Did UFC need Fedor or did Fedor need UFC?

[eddi]

UFC, of course, didn't need Fedor, as they didn't really need Askren or Cole Conrad.

Thinking you could build an org around one person is a huge mistake which was proved not only by futile attempts to build it around Emelianenko, but also around Kimbo Slice.

Emelianenko at the time seriously thought he was unbeatable and, therefore, bigger than any small-time American org where fighters can't just bring circus freaks instead of real contenders, have to take doping tests, etc. But it soon became clear that Emelianenko was a grossly overrated can crusher, while UFC continues to be #1 org in the world. Deep inside Emelianenko himself knew he had no legit excuse not to go UFC, that's why Sambo tournament bullshit was introduced. When White allowed him to compete in Sambo (which is ridiculous for a professional athlete, but beating up amateurs is his wheelhouse), yet another bullshit excuse immediately cropped up.

Fedor went on to fail as a politician, promoter, official and businessman. Because you gotta love what you do and do it in earnest instead of trying to pool wool over everybody's eyes and fuck people over.

did you just compare fedor to askren and conrad ?

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

I think UFC and Dana wanted Fedor more just because they can say they had all the GOATs under their umbrella. That's just my take on it.

 

[HuskySamoan]

UFC, of course, didn't need Fedor, as they didn't really need Askren or Cole Conrad.

Thinking you could build an org around one person is a huge mistake which was proved not only by futile attempts to build it around Emelianenko, but also around Kimbo Slice.

Emelianenko at the time seriously thought he was unbeatable and, therefore, bigger than any small-time American org where fighters can't just bring circus freaks instead of real contenders, have to take doping tests, etc. But it soon became clear that Emelianenko was a grossly overrated can crusher, while UFC continues to be #1 org in the world. Deep inside Emelianenko himself knew he had no legit excuse not to go UFC, that's why Sambo tournament bullshit was introduced. When White allowed him to compete in Sambo (which is ridiculous for a professional athlete, but beating up amateurs is his wheelhouse), yet another bullshit excuse immediately cropped up.

Fedor went on to fail as a politician, promoter, official and businessman. Because you gotta love what you do and do it in earnest instead of trying to pool wool over everybody's eyes and fuck people over.

Islam Makhachev and Merab Dvalishvili I know competed at Sambo worlds during their UFC careers, Merab most recently in 2019. That honestly seems like a hard thing to stop guys from doing, just like a lot of UFC guys have simultaneously competed in wrestling, BJJ and No Gi during their UFC careers.

 

[pamirec]

Fedor and the UFC didn’t need each other more than the fans wanted to see them together.

 

[fedorthegoat777]

Neither.
Both established themselves as the best without needed each other.

Fedor became the greatest fighter of all time outside of the UFC, beat all top contenders and former UFC champs.
The UFC became the premier organization by locking up all of the great fighters, except one.

Fedor was able to resist being Dana's bitch, which was truly his greatest accomplishment.

 

[Mind Mine]

I'll say it: Fedor was more comfortable winning fixed fights and padding his record outside of better competition. He got to beat all the UFC heavyweights when they were on the decline and were unwanted by the UFC. There's a reason most Pride superstars got their shit kicked in in the UFC... most were winning fixed fights in Japan and possibly didn't even know it.

I don’t speak on that era. Before my time but if you were from that era and that’s your honest take I respect the honesty

 

[YesForGayJesus]

Both parties have done quite well for themselves without the other.

 

[TorontoTO]

UFC, of course, didn't need Fedor, as they didn't really need Askren or Cole Conrad.

Thinking you could build an org around one person is a huge mistake which was proved not only by futile attempts to build it around Emelianenko, but also around Kimbo Slice.

Emelianenko at the time seriously thought he was unbeatable and, therefore, bigger than any small-time American org where fighters can't just bring circus freaks instead of real contenders, have to take doping tests, etc. But it soon became clear that Emelianenko was a grossly overrated can crusher, while UFC continues to be #1 org in the world. Deep inside Emelianenko himself knew he had no legit excuse not to go UFC, that's why Sambo tournament bullshit was introduced. When White allowed him to compete in Sambo (which is ridiculous for a professional athlete, but beating up amateurs is his wheelhouse), yet another bullshit excuse immediately cropped up.

Fedor went on to fail as a politician, promoter, official and businessman. Because you gotta love what you do and do it in earnest instead of trying to pool wool over everybody's eyes and fuck people over.

