Dirty BJJ

[El Tiburon]

haha, we all tap bro. if no one was tapping you, would there be any point in coming back? nope. I just got my ass brutalized this morning/afternoon - i mean, i got horribly neck cranked multiple times by a guy who had about 40 pounds on me, was way stronger, and had better technique to boot - it happens.

i had it explained to me like this once: all grappling movements rely on some biomechanical advantage - you attack and isolate the weakest points of a person's body with your whole body, or attack a person's point of balance, the weakest point of their position, etc. thats why these moves work even for smaller guys. then, AFTER you learn good technique you start to work your power back into the game, which makes you a monster because you then know how to use all your strength and power in the most effective and efficient way.

btw, it was kinda amusing to hear a big guy bitch about being too strong, ha. jk man, good luck stick with it.

I am going to stick around. Right now I am a little injured (Dental problem) but I plan on cutting down to around 225 by only doing cardio. I have stopped lifting weights cold turkey and I am now in search of a diet that could help me reduce my mass without starving myself.
I thought about droping the class but I am not going to.

 

[SaSHMMA]

What a load of shit.

How so?

 

[colinm]

the bit about not gaining functional strength from weight lifting, i beleive.

 

[KOU In3]

the bit about not gaining functional strength from weight lifting, i beleive.

Then why does every single wrestler weight train? I can tell you first hand that it does matter. My choke and armbar defense is much better due to greater strength. Same with holding or taking position. Sorry, but lifting weights works.

Look at the whole point being made by the thread starter even, his greater strength allows him to power through in situations where he really 'shouldn't' be able to. Meaning that his weight training equates to functional strength on the mat.

 

[colinm]

im not arguing that weight training doesnt increase functional strength, i was just pointing out what ted-p was calling bullshit about. i lift to supplement my grappling as well.

 

[nick889]

I am 5-11 and weigh approximately 265 (former competetive weightlifter). For the past 5 months that I was taking BJJ lessons. My performance went from bad to worse. When I started, I was using my power to basically overwhelm guys. Then one day (in the first month) I rolled with the master of the school, a Black Belt in Gracie JJ. At first I was muscling him but he easily made me tap a dozen times in about 15 minutes. It was a sad sight. I went home to Ice my arm and spent the whole next day massaging the soreness out of my neck.

He told me that I had to not rely on power as much as to learn the skills. I agree completely but when I roll now I get manhandled. By bigger guys, smaller guys teenaged white belts, etc. I feel helpless when I can't use my size and power. It is like telling Barry Bonds that Homeruns don't count. Then again when I apply an Ezekel choke to someone and squeeze with all I have, I feel like it is dirty Jiu Jitsu. Then again when a Blue Belt fights like he is fighting for a kidney transplant, cranks my arm in an armbar with all he has. I get really pissed and I spend the whole next day pissed and in pain.

My question to you guys. Is there a martial art that I can learn that I can utilize my size and power. BJJ is no fun anymore.

dude at least you have size thats a sweet advantage once your technique comes. im 5'6 like 150, not big at all. all i have is technique. you think you go manhandeled when you started imagine what it was like for me.

 

[KOU In3]

im not arguing that weight training doesnt increase functional strength, i was just pointing out what ted-p was calling bullshit about. i lift to supplement my grappling as well.

Gotcha. Sorry for misunderstanding.

 

[Orphangrinder]

I am going to stick around. Right now I am a little injured (Dental problem) but I plan on cutting down to around 225 by only doing cardio. I have stopped lifting weights cold turkey and I am now in search of a diet that could help me reduce my mass without starving myself.
I thought about droping the class but I am not going to.

You might want to reconsider quitting the weights. Without that stimulation, you'll lose more muscle than necessary, in addition to fat. Unless you don't have much fat to lose anyway...

About your original question, though -- the point of not relying on power is to learn to use technique. You're getting handled by small guys because they have better technique. The more you focus on your technique as opposed to power, the more of a monster you're gonna be when you add that power back in. Just take it easy, and remember that the point of your class is to learn, not to win sparring matches.

And it's good to hear you're gonna stick with it.

 

[devante]

yeah just back up the strength w/tech; if u get them in a cleam hold and use strenght to power it out to a finish, they won't have a problem.

they prob get mad cus ur tech is poor and it is obvious if u were not that big/strong, they you would not be able to finish which is true...

ur not always gonna be the stronger guy so u have to be more tech or at least dev the tech, i.e. if u and a guy have equal strength, ur skill will be the diff. An if u face a guy wequal skill ur strength will be the diff...

either way try to be calm and just take it day by day...but don't ever think ur strength is a liability it's not but it can't be the base of ur whole ggameplan...

hughes/fedor have strength; but they back it w/crisp tech, same thing w/the earlier ken shamrock...great strength power, but backed w/solid tech.

 

[El Tiburon]

dude at least you have size thats a sweet advantage once your technique comes. im 5'6 like 150, not big at all. all i have is technique. you think you go manhandeled when you started imagine what it was like for me.

Dude, just think about my psyche when a guy what I out weigh by over 100 LB makes me tap 4 times in 5 minutes. Almost everybody that I have talked to tells me that they went through a time as a white belt that they were convinced that they were going to drop BJJ. And how glad they are that they stuck around.

