Do we really need carbs?

[Matt Thornton]

Hell yes you need carbs. Carbs don't just come from bread. I'm assuming you're getting this idea from Atkins. If you want my advice, burn that book.

Carbs come from PLANTS. Any and all PLANTS. Cavemen were not carnivores; humans are OMNIVORES. Carbohydrates are your main source of energy. They are the cleanest-burning energy supply. Your body really does not like using protein to fuel you through workouts. Carbohydrates burn much cleaner and easier. Protein is really better for rebuilding your muscles.

Eat carbs man. Carbs aren't what make you fat; excessive calories are your enemy. Personally, I prefer to eat mostly carbs 2 hours before a workout, and mostly protein about an hour after a workout.

 

[sambo fighter]

If you have an interest on mans "natural diet" there are a coupe of books you should read. One is the Paleo Diet and the other is Neanderthin. Both authors studied modern day hunter gatherer societies to base their diet on. They recomend that 50-60% of your calores come from protien 30% carbs and 20% fat. They suggest getting your carbs from fruits and vegetables instead of grains. Dairy is not allowed. I think its a pretty healthy diet because you eat lots of meat fruit and veggies. I tried being on a diet like this but i really missed bread. So now I try to eat low gi foods and eat clean.

 

[xXx]

Before the advent of agriculture, our caveman ancestors ate mostly protein and fat. They had almost zero carbohydrates. They might have had some access to wild berries or fruits, however, their diet consisted mainly of animals that they killed.

The cavemen got along just fine with this low and sometimes zero carb diet. In fact, they were in great shape, as they hunted and killed animals much larger than themselves.

So, I ask the question, can we live withour carbs at all?

cavemen ate fruits and vegetibles... idk where you got your source from

 

[Rjkd12]

Everything stated here is true. But, I challenge you to take it a step further. Before we were common man, we were cavemen, BUT what before caveman? Probably ape, then some sort of mammal, then bird, then fish. Regardless of the exact order, we all came from fish that did not have agriculture. I say to be the healthiest we need to go back to our roots and filter food particles, suck as plankton, through our teeth.

 

[Sinister]

Fish did not have agriculture? Hmm, so then I must inform species of fish who feed on Ocean vegetation of this immediately, so they're informed they've been doing it wrong.

 

[supersudo]

Fish did not have agriculture? Hmm, so then I must inform species of fish who feed on Ocean vegetation of this immediately, so they're informed they've been doing it wrong.

indeed.. :icon_lol:

 

[pokeyman]

given that the life expectancy of cavemen was somewhere in the 30s or so, do you really want to go about adopting their diet? like some others here have said, we've evolved since then. i think low carb diets can be used when you're trying to reach specific goals (extreme/quick fat loss)-- but as a lifestyle choice? don't go on it just because the cavemen did it. i know that i have much less energy/stamina when i've eaten no carbs.. so would much rather keep a balanced diet (albeit with carbs in moderation!).

 

[steroid-doc]

no you dont 'need' carbs

if your diet was made up from fats and protien you could survive no problems , excess protien is converted to glycogen in the liver , so your body adapts .

not saying its a good idea , but definatley possible

 

[Herculean]

what kind of question is this?



just look at your fucking teeth ... yes see how we do not have teeth like carnivores?
yes wow that must mean something...

and as was stated .. how can you say "cavemen" only ate meat? don't you know the term hunter & gatherer ?? so people go and hunt animals and others go and gather fruits , vegetables and stuff and bring them back to the camps. yes this was before people started farming interesting stuff huh?

just go and look at nomadic peoples from all over the world, they had plenty of different foods.


why is thread even here? =/

 

[eljamaiquino]

Fish did not have agriculture? Hmm, so then I must inform species of fish who feed on Ocean vegetation of this immediately, so they're informed they've been doing it wrong.

Actually, he's right....

science, art and business of cultivating the soil, producing crops, and raising livestock

Unless the fish cultivated the vegetation themselves, they didn't have agriculture.

 

[Rjkd12]

Fish did not have agriculture? Hmm, so then I must inform species of fish who feed on Ocean vegetation of this immediately, so they're informed they've been doing it wrong.

Hey, this guy eljamaiquino has something to tell you. Listen

no you dont 'need' carbs

if your diet was made up from fats and protien you could survive no problems , excess protien is converted to glycogen in the liver , so your body adapts .

not saying its a good idea , but definatley possible

Who the hell are you newb! :wink: Welcome back man, hope to see you posting more often. Good luck with the shoulder.

 

[Sinister]

Alright, ya got me on the dictionary definition of Agriculture, but I was mainly referring to that there are species of fish who feed on vegetation.

