CTE Hysteria?

[SandaKicker]

Article Here;

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/op...EvAbvBF-MbeV6k3c82p32Ncc8TGm_RJdF3S4voACX5jIl

I'm not sure about the science of this article. They criticise the study of NFL players that found CTE symptoms in 110 out of 111 players which I've seen quoted often on here.

One of the criticism's is that there was no control group for that study, although the thought occurs that if CTE is established in patients then you wouldn't need a control group for every other study after it is established, e.g a study looking at heart disease doesn't get a control group every time because heart disease is now a known commodity.

Nevertheless I've been following combat sports for 15 years and in the last few years I've seen a spate of posts about CTE. Some of the latest posts about Alan Crowder retiring are the worst I've seen it. You would think anyone who had ten or so amateur boxing fights is likely to senile by the time they or 40 or 50, not fit to get a job as a cashier.

This doesn't stack up with my anecdotal experience's of watching combat sports, I know anecdotes don't constitute science but CTE isn't yet well understood. To look at this guy, he had 242 boxing fights, 2000 rounds boxed, he lost 11 times during that and was tko'ed four times. He was also in a life threatening plane crash where he broke his back and likely did some damage to his head. Here he is in his seventies he still sounds sharp;



Here's another boxer, lived into his nineties, over a hundred bouts the victim of the St. Valentines day massacre;



Not saying it isn't a major concern and something that has the potential to destroy your whole life but I think it's a bit overrated right now.

 

[aus101]

From what I’ve heard it’s genetically based. Some people are more susceptible.

 

[Jim Cozad Jr.]

It turned Aaron Hernandez into a homicidal homo...

 

[JOE QUEEF]

What?

 

[drstrangelov]

I think the last decade has been more about establishing an understanding of how violent sports can impact the brain. As that becomes better understood, you’ll see more interesting research to follow about what the CTE means in practical terms based upon severity. It’s a nice step up from just calling people punch drunk and leaving it at that. Medical research moves slowly, even without organized interests trying to limit it, so just give it time.

 

[SammyPops]

Article Here;

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/op...EvAbvBF-MbeV6k3c82p32Ncc8TGm_RJdF3S4voACX5jIl

I'm not sure about the science of this article. They criticise the study of NFL players that found CTE symptoms in 110 out of 111 players which I've seen quoted often on here.

One of the criticism's is that there was no control group for that study, although the thought occurs that if CTE is established in patients then you wouldn't need a control group for every other study after it is established, e.g a study looking at heart disease doesn't get a control group every time because heart disease is now a known commodity.

Nevertheless I've been following combat sports for 15 years and in the last few years I've seen a spate of posts about CTE. Some of the latest posts about Alan Crowder retiring are the worst I've seen it. You would think anyone who had ten or so amateur boxing fights is likely to senile by the time they or 40 or 50, not fit to get a job as a cashier.

This doesn't stack up with my anecdotal experience's of watching combat sports, I now anecdotes don't constitute science but CTE isn't yet well understood. To look at this guy, he had 242 boxing fights, 2000 rounds boxed, he lost 11 times during that and was tko'ed four times. He was also in a life threatening plane crash where he broke his back and likely did some damage to his head. Here he is in his seventies he still sounds sharp;



Here's another boxer, lived into his nineties, over a hundred bouts the victim of the St. Valentines day massacre;



Not saying it isn't a major concern and something that has the potential to destroy your whole life but I think it's a bit overrated right now.

That study is sufficiently flawed that if it was, for example, in hip fracturesit would be dismissed and never peer reviewed published.

Methodology problems include patient self selection, no control group, no stratification of subjects by position, length of play etc.

I work in medcial research and was at a conference, and they used this as an example of a flawed protocol that receives popular press.

 

[RetiredSlave]

Its compound concussions that really mess people up imo.

 

[PlayswellwithLawnDarts]

It turned Aaron Hernandez into a homicidal homo...

*Add PCP and Daddy Issues

 

[SandaKicker]

That study is sufficiently flawed that if it was, for example, in hip fracturesit would be dismissed and never peer reviewed published.

Methodology problems include patient self selection, no control group, no stratification of subjects by position, length of play etc.

I work in medcial research and was at a conference, and they used this as an example of a flawed protocol that receives popular press.

Interesting.

I’ve seen the film “Concussion” with Will Smith where they allege that the NFL were suppressing research so that people wouldn’t be turned off football. That strikes me as a credible motive.

What do you think would be the motive for ‘CTE Hysteria’?

I guess media outlets and Hollywood potentially over dramatising some legitimate discoveries to drive views?

 

[SammyPops]

Interesting.

I’ve seen the film “Concussion” with Will Smith where they allege that the NFL were suppressing research so that people wouldn’t be turned off football. That strikes me as a credible motive.

What do you think would be the motive for ‘CTE Hysteria’?

I guess media outlets and Hollywood potentially over dramatising some legitimate discoveries to drive views?

I 100% believe the NFL lied and hid shit, just like tobacco companies. CTE from playing football too makes sense.

My point is the study is just not a good one.

For example, stratifying subjects by position and how long they palyed football would strengthen their results. They could then compare a WR to DE, clarifying what types of hits are more liley to lead to CTE. They should also compare dudes who only played highschool football, to those who played highschool and college, to those who played highschool and college and NFL. Again, it may allow the researchers to Identify when the damage was done.

Also, self selection causes a bias; for example, in this case dudes who suffer from other CTE are more likely to donate tier brains, as opposed to a dude who never had any symptoms. For example, there is a well know post surgical study where subjects were allowed to sign up for extra physiotherapy. Well, they did better, but what was ater proved was that the subjects who were in better shape did the extra therapy b/c they could. So did the subjects do better b/c they got extra therapy or did the healthier subjects do better regardless of the extra therapy.

 

[spin]

not sure about the science, but here's my thoughts from watching tv.


fuck out of here with this absolutely retarded shit.

 

[Philo-Publius]

CTE is for real. Leagues should take precautions to minimize it and retire athletes that exhibit symptoms. The condition only gets worse. It never gets better.

 

[SandaKicker]

not sure about the science, but here's my thoughts from watching tv.


fuck out of here with this absolutely retarded shit.

Actually I have a science degree I just didn't bother to review this particular case. The statements people make about CTE don't need a thorough investigation to rebuke, I'm not sure to what extent.

 

[Organic Damage]

I don't see how you can argue that refute the belief that combat and contact sports cause CTE with anecdotal evidence and claim it is more substantive than an (admittedly flawed) actual study.

Some people may be less susceptible but some people are immune to the HIV virus too. That doesn't mean AIDS is "hysteria".

 

[SandaKicker]

I don't see how you can argue the belief that combat and contact sports cause CTE

I wasn't arguing against the idea that it can cause CTE.

I was arguing against the idea that 99.9% of people who do contact sports will get a particularly damaging form of CTE which is the vibe I get from certain posters in the heavyweights. Also the term "CTE hysteria" came from the article I posted.

I've seen the 110/111 figure quoted multiple times which isn't really something that should be quoted at all.