Deconstructing MMA Myths... [Part 16] - Siamese Brothers, The 2 HW GOATs...

[gono btw]

Thanks TS. I think this shows why people often say Fedor and Nog are #1 and #2 while the next fighter is a distant #3.

Unfortunately, more often than not, people say that it´s a one-man race...

 

[iLikeBirds]

Stipe Miocic
Cain Velasquez
Mirko CroCop
Frank Mir
Fabricio Werdum
Shane Carwin

What a record. No love for this man when it comes to HW Goatness?

 

[One MMA Fan]

Ok nice post and nice breakdown, I wasn't fallowing the sport that early so I didn't experience them like you did.. only by re-watching but no real hype and the feeling of that era I'm more of a 2006-2007 guy but hey consider where the heck I'm from in my neck of the woods its considered OG as it gets.

I did get to see the magic of Fedor in his prime or what I consider it at least till that 2008 Tym Sylvia fight so I did get to experience the one many consider GOAT in his full glory and full hype, wished I've been here doing it in 2003-2005 the peak of the mountain.. I can only imagine the times.

Okay so your overall point is the distance between Nr.1 and Nr.2 on the HW GOAT list (overall GOAT) is actually smaller then initial considered. Okay I will give you that maybe you are correct but the clear 1 can't be denied.. we have 2 direct results not just 1 maybe with that only one you could have made a stronger case and trump the result cause hey it's just 1 fight it can happen but the second W is already to much, it's direct results and he has prime Nog on his own hit list 2 x times so that to me is a big deal then you have the way Fedor performed and how dominant he looked while on top in his peak, you didn't really get the feeling that this guy is in danger of losing his next fight or "o shit scary fight, could be close" he had a reputation and in retrospect he had it for a good reason it was deserved and warranted.

For newer fans that point to Stipe or Cain or JDS or what 'modern' HW they want.. things are different guys overall GOAT-ness isn't based just on potential and what if they fight prime vs prime type of fantasy scenarios, it's about resume here and competition and the way they looked why getting those Ws. Example me the guy with the Cain AV and I don't even have my boy Cain in the top 3 GOAT list.. I barely put him at the end of the top 5 and I got a big ass 'problem' in the fact Stipe can easily take that spot soon enough win more W's.

Last if you are talking UFC and results then heck Stipe does have the record and it means something, it's hard to defend that HW strap in the UFC and he did it for a record number of times and he can very well claim it again too. Then again we have DC and his actually DEFENDING HIS HW TITTLE in 2 weeks vs Lewis.. a dude that is losing his fights until the end when he lands a bomb on the dudes that had been molesting him all along.. said dudes that aren't stellar themselves by any chance and here we have it in late 2018 Lewis is a top 3 UFC HW that is about to most likely become a HW statistic in defense of the tittle by DC, how much value would that W really hold.

Back on track, Fedor is still Nr.1 in my book but interesting to see that maybe you are right and that gap isn't that huge between the gold and silver spots.

 

[Tarzan Johnson]

Change your sissy AV.

You better do some research bro Pucca's no sissy and Garu can hold it down as well.

 

[Kilogram of meat]

They are 1 and 2, but Nog isn't close to Fedor

He himself would tell you that

 

[Arne Rud]

@i igree

 

[2004 account]

Stipe would've crushed Nogueira, and Stipe has far fewer losses

Him vs Fedor is a 50-50 fight though

Great to see this dude finally got what was coming to him for being such a Trolling Machine. Bye, see you on your next account. Lol

 

[gono btw]

They are 1 and 2, but Nog isn't close to Fedor

He himself would tell you that

A matter of perspective, Im afraid...

 

[gono btw]

hard to judge rings fights when nobody knows their judging criteria

You have to read between the 'lines'/ropes...

In ol´school org. like Rings (or more recent ones like Pankration Atrium Cup), where the ref. had such a trigger-happy stand-up rule (even in case of full mounts), probably means that Ground Control was not really rewarded, for instance...

 

[Make Sherdog Great Again]

Let me Guess... Cain is

Kimbo.

 

[gono btw]

Kimbo.

