Drew's hearty thread #1 back-takes (Rafa Mendes style) from calf cutter, 50/50, etc.

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Drew Foster, Aug 10, 2010.

  1. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    Thread idea was sparked by this

    http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f12/rafael-mendes-killing-machine-1244683/

    There was a lot of talks of sagittal vs. transverse back-takes, but that's not so much what I'm interested in. This thread will mainly focus on his back takes that involve a kind-of calf cutter/beartrap set-up. There are many variations, but I let's say my opponent is on their knees. I like to shoot the right leg, for example, in between the legs and thread the leg across behind their knee as I roll to my right onto my shoulders, like a Tornado guard (but with a leg threaded inside out, placed behind the knee.) From there, I hold the waist/legs/other control options and sit up. I could bear hug them and lean forward causing a calf cutter, but I don't do that. I look to take the back. It works well too.

    Some examples from the Mendes'...

    0:55. He had the back of the left knee blocked. Not threaded so I guess it's not exactly what I'm talking about.

    1:19. Didn't take the back from there, but often does. That's more or less the leg configuration of how I like to take the back. Perfect. Threaded from inside-out. Perfect way to sit up/stand up/transition to the back.
    5:12 is a perfect view. Leg threaded through, Leo's left foot on Mende's left hip. Leo can't move forward because a knee is with weight on it, and he can't move to his back, because he could torque his own knee. Rafa jumps up and takes the back.

    7:28 has a better view of the back take against Leo that was at 5:12 in the above video.

    Thoughts?

    Does anyone hear practice this? Mikey T, don't answer (j/k) because I know you're practicing a lot of Mendes' stuff these days.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2010
  2. MUFC

    MUFC Brown Belt

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    This should be interesting. Rafa takes the back from everywhere.
     
  3. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    I hope so too. I created this and the full-mount Darce finish thread today.

    I wanted to make some threads that could get some mileage and have some depth in there. Hopefully it works and we can share some knowledge on these subjects. I'll try to do these comprehensive threads once a week. I'd even be open to let people ask questions, I can go out and find media, add it to the thread, and we can go from there.
     
  4. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    Yes he does. I'm hoping for a no-gi DVD from Budovideos/Cryo or World Martial Arts by next spring. That would be awesome!
     
  5. Galahad

    Galahad Orange Belt

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    Yes I've been waiting for a thread like this. As someone who can't get the mechanics of this technique would people be so kind as to:

    - break the technique down step-by-step
    - possible set-ups
    - finishes, I mean why sometimes does he get the back and others he gets a sweep
    - defenses to it and counters to those

    Aw man, great idea Drew. I really hope this turns into something. I've been wanting to learn this for so long.
     
  6. Higher Learning

    Higher Learning Brown Belt

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    i have been shown by ed ramos & gui mendes ho to do several of these... one of my close friends and teammates trained at atos this year for 3 months 3x a day & taking the back is a huge part of their focus so i feel i have pretty decent understanding of several of their sweeps/passes to the back...

    we have been asked not to film instructionals detaling these techniques by the atos guys however

    i can discuss the techniques but i recommend you email gui or rafa or facebook msg them as they are usually happy to answer these queries themselves :icon_chee
    before we had ramos & gui out last year one of my teammates was emailing them back and forth quite a bit and gui was happy to answer queries on the techniques etc
     
  7. TalkShowOnMute

    TalkShowOnMute dancingonthecorpsesashes

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    tee hee! Meaty post!....tee hee!
     
  8. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    Yes, I'm changing the name. If you got an idea tell me. I was so tired when I made the titles. Definitely sounds suspect. :icon_neut

    Galahad, I have been waiting too, so I just went ahead and made it. The idea was to post less, but make big discussions. Maybe do 1 a week? People can come and share media, experiences, ideas on whatever concept I pick out for the week, or if it's something someone else wants, I'll just do that instead. But the first 2 threads are on page 2 so this may not take off. They aren't 1 paragraph threads so we'll see how it goes.
     
