Fedor: Ronda misses a lot of punches, which leads to painful reception

It's alright not to know what you're talking about, I guess.
But you're still wrong.

All the internet blathering in the world, is not going to change the fact that Fedor was never "known as one of the more elusive fighters in MMA ever." Lol.
 
That makes more sense

Actually it has. Its been a long time since I've seen this stat but when the UFC was pushing Machida as the most elusive fighter someone did an analysis and found that he indeed was the most elusive fighter in the UFC in that he takes the fewest strikes per minute. However, they did the same for Fedor and he slightly edged Machida. This was before his loss to Werdum/Bigfoot/Hendo. It shouldn't be surprising; he had exceptional striking defense for a HW but its likely mainly because because of how much he leaned on his grappling early on and the fact that he got his fair share of squash matches in PRIDE.

A low received punch stat doesn't mean someone is a highly elusive striker. Like you said, a grappling-heavy style accounts for that.
 
Rousey vs Fedor

SLpM 4.35 3.18
Str. Acc. 63% 51%

Rousey strikes more frequently and more accurately than Fedor over their respective careers.

...i can't believe you just compared their "respective careers" in this aspect.

- Volume of opponents.
- Quality of opponents.

Come on...

yxACHW8.gif
 
A low received punch stat doesn't mean someone is a highly elusive striker. Like you said, a grappling-heavy style accounts for that.
True but this is what he said
Also, Fedor's still considered one of the more elusive fighters in MMA ever. You don't have to agree, but since the numbers are on his side, your difficulty in believing them isn't really relevant to reality.
Fighter, not striker. Not to mention Ronda also has a very grappling heavy style, arguably more so than Fedor, and she has said she wants to model her style after his so I think its a fair criticism.
 
True but this is what he said

Fighter, not striker.

No, we've been talking specifically about striking from the beginning. He said "elusive". That word is used to describe defensive striking movement, no one ever describes Jake Shields grappling to avoid the striking game as being "elusive".
 
Half of them are when she has a woman in a headlock though, tough to miss.

Um, correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't that be the Ideal scenario for just about any striker? A position where the person can not avoid your strikes at all?

Headlock, clinch, and top position GnP >>>>>> standing in the pocket

Given the choice, is there a striker that would choose standing in the pocket and trading/dancing over having someone in a headlock/clinch and hitting them with unanswered strikes?
 
No, we've been talking specifically about striking from the beginning. He said "elusive". That word is used to describe defensive striking movement, no one ever describes Jake Shields grappling to avoid the striking game as being "elusive".

Its may be used in that sense sure but in this case Fedor criticized her for getting hit in general. You bring up the fact that Fedor wasn't elusive but the fact is he was great at avoiding damage like he is recommending Rousey does. The two do have similar styles, with Ronda having an even more grappling heavy style meaning she should be getting hit less, and yet she still, on average, absorbs about 2.5x the strikes he does. That's a big difference and I highly doubt Fedor is just getting lit up on the feet compared to Rousey and its only the grappling that changes the stat in his favor considering Rousey mostly fights on the ground if she can help it(and she usually can).
 
All the internet blathering in the world, is not going to change the fact that Fedor was never "known as one of the more elusive fighters in MMA ever." Lol.

Oh, the insults. Did I break you that quickly?
At least my condescension comes with some relevant argument. You're just firing wild as you scrabble for deflection.

This sort of thing really should be beneath you.

A low received punch stat doesn't mean someone is a highly elusive striker. Like you said, a grappling-heavy style accounts for that.

This is sheer desperation. You started this out by arguing for Ronda, and how much she doesn't get hit. If Ronda's style is not what you would call "grappling heavy" then I don't think you are qualified to discuss MMA.
Fedor spent far more time on the feet than Ronda, and he had far more fights, against better opposition. He still got hit less than almost anyone else in the sport.

Also:

I've seen every Fedor fight. His striking defense is okay, but certainly not exceptional. That was never his style. He would get in your face & seek to overwhelm his opponent, every time. He often took damage to do this. If anything, that aspect of him resembles Ronda.

Why weren't you mentioning his grappling heavy style here? In this post, Fedor gets hit a lot because he's "in your face" overwhelming you. But now, he didn't get hit a lot, because he grapples?
Should we try and find information on exactly how much time each fighter spends striking on the feet? Would that make you feel better about the fact that Fedor is leagues more elusive a fighter than Ronda?
The comparison isn't actually fair, but since you decided to make it, I don't feel too bad about that.

Oh, and the correct phrasing would be "If anything, that aspect of Ronda resembles Fedor" since, she's the one trying to copy him.
You'd be right, that aspect of her game does resemble his, only he was far better at it, far more elusive, and thus, in a far better position to offer his criticism of her than you are to offer your (demonstrably false) opinion of him.
 
Anyone got an actual source for those quotes, rather than a FAKE FACEBOOK?
I never seen Fedor even talk about WMMA and definitely don't think he has been watching Ronda Rousey fights.
 
Its may be used in that sense sure but in this case Fedor criticized her for getting hit in general. You bring up the fact that Fedor wasn't elusive but the fact is he was great at avoiding damage like he is recommending Rousey does. The two do have similar styles, with Ronda having an even more grappling heavy style meaning she should be getting hit less, and yet she still, on average, absorbs about 2.5x the strikes he does. That's a big difference and I highly doubt Fedor is just getting lit up on the feet compared to Rousey and its only the grappling that changes the stat in his favor considering Rousey mostly fights on the ground if she can help it(and she usually can).