 

[supersudo]

Actually, he's right....

science, art and business of cultivating the soil, producing crops, and raising livestock

Unless the fish cultivated the vegetation themselves, they didn't have agriculture.

yeh technically.. but u're missing the point.. fish eat veggies.. and we must eat veggies as well.. where else would we get our anti-oxidants, alkalizing greens, *FIBER*, and our full range of vitamins and minerals? ... without fiber, we would be forever constipated and die

i think u get my point here.. :wink:

 

[steroid-doc]

Actually, he's right....

science, art and business of cultivating the soil, producing crops, and raising livestock

Unless the fish cultivated the vegetation themselves, they didn't have agriculture.

yes but a bye product of the nitrogen cycle + light = algea (sea weed) which is vegetation and is the only food a lot of fish eat , suppose this is primative agriculture

also the life expectancy of a caveman wasnt only down to diet , he didnt have a playstation

its obvious to me the fact the body can create its own carb source that over the millions of years we have had to do long periods without them completley

 

[moodymikey]

but hasnt it been proved that the Atkins diet is actually unhealthy, and a risky way to lose weight? of course we need carbs

 

[Sinister]

its obvious to me the fact the body can create its own carb source that over the millions of years we have had to do long periods without them completley

Now there's a logical bit of reasoning, and probably the most logical. I don't think we can go so long without carbohydrates though (of some sort) for the simple reason of maintenance of blood/glucose levels and the issue of extreme insulin sensitivity. This can be attributed though to a basic general downfall in health in modern-times. Evolutionarily speaking, past couple of generations have made it damn-near impossible to do without certain things simply because the alarming birthrates in certain areas. Plus, there are also a lot of indiginous tribes I noticed that do have sources of carbohydrates that are very unconventional and difficult to class as carbohydrates. If anyone watches that show "Going Tribal" (a WONDERFUL program that any of you who thinks you're tough ought to watch, most young people would kill themselves if they had to go through what that dude goes through just to Produce the show), you'll see a lot of Cultural habits that have gone un-changed for quite a while, and are quite surprising and little-known to us. The dude who the show is about was with some Tribe (I forget) and they were harvesting a starch-substance from the inside of a species of trees, and lo-and-behold it's their dietary staple. They have other things they eat regularly that are largely protein or fat-based, but this thing is what they stress and gravitate to the most. And this is a people without the benefits of modern-knowledge. Much to my surprise they weren't the only Tribe.

BoxingFanNoMore and I also had a discussion about Native American tribes and grains. There is a good amount of incorrect History out there, and one of the biggest incorrect facts about Native American tribes is that there were none who lived almost solely on grain-based diets. This is simply untrue. There were tribes of regions who survived mainly on wild-rice, and contrary to popular opinion Corn itself is a grain, not a vegetable. These two main dietary staples are both carbohydrate-based and had been around before the advent of large-scale wheat harvest and processing. I bring all this up because these are people who despite some advancements, are about as close to Caveman-lifestyles as we'll know. Take away complex language, and other basic Cultural practices and they practically were (and still are in cases of today's indiginous Tribes) Cavemen, and the importance of carbohydrates is still abundantly clear, in many cases, though not all of them.

 

[steroid-doc]

Now there's a logical bit of reasoning, and probably the most logical. I don't think we can go so long without carbohydrates though (of some sort) for the simple reason of maintenance of blood/glucose levels and the issue of extreme insulin sensitivity. This can be attributed though to a basic general downfall in health in modern-times. QUOTE]


yeah i know where your coming from , modern day man will become reliant on the big mac and other crappy foods and will loose the power to adapt


But for the time being blood sugar levels are maintained with protien alone and insulin sensitivty is actualy better becuase levels arnt being spiked all the time , when protien is in excess and atp cells are full the liver will use gluconeogenesis to from glucose from amino acids , this maintains blood sugar levels and insulin regulates it as normal , when protien isnt in excess ketones will be produced

the only problem ive had with living like this is that when your going through this cycle amonia/urea levels can be higher in the blood and probaly wouldnt live as long if you had to do it all your life ? but who knows

 

[Sinister]

Hmm, I have been reading lately that high quality protein diets can do this (replace glycogen stores) as well as carbohydrates if they're used as a dietary staple, however I still question it to some degree. Many of these fad-diets (Fartkins for example) that eliminate carbs have done a lot to create very high risk for diabetes in long-term users. I know that has a lot to do with over-dependance on fats, but the overall data just leads me to believe that balance of all things, as opposed to the entire elimination of one thing or another, tends to work out best in the end. Most of the guys I meet who are old as Hell AND strong, abide by strict regimens that contain the 4 basic food groups of athletes, quality protein, balanced fats, complex carbohydrates, and tightly regimented amounts of simple sugars and saturated and trans-fats.

 

[steroid-doc]

im not fan of the atkins diet at all, the thing with it is they go from being obese from eating too much fat and sugars and having poor insulin sensitivity, then they eat no carbs , poor protien sources and lots of poor fats (sausages and the like) they loose weight because they are on a calorie defecit, all the time they are on loosing weight they are craving sugars, and because they aint training/health type inclined people they start eating shyte again once they have hit there target weight , so there diets range from bad - terible . I think this has a lot to attribute to the diabetese

personly though ive tried to go long periods on low GI carb sources even when bulking and in calorie surplus and i really do feel like shit all the time , i deffo need some sugars in my diet

 

[Sinister]

Word, I like how yourself and a couple of other Veteran Posters here have seemed to come out of the woodwork and routinely post in here. Says to me I must be doing a decent job of keeping this place at least semi-intelligent.