Fighting on PEDs be considered an equivalent to bringing a weapon in court? NO, Murder charges drop

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by Leroy Jenkins, Jul 28, 2016.

  1. Leroy Jenkins

    Leroy Jenkins Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    I keep hearing people saying that a fighter on PEDs is a danger to somebodies life, that they should be charged with assault as they are putting cement in their hand wraps, but I simply don't see how your logic will hold in court.


    First of all you can't measure how much PEDs help. It is not an exact science to say that somebody improved this much with PEDs. Even if you do find the exact measurement of how much they improved, you can't say they improved so much to become super human that there punch would be equivalent to cement in hand wraps or a baseball bat.


    And that's the big difference, with cement on hand wraps, you could actually measure the difference in punching power. You can actually show the jury how big of an advantage it is. Of course I don't believe Margarito got charged with assault.


    So this mythical scenerio where a fighter kills another fighter then pops for PEDs and should be charged with murder, would never ever hold in court. There simply isn't any evidence to back up that steroids were the reason a fighter died, that they make somebody into a super human, so much that they become a killing machine.

    If anything, it would be argued in court, that MMA history shows that even though people are on roids, deaths don't happen. Thus if somebody were to be killed by a PED fighter, it would be an accident, not a result of PEDs.


    Even obvious PED freaks who clearly have abused PEDs like Lesnar/Bob Sapp, even they would not be considered super humans to be charged with murder.


    Im a big Mark Hunt fan, and Im glad he keeps attacking Brock. For years we heard BS about brock being a natural fighter by his fans, so Im glad we are hearing the opposite now. I hope Mark Hunt is compensated and I hope brock delusional fans stop attacking hunt and stop making excuses for brock.. Having said that, I disagree with the whole PEDs being equivalent to weapons.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2016
  2. WinZip

    WinZip Trial Version Expired

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    Okay.
     
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  3. NoneChuck

    NoneChuck Amsterdamned

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  4. snapster

    snapster Orange Belt

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    Just to play devil's advocate, you have to concede that PED use certainly pushes the probability that a fighter might kill another fighter in one and only one direction.
    Then consider driving cars; when we drive around, the goal isn't to kill each other, but we know it's a possibility, hopefully remote, that it might happen. But if a driver has been drinking, the probability of them killing someone else has been increased. No one knows exactly how much it changes that probability, and it depends on how much was drunk and the driver's particular physiology. Yet if that driver does kill someone, they will be charged differently than if they had not been drinking at all.
     
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  5. Which Doctor

    Which Doctor The ATT Heel Stable/Faction Belt

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  6. snapster

    snapster Orange Belt

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    Why do you have to announce to the world that you didn't read something?
     
  7. yookfarb

    yookfarb Red Belt

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    optimism <9>
     
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  8. CodCommando

    CodCommando Brown Belt

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    MMA has been filled with PED users since it's beginning. No one has died in there still.
     
  9. McBryde Mats LLC

    McBryde Mats LLC Orange Belt

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    After seeing Cyborg take that flying knee at Bellator 158, I spose you may be right
     
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  10. Leroy Jenkins

    Leroy Jenkins Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    But they actually have studies seeing how much drunkness affect driving. If they get somebodies alcohol level and compare them tot he studies, they could guess how fucked up they were. There is actual measurement.

    Even if somebody could drive drunk and the measurement doesn't apply to them, their is still studies showing how much of an effect it has on driving a 3000lbs+ car.


    For PEDs, there is studies about how much muscle gain is increased but thats basically it.


    Also there is a history of drunk driving killing people. There is actual stories where that happened. In MMA, there is zero stories of an MMA fighter dying to a PED fighter, so it's much different.
     
  11. tramendous

    tramendous Silver Belt

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    people have been hit in the head with hammers and died and some didn't doesnt mean a tool that was not designed to be a weapon wasnt used as a weapon. its not the intent of an object that determines whether its a weapon its how its used.
     
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  12. Bend NvR Break

    Bend NvR Break Order to Chaos. Chaos to Order.

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    You want to stop PED use? Hit people's pockets. 1st time caught 2 year ban plus 50% purse forfeit. 2nd time caught lifetime ban plus 75% purse forfeit.

    You'll have no more Josh Barnets, Brocks, or Ubereems.

    If not stop bsing and let the science experiments begin.
     
  13. Cygnus A

    Cygnus A Brown Belt

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    haha that is funny as hell.
     
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  14. Drofrah

    Drofrah Green Belt

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    Its not as bad as using plaster wraps. I agree with the longer bans thought.
     
  15. Leroy Jenkins

    Leroy Jenkins Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    I say the percentage of somebody getting hit in the head and dying is much higher than an MMA fighter on PEDs killing somebody.


    Apple and oranges....You can also measure how much hard a hammer strike is....There is actual quantitative evidence unlike PEDs.


    You can't show how much of increase PEDs gave somebody in the power department, for example.
     
  16. ShoopNazi

    ShoopNazi Purple Belt

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    toasters don't toast toast, toast toast toast.
     
  17. NoneChuck

    NoneChuck Amsterdamned

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    The world??


    [​IMG]
     
  18. tramendous

    tramendous Silver Belt

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    its the intent. if you willfully cheated so that you can cause more harm to the individual where the rules, regulations and expectations are set under the notion that both fighters are clean and tested, then you can be criminally responsible. in hockey body checking is allowed. but if you tamper with your equipment so that you cause more damage via a body check and you hide said tampering then that is a crime if you end up killing someone. in a sport like mixed martial arts where causing damage and hurting your opponent is the primary means of winning, taking steroids illegally means you are criminally negligent in that person's death.

    i think the bigger question would be how does the prosecution prove that the person took the banned substance on purpose since its possible to take it accidentally or unknowingly.
     
  19. accolyte1022

    accolyte1022 'I had to fight a guy tree times the size of me'

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    This guy would test positive for ALL steroids....... twice.
     
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  20. Hi-Tech

    Hi-Tech Slavic Fighter Double Yellow Card

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    Antonio "Hands of Plaster" Margarito.

    His win against Cotto was epic and would be regarded as one of the best single wins in the recent era of boxing if it wasn't for this controversy.



    It was like something out of a Hollywood movie except that the winner was the villain
     

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