Man I can’t believe that Fedor beat all those cans from the UFC who were champs or later became champs. Makes you think

maybe everyone should retire at 32 like khabib and then never lose once you get older so dummies can’t point at it as something that diminishes everything they did before. Anderson Silva, ya not that great since how many did he lose to end his mma career?

 

[The Reed]

Both did fine on their own.
UFC - Premier org.
Fedor - Premier Fighter.

 

[Paul E Gensinger]

Neither.
Both established themselves as the best without needed each other.

Fedor became the greatest fighter of all time outside of the UFC, beat all top contenders and former UFC champs.
The UFC became the premier organization by locking up all of the great fighters, except one.

Fedor was able to resist being Dana's bitch, which was truly his greatest accomplishment.

Greatest fighter of all time that got finished FIVE times?!
No boxer who has been knocked out 4 times would EVER be considered Goat.
No other MMA fighter with 5 losses would be considered Goat.
If losses at the end of a career don't count than Anderson Silva is Goat; and BJ's terrible losing streak doesn't count.
Fine, Melvin Guillard and Faceplant Frodo are both Goat.
Not a beta male; don't live in my mom's basement; I've been watching since UFC 1.

 

[Paul E Gensinger]

Man I can’t believe that Fedor beat all those cans from the UFC who were champs or later became champs. Makes you think

maybe everyone should retire at 32 like khabib and then never lose once you get older so dummies can’t point at it as something that diminishes everything they did before. Anderson Silva, ya not that great since how many did he lose to end his mma career?

Solid points.
But losses still count.
That's why Khabib is the Greatest Russian Mixed Martial Artist of All Time. If wins count, then so do losses. If losses don't count, then neither do wins. So we judge a fighter by what exactly? Quality of competition? Like Hong Man Choi? Real legacy builder there.....

 

[Greyscale]

Man I can’t believe that Fedor beat all those cans from the UFC who were champs or later became champs. Makes you think

maybe everyone should retire at 32 like khabib and then never lose once you get older so dummies can’t point at it as something that diminishes everything they did before. Anderson Silva, ya not that great since how many did he lose to end his mma career?

Yeah, Frank Mir, for example, was a HW champ some 11 years before facing Fedor, lol. Too bad Emelianenko was fighting the version of Mir which was tapping to strikes standing. Same with Coleman, who was done even before Emelianenko started his career and was throwing fights in Pride. He fought poor 40-42 year Coleman twice. Sylvia and Rampage also quite obviously showed up for a paycheck. I wonder why Emelianenko never pushed for a fight with Royce Gracie.

Anderson Silva was beating best of best for 10 years and has 13 title wins in the best org. Emelianenko, on the other side, didn't even FACE the majority of top fighters of his era and only has himself to blame. He never fought Couture, Ricco R, Lesnar, JDS, Cain, Overeem, Carwin, Kharitonov, Barnett, Cormier, Stipe and others. At his peak, he chose (and not Vadim, Dana or anyone else) to fight Choi, Lindland and Zulu instead. What are we even talking about here.

Fedor went on to fail as a politician, promoter, official and businessman. Because you gotta love what you do and do it in earnest instead of trying to pool wool over everybody's eyes and fuck people over.

My my. I completely forgot about his acting endeavor. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1410198/ another abject failure.

Overall, his career failing ultimately in every aspect is a result of one bad life choice, I suppose. He had no intention to build on his success and around 2007 decided to sit back and reap the benefits. He stopped progressing as a fighter (and, per his own words, stopped seriously training) and started to rapidly degrade as a human being. He thought his name alone would just buy him anything. But it didn't, except for maybe a decision over Maldonado.

 

[TorontoTO]

Yeah, Frank Mir, for example, was a HW champ some 11 years before facing Fedor, lol. Too bad Emelianenko was fighting the version of Mir which was tapping to strikes standing. Same with Coleman, who was done even before Emelianenko started his career and was throwing fights in Pride. He fought poor 40-42 year Coleman twice. Sylvia and Rampage also quite obviously showed up for a paycheck. I wonder why Emelianenko never pushed for a fight with Royce Gracie.

Anderson Silva was beating best of best for 10 years and has 13 title wins in the best org. Emelianenko, on the other side, didn't even FACE the majority of top fighters of his era and only has himself to blame. He never fought Couture, Ricco R, Lesnar, JDS, Cain, Overeem, Carwin, Kharitonov, Barnett, Cormier, Stipe and others. At his peak, he chose (and not Vadim, Dana or anyone else) to fight Choi, Lindland and Zulu instead. What are we even talking about here.