 

[Gambit MMA]

Stipe Miocic
Cain Velasquez
Mirko CroCop
Frank Mir
Fabricio Werdum
Shane Carwin

What a record. No love for this man when it comes to HW Goatness?

imaigne if he won the reem fight....hope they still rematch so jds can avenge that.

 

[gono btw]

Stipe Miocic
Cain Velasquez
Mirko CroCop
Frank Mir
Fabricio Werdum
Shane Carwin

What a record. No love for this man when it comes to HW Goatness?

Fedor & Nog did more and were more well-rounded, their competition was tougher too.

 

[Typrune Goatley]

 

[gono btw]

 

[Number 8]

And how many rounds has Fedor lost from 2001-2009? You are missing some info.

 

[gono btw]

And how many rounds has Fedor lost from 2001-2009? You are missing some info.

Strength of Schedule...

 

[MMA__Analyst]

Stipe would've crushed Nogueira, and Stipe has far fewer losses

Don't see how. If Stipe takes him down, Big Nog would liekly submit him. Stipe has never taken down and ground n pounded someone who has world class BJJ off their back. Standing up Big nog is very underrated trading with Sergei Kharitonov who hits much harder than Stipe.

Stipe's style is effective but not all that spectacular. Big Nog was able to survive against people like Cro Cop who is a much more lethal striker with more tools in his striking arsenal than Stipe. Also I refuse to believe that Stipe can crack prime Big Nogs chin after seeing Nog vs Sapp, Fedor, Cro Cop, and etc...

 

[gono btw]

Ok nice post and nice breakdown, I wasn't fallowing the sport that early so I didn't experience them like you did.. only by re-watching but no real hype and the feeling of that era I'm more of a 2006-2007 guy but hey consider where the heck I'm from in my neck of the woods its considered OG as it gets.

I did get to see the magic of Fedor in his prime or what I consider it at least till that 2008 Tym Sylvia fight so I did get to experience the one many consider GOAT in his full glory and full hype, wished I've been here doing it in 2003-2005 the peak of the mountain.. I can only imagine the times.

Okay so your overall point is the distance between Nr.1 and Nr.2 on the HW GOAT list (overall GOAT) is actually smaller then initial considered. Okay I will give you that maybe you are correct but the clear 1 can't be denied.. we have 2 direct results not just 1 maybe with that only one you could have made a stronger case and trump the result cause hey it's just 1 fight it can happen but the second W is already to much, it's direct results and he has prime Nog on his own hit list 2 x times so that to me is a big deal then you have the way Fedor performed and how dominant he looked while on top in his peak, you didn't really get the feeling that this guy is in danger of losing his next fight or "o shit scary fight, could be close" he had a reputation and in retrospect he had it for a good reason it was deserved and warranted.

For newer fans that point to Stipe or Cain or JDS or what 'modern' HW they want.. things are different guys overall GOAT-ness isn't based just on potential and what if they fight prime vs prime type of fantasy scenarios, it's about resume here and competition and the way they looked why getting those Ws. Example me the guy with the Cain AV and I don't even have my boy Cain in the top 3 GOAT list.. I barely put him at the end of the top 5 and I got a big ass 'problem' in the fact Stipe can easily take that spot soon enough win more W's.

Last if you are talking UFC and results then heck Stipe does have the record and it means something, it's hard to defend that HW strap in the UFC and he did it for a record number of times and he can very well claim it again too. Then again we have DC and his actually DEFENDING HIS HW TITTLE in 2 weeks vs Lewis.. a dude that is losing his fights until the end when he lands a bomb on the dudes that had been molesting him all along.. said dudes that aren't stellar themselves by any chance and here we have it in late 2018 Lewis is a top 3 UFC HW that is about to most likely become a HW statistic in defense of the tittle by DC, how much value would that W really hold.

Back on track, Fedor is still Nr.1 in my book but interesting to see that maybe you are right and that gap isn't that huge between the gold and silver spots.

Strength of Schedule has to be the differential here, between these 2 legends...

 

[One MMA Fan]

Strength of Schedule has to be the differential here, between these 2 legends...

Who you got as your clear Nr. 1 ?

PS: forum really glitchy I typed like 2 responses already none saved.. here is number 3 the super short version hope it works.

 

[One MMA Fan]

It didn't work yet again..

Who is your top 5 GOAT then maybe it doesn't like me asking just one.