I'm not criticizing Fedor for getting hit a lot, like I said before his defense is decent, just not exceptional. I consider him the goat of MMA overall though.

Also, dat Bryce Dallas Howard
 
Why especially for women? Most of them have no KO power, so it matters even less than for men.

I'm thinking the same thing.. "especially for heavyweights".. yeah, of course.. But women?
 
I'm thinking the same thing.. "especially for heavyweights".. yeah, of course.. But women?

I think the "especially" in this case was about Fedor not wanting to see women being punched in the face. Which is the one point I can agree with him on regarding this issue.
 
I'm not criticizing Fedor for getting hit a lot, like I said before his defense is decent, just not exceptional. I consider him the goat of MMA overall though.
I know you're not shitting on the guy but I think you were underestimating his striking defense just a tad, especially when compared to Rousey. Rousey is new to MMA compared to Fedor though, I'm sure in time her defense will get better and really she doesn't seem to respect the power of her opponents and why should she? Fedor probably took more damage from Bigfoot than Rousey has taken from all her opponents combined. He had to be more cautious going up against HWs, many of whom were larger than him, while Rousey easily can afford to take a punch or two to get the clinch and force her fight.
Also, dat Bryce Dallas Howard
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I know you're not shitting on the guy but I think you were underestimating his striking defense just a tad, especially when compared to Rousey.

Comparing the two of them, there's no question that Fedor's striking was better than Ronda's in every aspect. But that's not what I'm doing, I'm saying he was not himself an elite defense technician or something, so his criticism is obviously based from his overall dislike of WMMA. Especially since Ronda gets hit less than the vast majority of women fighters.

Rousey is new to MMA compared to Fedor though, I'm sure in time her defense will get better and really she doesn't seem to respect the power of her opponents and why should she? Fedor probably took more damage from Bigfoot than Rousey has taken from all her opponents combined. He had to be more cautious going up against HWs, many of whom were larger than him, while Rousey easily can afford to take a punch or two to get the clinch and force her fight.

Yeah. She will probably get better at that part, but even if she doesn't, I don't think Rousey's striking defense is ever going to be a serious issue, simply because her style is to get in there and get it done so quick, and she is so good at it.



Strawberry fiyah!
 
This is you conceding, I take it? ;)

Lol. Pathetic.

You said Fedor is "considered one of the more elusive fighters in MMA ever." I believe he was never known as that, so we are simply not going to agree. Not much point in going in circles about it, or responding back and forth with long diatribes.

But hey, at least we both seem to love the guy.
 
Comparing the two of them, there's no question that Fedor's striking was better than Ronda's in every aspect. But that's not what I'm doing, I'm saying he was not himself an elite defense technician or something, so his criticism is obviously based from his overall dislike of WMMA. Especially since Ronda gets hit less than the vast majority of women fighters.
Its definitely possible that his criticism is related to his dislike of WMMA but I do think its a fair criticism. Also I do think his striking defense is underrated and I suspect that is because its not exactly orthodox stuff like you mentioned earlier. However, if you look at his fights he was very good at staying at range and picking the opportunity to jump in with big strikes, often feinting the right to land the left and using hand traps. His speed advantage helped him a lot with this as did his grappling; if you tried to close the distance on him it was very likely he'd take you down so not unlike GSP he could dicate the distance simply with the threat of his grappling advantage.
Yeah. She will probably get better at that part, but even if she doesn't, I don't think Rousey's striking defense is ever going to be a serious issue, simply because her style is to get in there and get it done so quick, and she is so good at it.
I agree, perhaps Holy Holm or Cyborg can take advantage of the holes in her defense but her grappling advantage is so huge she can always end a fight in a moment's notice. That's something that's hard to deal with and I don't think Holm and Cyborg will be able to.
 
This is you conceding, I take it? ;)

Lol. Pathetic.
You said Fedor is "considered one of the more elusive fighters in MMA ever." I believe he was never known as that, so we are simply not going to agree. Not much point in going in circles about it, or responding back and forth with long diatribes.

But hey, at least we both seem to love the guy.
I think you both have a point here. I wasn't around forums for much of Fedor's reign but I can't recall elusiveness being one of his defining traits as in it wasn't something you'd find in a promo video about the guy in the way you might for Machida. That said the numbers don't lie, he did not get hit very often in his fights. A lot of that is because of his grappling but I also think he was good at avoiding strikes on the feet too.
 
Its definitely possible that his criticism is related to his dislike of WMMA but I do think its a fair criticism. Also I do think his striking defense is underrated and I suspect that is because its not exactly orthodox stuff like you mentioned earlier. However, if you look at his fights he was very good at staying at range and picking the opportunity to jump in with big strikes, often feinting the right to land the left and using hand traps. His speed advantage helped him a lot with this as did his grappling; if you tried to close the distance on him it was very likely he'd take you down so not unlike GSP he could dicate the distance simply with the threat of his grappling advantage.

Yeah Fedor is/was a master of the overall game. He had weaknesses like anyone, but no one put it all together like him. And unlike some more defensive champs, he always really went after it. Which I loved.


I agree, perhaps Holy Holm or Cyborg can take advantage of the holes in her defense but her grappling advantage is so huge she can always end a fight in a moment's notice. That's something that's hard to deal with and I don't think Holm and Cyborg will be able to.

Yeah, I don't think anyone beats Ronda in her career. Including the names we mentioned. I think she will go 20-0 and then retire.
 
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