Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by kyokushin723, Apr 28, 2008.
does judo and bjj teach weapon defence and disarming techniques?
I have seen a judo exhibition where they do stuff that includes weapon defence. I remember some of the old gracie jiu jitsu videos having defence against weapons.
Most bjj and judo gyms don't really teach that stuff though.
Judo does, yes.
Though you may have to search before finding a school that does extensive work on it.
In judo, is teached in 2 kata (kodokan goshin jitsu and kime no kata) but not all the people trained it and even who train , it's not for self defence aim.
IIRC, Kano did a lot of this type of work when training the police. I'm a BJJ guy, but for this type of stuff, I think Judo might be a better alternative.
I'm not sure why you're interested in weapon disarms, but training them is stupid, unless you're a prison guard or a cop, IMO. I don't have time to find/link them, but there are a couple of sites out there that deal with the realistic outcomes of knife/weapon attacks; it's not pretty.
There's a vid out there somewhere of cops training for distance/reaction time necessary to draw and fire their weapons against an attacker with a knife. If I recall correctly, most cops (who are reasonably well trained with their weapons) need 15-20 *feet* to adequately respond to an attacker with a knife who draws from concealment. Any closer, and the attacker reaches and is able to inflict killing injuries with the knife. If cops, who train this stuff for real can't react any better than that, I don't think it's worthwhile for the average person to train for that situation.
The best defense against an attacker with a weapon is to run away.
yah, Helio and his sons teach it; you can see examples in Royces and Helios books.
^ I agree, I remember reading an article on self defense written by Roy Harris, and in the first three sentences or, he basically stated "Get ready, because chances are that you're going to get cut or stabbed". Many people think that you'll somehow come out unscathed from an encounter with an armed attacker, and it just isn't so. If you've trained diligently and correctly for a long time, you'll most likely come out alive, but you'll also end up wounded, even seriously.
I did a demo for the kids at my judo club on weapons. I had a pretty athletic high school kid come at me, while I tried to mark him up with a magic marker in my right hand. Had that marker been a knife, that kid would have been dead, and I am no expert with a knife. I was able to get "cuts" on his kneck, chest, and wrists easily, and he never had a chance of taking the marker from me.
hard to find a judo clubt hat does but we have had self defense kata's some nights which where alot of going over getting out of the situation , so disarm/throw and get out of there.
bjj - no.. usually your training for the sport
Judo does in kata, which nobody really does...
All Royce Gracie affiliates must learn the self defense techniques which includes gun defenses. They are similar to ghe gun defenses you learn in jujutsu, Hapkido, etc ...
"Magic Marker"?! You crazy, that stuff's permanent!
I'll stick to Kata.
Yes both of them do but as has been mentioned before not very many stress this side of defence. It is mostly as Judo is now much more of a sport and BJJ is headed that way too. If you are really serious about learning then I would suggest Aikido or Krav mag which being a modern military martial art will have many more "effective" moves. And also as mentioned before you will get cut. Just depends on the severity. A total dilbert who doesn't know what they are doing you might escape unscathed. A knife fighter and you are so dead unless you too have one. Even then you are probably dead.
Judo does in two katas, Goshin Jitsu and Kime-no-kata. No one practices either except for grading (and you only have to worry about it when you go for Yondan and above ... 4th dan). And as always, kata is a lousy way to learn anything ... you don't learn to throw in judo by doing nage-no-kata, you learn by doing randori. There's no weapons randori in judo (well, maybe a few schools somewhere do it, but I've never seen it).
Moreover, the some of the techniques in the katas are just plain bad. For instance, in one of them you put an arm bar on the arm not holding the knife Its one of those cases where you practice the kata for a month, get your belt, and never look at it again until the next grading. If you want to learn weapons techniques, I'd suggest looking at something like Filipino knife arts ... there are problems with their techniques, but at least they spar with weapons (blunted, but still).
The CONCEPT is good, in that the outcome is probably not going to be pretty, but running away is certainly not always the best option. Running is only a good option if you have a safe place TO run to. Running in general is not always a good idea. You give up any element of surprise you might have; if your attacker catches you, it'll be from behind and you're likely to be tired from running. Also, for example, I have a kid. I can't exactly run and leave my kid, and the chances I could run away fast enough while carrying him is pretty slim. I also have a girlfriend which creates the same situation.
There are many options available and people should be aware of them. Running is not the only, and certainly not always the best, option. My martial arts instructor teaches self defense classes, and 90% of his classes are conceptual. How to avoid self defense situations to begin with, and a logical breakdown of your behavior once it reaches the level of physical confrontation.
This is a pretty ignorant statement. There are plenty of people who practice both kata, and their reasons have nothing to do with promotions.
if you want to learn disarms, take hapkido
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