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Do you need some "chemical help" for Sheiko?

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by AR6, Aug 14, 2010.

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  1. AR6

    AR6 Blue Belt

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    In the next couple of months I'll finally pass the 500 in the dead, hopefully get to 405 ATG in the squat (both w/o belt) and still have a crappy 260 bench. So I was looking at the Sheiko stuff and it seems pretty damn difficult. Even the regular numbers and not the ones made for elite lifters.
    Heavy sets across of deadlifts are hard as hell so I was wondering if Sheiko is directed torwards guys that, well, go beyond regular supplements. I know some programs are way to much for people that just have a protein shake and coffee, like Coan's deadlift routine.
    Anyone that has tried Sheiko could give me some input?
     
  2. modena1983

    modena1983 I

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    No. man up. Eat more.
     
  3. PCP

    PCP Guest

    Yes
     
  4. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    I've never personally used Sheiko, but a number of the lifters at the gym I go to do. It's entirely possible to do Sheiko without "Help".

    Sheiko is very carefully planned out to allow you to work with high volumes without overtraining. This is done by rotating hard, meduim and easy days (measured by the average intensity x total reps), alternating weeks that focus more on volume, and weeks that focus more on intensity (although the intensity weeks still are more volume oriented than most other routines), and keeping the average intensity of any lift done at ~70%, which Sheiko believes helps prevent overtraining (So even if you have sets at 80-85%, the average of all sets done is typically ~70%).

    One thing to keep in mind about Sheiko is that the routines given are example routines, of what a routine might look like if it was put together using Sheiko'a principles. As such not only can you modify them, but it's expected.

    The means:

    1) if necessary you can adjust the weight up, or down, I.e. if it calls for doubles at 85% and the weight feels like a joke, or rediculously hard, you can change it...but you better be able to complete the presribed reps and sets.

    2) if necessary you can drop the second round of an exercise. So if the day is Squat, Bench, Squat, but you're feeling dead at the end of benching, you can skip the second round of squats. Alternatively, if it's possible/convenient, you can do these at different times of the day, I.e. Squat, Bench in the morning, and the second squat workout in the evening (but don't change the order).

    3) You can change the assistance work to suit your needs. For example, it's pretty common to switch the suggested assistance with back work like pull-ups and face-pulls.

    4) You can vary the main exercises. For example, instead of benching all the time, you can do some narrow grip work instead. Also, I've heard that pulls to the knees is more effective for lifters who pull sumo, and that it's acceptable to switch pulls to the knees for deficit deadlifts/
     
  5. MatterOverMind

    MatterOverMind Pulling for you

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    There's a link to a spreadsheet for the different Sheiko cycles here. You can thank former member Chaos Mitten for that.

    He and Donut62 made excellent progress with #29 and #37, without using gear, obviously.
    Many other drug-free lifters have made excellent progress with Sheiko as well.

    Stick to 29 and 37, and you'll be fine.
     
  6. Cratos

    Cratos Banned Banned

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    You can do Coan's DL routine drug free.
     
  7. KILL KILL

    KILL KILL Gold Belt

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    I used it for bench back in highschool when you actually had to translate it from Russian. Maybe I wasn't experienced enough but I definately burned myself out after a few weeks. I came to the realization that it was made for people using gear. I was young and may give it a try again sometime though just to test that theory.
     
  8. KILL KILL

    KILL KILL Gold Belt

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    Actually now that i take a look at it, #29 and #37 are only 3 days a week if I'm not mistaken. The one I followed was like 4 sometimes even 5 a week. Needless to say it didn't work out. My form was better than ever though
     
  9. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    Then it was a more advanced Sheiko routine, and you weren't ready for it. Ultimately for elite lifters Sheiko can end up being 5 days a week, and 8 total workouts. But you spend years working up to this point, and not everyone will get there.
     
  10. KILL KILL

    KILL KILL Gold Belt

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    well obviously
     
  11. KILL KILL

    KILL KILL Gold Belt

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    Probably. But it does seem over the top a bit. Has anyone in this forum ever finished the advanced ones without gear?
     
  12. PCP

    PCP Guest

    Honestly, nobody who is following his routines has any idea what was going through Sheiko's head when he wrote them, and everybody has different weaknesses that need to be addressed. Just seems like a terrible idea to follow some cookie-cutter program with no idea why you are doing what you are doing. If someone asked me why am I doing this exercise or that exercise, I'll know why and will be able to give them a reason for doing it.
     
  13. Donut62

    Donut62 Black Belt

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    Drugs are typically introduced around the CMS/MS level. Some people make it higher than that, typically the talented ones. There are quite a few guys doing 4 days week clean, more than that, I doubt it unless they are making significant modifications.
     
  14. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    Sheiko routines are examples of what a routine based on his principles might look like. They're not meant to be used as cookie-cutter routines. That said a beginner lifter should muck about with the examples less (or at least have some kind of guidance when doing so) than a more experienced lifter.
     
  15. hunto

    hunto Brown Belt

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    Crystal meth helps a lot.
     
  16. deckingdutchman

    deckingdutchman Orange Belt

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    It'll help you "crack" the reps right out.

    Lol.
     
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