 

[DIYWMD]

Maybe I should just drop BJJ and give Vale Tudo a try.

Maybe you should drop the weights and give your fucking brain a try. Even if you tried Vale Tudo, the guys with good ground game would keep making you look like a fool.

 

[kneecompression]

I am going to stick around. Right now I am a little injured (Dental problem) but I plan on cutting down to around 225 by only doing cardio. I have stopped lifting weights cold turkey and I am now in search of a diet that could help me reduce my mass without starving myself.
I thought about droping the class but I am not going to.

very cool very cool. with a little time, probably less than for most people, you'll be stompin alot of people. on top of that, you'll be a great training partner for the guys that have been around for ever. patience is a virtue in this sport. you have the physical tools to be pretty impressive, glad to hear you're gonna keep at it.

 

[buttski]

hey as a 6'3" 270lb i know all about being big doesn't mean everything, i was always just trying to keep from hurting people with my size and depending on it. cuz face it, if you are always using your size and strength as a crutch you won't develop the technique as well.
-but BJJ it great when someone who is big and strong has awesome technique.......
also good word of advice- if you are not tapping you are not learning
you learn more from loss than from victory

 

[Gsoares2***]

The thing is, if you just want to find a sport that uses size and strength.. YOU WILL ALWAYS LOSE to that one guy who is bigger and stronger than you. But if your technical first and strong second.. there will be nothing he can do.. he will be like you against the blackbelt.

Keep training BJJ! For such a big strong guy.. you sure sound like a pussy.

I think a big problem is, you see your self as this big tough guy.. when you go to bjj and get "manhandled" you cant stand those little fuckers beating you without any strength.. So you smash through them and use every bit of strength you have.. to show your the tough guy you think you are.. Lose the fuckin ego and just keep training.. be smooth.. If you keep training.. you will understand.

Everyone goes and in the beginning they lose.. big guys from some reason think they especialy are going to be an exception.. because "Im big".... If you dont lose, you go crazy(spazz), eventually get hurt, and then quit...

Its like a fat person saying they want to lose weight, but they cant stop eating cake.
Your a big guy who wants jiujitsu- but cant stop using power.. learn the technicle side of things and think how much better it will make you. If you can already meat head through these people.. think what it will be like when you actualy know what to do.. and can do it clean. You wont even break a sweat.

 

[beatin'stick]

Yeah, man. Put pride aside in the gym and learn the techniques of leverage and position. Then if you compete or fight, that part will come naturally and your power can see you through rough spots or buy you an advantage.

 

[350 lbs fist]

One tip from me:
Always start on the bottom. Big guys are at a disadvantage against smaller, faster guys when they're on their back.
This forces you to be technical to survive much like your strength advantage forces smaller guys to rely on technique.
Once you learn that technical mindset where you're more interested in applying technique than winning in training you're gonna be hard to beat.

And if you have short, powerful legs the half guard is your thing.
Trust me on this.

 

[Mirada]

almost every time I use my power on these guys (White belts and some blues) they tap. Sometimes they get pissed and want to pick a fight because I caught them in a tight armtriangle that cracked every bone in thier necks. Then I get all apologetic and feel bad that I hurt them.

Instead of trying to win matches, focus on learning technique.

If you do it right, an arm triangle won't hurt someone's spine or jaw at all, and it won't take any strength at all to finish it. It takes a few ounces of pressure to cut off someone's bloodflow man, for any kind of choke strength is absolutely unecessary.

The reason these guys get angry with you is simple, they work hard almost every day to develop the skills that they have, and when someone with a freakish natural advantage comes in and overwhelms them, some resentment is natural, especially if the person is dealing out injuries at the same time, as is usually the case. I'm still paying for a roided out douchebag's decision to "use his power" to make up for shitty technique. He got a "win" and my knee has never been the same since.



As for your other problem, your size makes you a definate target, but there's an easy cure for this too man. Suck it up, fucking be a man and let these guys tap you out. Once they've armbarred you ten or twenty times they won't feel that need to scalp you any more and you guys can both get on with the real business of training together to develop your jiujitsu.

 

[Ualue]

Hey Tiburon,

Is there a guy who trains there by the first name Dominic? He works as a firefighter.

 

[Teedoh74]

Pay your dues, we all did, be a man damnit!

 

[ARIS]

lol this thread is funny... Being Strong and powerfull is a gift from nature but if you rely mostly on your strenght to dominate your opponents your technique will take long time to improve and you will always lose by higher belts. What your teacher said is the most important thing...

I rolled with the master of the school, a Black Belt in Gracie JJ. At first I was muscling him but he easily made me tap a dozen times in about 15 minutes. It was a sad sight. I went home to Ice my arm and spent the whole next day massaging the soreness out of my neck.

He told me that I had to not rely on power as much as to learn the skills.

If you get guys in armtriangle choke try to aply the technique properly and choke them and not cank their necks... If you feel the you put lot's of strenght to make them tap then you are doing something wrong, simply stop and change the technique or try do it more correct. You have to give it time, sometimes you get hurt in training it's all part of the game, put some ice rest and take it easy.