  9. MUFC

    MUFC Brown Belt

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    The brothers have a dvd set each. They were brown belts at the time and it is in Portuguese. It's relatively easy to understand.
     
  10. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    Any no-gi stuff at all? Is it on Budovideos? I'll look for it!
     
  11. FunkyRMe

    FunkyRMe White Belt

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    I'd really like to see an instructional on this. But it's a really aggressive back take so I guess it'd be hard to break down.

    Dude these threads are awesome keep em up!
     
  12. netbjjer420

    netbjjer420 Green Belt

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    Based on that DEEP match and his ADCC matches, it seems that Rafa takes the back no-gi using the calf-splicer set up(Cobrinha + Leo), the armdrag (Leo) and the spin under (Toida: video above and Justin Rader, although he didn't take Rader's back but got the sweep instead)

    I've been working the calf splicer set up and it's great and am now looking to work on the spin under as well. It seems he gets a shin on shin butterfly hook, uses it to lift and spin under them between their legs to the leg lock kind of guard while using their other hand to control their opponent's free leg so they can't do the 'ol spin and kick out. Once he spins under enough, he takes the hand that was controlling the leg in the leg lock guard and grabs their other leg while simultaneously putting his behind the knee hooks in.

    That's just my take on it. Thoughts appreciated.
     
  13. Galahad

    Galahad Orange Belt

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    Ok this thread has motivated me to watch all of Rafa's video's in an attempt to learn this technique.

    And to the guy that said Rafa had put out a DVD, that was for the one in Japan right? Does he actually teach the back-take technique?
     
  14. Galahad

    Galahad Orange Belt

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    I'm assuming this is the spin-under back take right from a rdlr/spiral guard right?
     
  15. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    Yes I think that's it. Cool vid! Thanks
     
  16. MUFC

    MUFC Brown Belt

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    I'm not sure if it is on Budo. I borrowed it for a friend to watch.

    There is a decent bit of Nogi stuff. There are some really cool counters to deep half guard. I didn't get a lot out of the videos because I just watched them. I didn't actually study them (if that makes sense).

    I can't remember. I think I still have it lying around somewhere. Will give it a look. There is a lot of sparring footage. Really liked watching that.

    Edit:Just found it. Every technique so far looks really cool, but doesn't seem high percentage. I'll give a list of the things they show that are directly applicable to this thread. Rafa also does a lot of transitions to the crucifix. Not sure if you want me to type out details as it's hard to translate.

    Like right now, he just did a back take from a weird, almost over under pass type position.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2010
  17. TacWar

    TacWar Green Belt

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    I actually starting thinking about this after I was practicing taking the back off omaplatas. The difficulty for me is I just always get tangled and even if I pull it off it does not look that smooth, I think its just an experience thing.
     
  18. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    I found em and ordered em. Do they show Rafa's DEEP matches, or just Gui's?
     
  19. MUFC

    MUFC Brown Belt

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    DVD:

    Crucifix from double unders pass
    Crucifix from top DHG
    Back take from top DHG
    Back take from open guard pass
    Back take from Reverse DLR (posted above)
    Kneebar/50:50 from Reverse DLR
    Shin to shin guard sweep to back take from leg drag/dope mount
    A couple back takes from top.

    The rest of the gi dvd has a few flashy techniques and like 5-6 really good reverse dlr sweeps. I'll get around to the nogi video in a bit.

    Drew, they show Rafa's matches as well. The footage of him sparring is the best part of the set. It looks like effortless destruction against browns and purples.
     
  20. Drew Foster

    Drew Foster Silver Belt

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    I can't wait! I ordered both DVDs. I really want to see a Rafa instructional on the Anaconda, and of course the Darce, even though I've never seen him do the latter on anyone.

    Is there anywhere to check and see when/where he comes to the States?
     

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