the plan will save the government millions. But, as Bloomberg calculated, giving €800 of basic income to the population of 5.4 million every month would cost €52.2 billion a year. Finland only plans to give the basic income to adults, not every citizen, but with around 4.9 million adults in Finland, this would still cost €46.7 billion per year. The government expects to have €49.1 billion in revenue in 2016.


http://qz.com/566702/finland-plans-to-give-every-citizen-a-basic-income-of-800-euros-a-month/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...d-might-soon-pay-every-citizen-850-per-month/

 

[Lustercross]

They should do it so the whole world can observe and see if it's a success. This is something we might have to do one day with automation making jobs dissapear.

 

[ShoelessRye]

All social benefits like what? I don't like the idea of giving folks money as they'll spend it on stupid shit and not save it for a rainy day, retirement, or health emergency.

 

[OldGoat]

Well if they get rid of minimum wage and other social safety net features and adopt this they must have been reading OldGoatonomics.

 

[ripskater]

If everyone gets 800 bucks a month, who's gonna pay for it?

 

[berimBOWLoh]

They should do it so the whole world can observe and see if it's a success. This is something we might have to do one day with automation making jobs dissapear.

Canada already tested it in one city and it was a success.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/12/23/mincome-in-dauphin-manitoba_n_6335682.html

 

[Cozphecten]

Well if they get rid of minimum wage and other social safety net features and adopt this they must have been reading OldGoatonomics.

 

[mac11]

If everyone gets 800 bucks a month, who's gonna pay for it?

This replaces all social welfare and social programs cutting on administrative costs of paying welfafe and all those employed in catching welfare frauds etc.

ALso people on welfare in places like Finland are decentivized to take up a job because they will earn less by taking up a job and giving up their benefits.

And as someone else pointed, it's estimated that automation/AI could replace 50 per cent of all jobs in the next two decades and they aren't just low skilled jobs either. everything from the transport industry to lawyers to news articles writers etc

 

[barehanded]

And as someone else pointed, it's estimated that automation/AI could replace 50 per cent of all jobs in the next two decades and they aren't just low skilled jobs either. everything from the transport industry to lawyers to news articles writers etc

Then Merkel shouldn't take so many immigrants.

 

[jefferz]

In b4 refugee...Shit, to late

 

[SakuMemories]

Then Merkel shouldn't take so many immigrants.

you are obsessed, you are losing your mind with her

 

[ripskater]

This replaces all social welfare and social programs cutting on administrative costs of paying welfafe and all those employed in catching welfare frauds etc.

ALso people on welfare in places like Finland are decentivized to take up a job because they will earn less by taking up a job and giving up their benefits.

And as someone else pointed, it's estimated that automation/AI could replace 50 per cent of all jobs in the next two decades and they aren't just low skilled jobs either. everything from the transport industry to lawyers to news articles writers etc

Thanks. It seems crazy to me but maybe that's cheaper.

 

[barehanded]

you are obsessed, you are losing your mind with her

When did I mention her last time? I don't even remember.

 

[Lord Commander Palis]

Lol Europeons.

 

[Oedad]

Now all we have to do is figure out how to set up a fake Finnish identity, and set up false residency records for every sherdogger, and we can finally become rich!

 

[Oedad]

Canada already tested it in one city and it was a success.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/12/23/mincome-in-dauphin-manitoba_n_6335682.html

Not the same. They only gave a minimum income to people below the poverty line, and it was an entire nation funding a small experiment in a town over a few thousand. They had 30 million Canadians supporting 1000 families.

This is a payment to every single adult in the whole nation rich or poor, and the government is not going to be able to raise an equivalent amount of revenue to offset the costs for a program so large. They have to hope the savings from eliminating other welfare programs end up being larger than the cost of the minimum income.

 

[OldGoat]

If everyone gets 800 bucks a month, who's gonna pay for it?

Total money supply is greater than the budget of a nation. What this does is cause a stream of money to go to everyone which increases everybody's ability to buy goods and services. If the economy has any idle capacity to provide those goods and services this results in a better distribution and growth. Finland and most economies aren't running at full theoretical capacity.

Now if they are a turrible economy let's say like Haiti or Zimbabwe this would lead to inflation and barter. But Finland is far from Zimbabwe.

 

[Falsedawn]

They should do it so the whole world can observe and see if it's a success. This is something we WILL have to do one day with automation making jobs dissapear.

FTFY

Its almost a certainty that at some point, technology is going to make human labor as a whole obsolete. Either we're going to devolve into the thunderdome version of the French Revolution from unemployment, or we're going to have to shift to what is effectively a true communist society.

Life post-singularity is going to look almost nothing like any society we've ever had on this planet.

 

[lapollarecords]

Then Merkel shouldn't take so many immigrants.

as if Merkel has a chance. what could she do? deploy the german army in the border and make of hundreds of thousands of war refugees get out of Germany at gunpoint? that would be a the mother of all PR disasters, especially for Germany.

 

[barehanded]

as if Merkel has a chance. what could she do? deploy the german army in the border and make of hundreds of thousands of war refugees get out of Germany at gunpoint? that would be a the mother of all PR disasters, especially for Germany.

Well, when Croatia, Serbia and Macedonia declared that they gonna refuse to accept economic migrants among the refugees, guess what happened. They came in smaller numbers next days, they were protesting but they stopped coming. So only Syrians and Iraqis are allowed to pass right now.

But but Merkel said not even army can stop them. I guess Macedonian police is stronger than German army.

But yes, now that so many refugees are in Germany, she can't just deport them all.