Every UFC champ he faced was actually just showing up for a cheque. Randleman suplexing Fedor was just him showing up for a cheque. Excuses for everything

also all those guys you listed are literally not off his era. And lol Ricco, imagine being upset Fedor didn’t face Ricco. “At his peak, he chose to face Choi, Lindland and Zulu”. Like I said, majority of the guys you listed were not around the time he faced those three

All in all, a deluded mess which is either a troll or a seriously smooth brained individual

 

[TorontoTO]

Solid points.
But losses still count.
That's why Khabib is the Greatest Russian Mixed Martial Artist of All Time. If wins count, then so do losses. If losses don't count, then neither do wins. So we judge a fighter by what exactly? Quality of competition? Like Hong Man Choi? Real legacy builder there.....

If Fedor retired at Khabib’s age he would be coming off the Arlovski win. And lol complaining about quality of fighters when Fedor has faced more top tier talent then Khabib

 

[Greyscale]

If Fedor retired at Khabib’s age he would be coming off the Arlovski win. And lol complaining about quality of fighters when Fedor has faced more top tier talent then Khabib

Khabib himself has a big quality of opposition problem. But I still rank his career higher as he actually fought in UFC, albeit did his best to avoid dangerous opponents. Fedor only fought either former champions 2-11 years removed from their belts (and still managed to lose to a MW Hendo), or future champions in Nog and Werdum, which yielded mixed results.

I'd say they both have very much padded records and Fedor faced more top fighters than Khabib. But Khabib, having faced only 4 top fighters in his entire career, remains undefeated against all others by virtue of not facing them.

Fedor is Michael "Venom" Page of HW division at best.

 

[TorontoTO]

Khabib himself has a big quality of opposition problem. But I still rank his career higher as he actually fought in UFC, albeit did his best to avoid dangerous opponents. Fedor only fought either former champions 2-11 years removed from their belts (and still managed to lose to a MW Hendo), or future champions in Nog and Werdum, which yielded mixed results.

I'd say they both have very much padded records and Fedor faced more top fighters than Khabib. But Khabib, having faced only 4 top fighters in his entire career, remains undefeated against all others by virtue of not facing them.

Fedor is Michael "Venom" Page of HW division at best.

Pride HW was better then UFC HW at the time and you are honestly just a UFC fan boy with nothing really to back it up since guys Fedor beat went on to win the UFC title AFTER their losses to him

Ricco lost to Big Nog, who Fedor beat, what exactly makes you think that Ricco would have been a challenge for Fedor

Lol also I remember you, you are the guy who has a vendetta against any Russian fighter who even ever said anything slightly pro-Russian.

 

[Greyscale]

Pride HW was better then UFC HW at the time and you are honestly just a UFC fan boy with nothing really to back it up since guys Fedor beat went on to win the UFC title AFTER their losses to him

Which "guys" are you talking about?

 

[TorontoTO]

Which "guys" are you talking about?

Big Nog won the interim UFC title after his Pride days, also beat Tim Sylvia and Couture in the UFC, two guys you think Fedor should have fought in the UFC to prove to you something.

But like I said, you have an obvious bias against Fedor because of what he has said in the past about Donbas. I think you called him fascist and other things.

Ты что, западный русский, что ли? Думаете, что вы один из просвещенных, потому что живете на Западе?

 

[Greyscale]

Big Nog won the interim UFC title after his Pride days, also beat Tim Sylvia and Couture in the UFC, two guys you think Fedor should have fought in the UFC to prove to you something.

But like I said, you have an obvious bias against Fedor because of what he has said in the past about Donbas. I think you called him fascist and other things.

Big Nog was the "guys" who beat outgoing Sylvia and , but he was not the best at UFC at any moment, had no any title reign and was destroyed by Frank and Vel. Cro Cop was exposed by Gonzaga without even getting any interim titles.

My opinion of Fedor soured around 2008-2009 when I realized that he is a liar and hypocrite, some 5-6 years before the Donbas situation. My view of him as a person and a public figure in Russia is separate of my assessment of his career achievements.

 

[TorontoTO]

Big Nog was the "guys" who beat outgoing Sylvia, but he was not the best at UFC at any moment, had no any title reign and was destroyed by Frank and Vel.

My opinion of Fedor soured around 2008-2009 when I realized that he is a liar and hypocrite, some 5-6 years before the Donbas situation. My view of him as a person and a public figure in Russia is separate of my assessment of his career achievements.

I think Fedor's political stances are definitely clouding your opinions on his career