Does Strength help?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by tommboy, Nov 25, 2005.

  1. tommboy

    tommboy White Belt

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2005
    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    7
    Does all around body strength help significantly in a grappling art? I ask this because I was formly a bodybuilder (but have a ton of strength for my bodyweight) Im about 175 and can put up 275 and my deadlift and squat are huge too. I was in my san shou class the other day and my instructor was showing one of the moves and I could easily get out of it even if I started off with me in it. How much does strength play a role? And if the person is strong enough are pickups/ body slams allowed? (because I know they are in MMA matches)
     
  2. blanko

    blanko Guest

    when two people of equal or near equal strength are matched ofcourse strength helps. But, in BJJ it's more about technique.
     
  3. flyingknee16

    flyingknee16 Brown Belt

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2003
    Messages:
    2,616
    Likes Received:
    36
    yes. that's the simple answer.
     
  4. monkey roll

    monkey roll Green Belt

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2005
    Messages:
    1,253
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    body slams are not allowed in bjj comps.
     
  5. LCDforMe

    LCDforMe Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2005
    Messages:
    2,362
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Oregon
    Yes it matters but the best thing to do is to learn the techniques then start using strength in addition to it. A strong and technical person is generally pretty tough to beat rather than just a strong person.
     
  6. BulldogSIX

    BulldogSIX Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2005
    Messages:
    474
    Likes Received:
    0
    The most important things in BJJ is technique and leverage. That being said there is a point where technique and leverage will not help you. For example, guy who are bigger than me by about 20-30 lbs I do not have to much of a problem with provided my knowledge of BJJ is greater than theirs. Guys that outweigh me by 30 or more pounds (not just fat boys but strong guys) I have more problems with just because of their size and strength. So focus on your technique and leverage but when your skill level is equal the guy who is in better shape usually wins.
     
  7. Madmick

    Madmick Freedom!!! Staff Member Senior Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2005
    Messages:
    45,929
    Likes Received:
    48,378
    Location:
    NorCal
    There are different kinds of strength.

    So you know, a 275 bench at 175 isn't that great. In the bodybuilding world that may seem impressive, but Scot Mendelson benches 713 without a shirt. THAT's strong.

    And the bench isn't nearly as important as squat or deadlift. That's where your strength is.

    Strength always matters.
     
  8. kimurense

    kimurense Brown Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2002
    Messages:
    4,057
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    London
    did robson moura, royler gracie or leo vieira ever win a absolut division?

    no.

    they are probably the most technical fighters you will ever see... now guess whay that happens..
     
  9. VTJas81

    VTJas81 Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2003
    Messages:
    909
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Boston
    A lil off topic but the only way a smaller guy can neutralize a larger guys strength is by having an explosive core coupled with technique. Strong abs, lower back, hips can get you out of any predicament. Anyone disagree?
     
  10. Ybot

    Ybot Purple Belt

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2003
    Messages:
    1,805
    Likes Received:
    11
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    Your ability as a fighter depends on a balance of several things, and strength is one. Other things to concider:
    -Stamina
    -size
    -technique
    In the end you can cominsate for lack of one area with greater ability in another.
     
  11. BulldogSIX

    BulldogSIX Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2005
    Messages:
    474
    Likes Received:
    0
    No, but only to a certain extent. It still depends on the disparity in strength and weight. Regardless of how strong a 16 year old female BJJ student is she is not going to be able to get Arlovski off of her in side control (just an extreme example). There is a point where size and strength overcome technique and leverage (the other variable is knowledge of the technique).
     
  12. Big Red

    Big Red Green Belt

    Joined:
    May 19, 2005
    Messages:
    1,161
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Columbia
    All about leverage/timing. Saying that, a baby won't be able to upa roll a bear.

    At least I don't think :(
     
  13. BulldogSIX

    BulldogSIX Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2005
    Messages:
    474
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes agreed. I think what I am trying to say is that there is a point where technique and leverage will not overcome size and strength. When technique and leverage are equal or close size and strength are the deciding factors.
     
  14. paulchu

    paulchu Guest

    Strength DOES matter, but it has to work with leverage as well. If you are asking about strength training in regards to grappling, I would definitely focus a lot more on your core, and your "inner" muscles, like the shoulders, the glutes, and thighs. If you think in terms of pure physics, you will get more leverage with these muscles.

    Keep in mind that when you want to control someone's arms in a mount, you control their elbows/wrists. If you want to get out of it, it is much wiser to have strong shoulder/triceps than say, the bicep.

    So yes, strength does matter, that is why they have weight divisions... most of the guys that compete in MMA have a very low body fat percentage, so most of the weight comes in the form of muscle. It's just a matter of building the muscles the right way.

    [​IMG]

    Look at Matt Hughes, he doesn't have rippling abs, nor big biceps, but his neck, shoulders, and triceps are huge. That's where his freak strength comes from.
     
  15. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    6,473
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Everyone is different. Of course there is a point where strength will trump skill and conditioning. That is true of every sport and martial art. However, the point where that happens is different for every sport.

    With BJJ, I think that point is very high, where strength doesn't help that much verses something like wrestling. That's one reason why wrestling weight classes are seperated as they are. It is also one reason grappling weight classes are different from wrestling weight classes.
     
  16. FutureBxer

    FutureBxer Brown Belt

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2003
    Messages:
    3,049
    Likes Received:
    2


    275 bench at 175 IS impressive. Scot mendelson is not benching 713 at a body weight of 175 -- so dont compare . and he stated that his deads and squats are strong as well so what is ur point?


    to the thread starter - strength really helps with speed/agility/explosiveness in MMA/bjj/MT whatever. and it gives you a very nice edge over those who do not. But i will say that technique > strength. BUT as I said - it's still a very nice edge to have.

    when fighting somebody of equal technique - usually the one with better physical conditioning will win.
     
  17. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    6,473
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Truer words were never spoken (in this thread so far)!
     
  18. tommboy

    tommboy White Belt

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2005
    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    7



    yea but im also only 19, scott def. has like the alltime world bench press record, I think he weighs close to 300 though
     
  19. Bama Zulu

    Bama Zulu Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2005
    Messages:
    605
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    North Dakota
    Yeah it helps but if you are going against someone with a huge skill level gap it doesn't really matter.

    But in terms of equal skill and technique, the person with more strength (Depending on his style) will most likely win.
     
  20. blanko

    blanko Guest

    in bjj because you fight so manytimes a night (for the mundials for example) being strong is not as important as being fit and technical.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.