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Cross-facing in BJJ

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Resident A-hole, Nov 15, 2005.

  1. Resident A-hole

    Resident A-hole Orange Belt

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    I am relatively new to BJJ, but come from a judo background. The crossface was not used much in judo (in my experience), so defending it was new to me. I am noticing guys do a lot of crossfacing in BJJ sparring. I know this is fair game & I use it myself.

    When I crossface, I just put enough pressure across the throat/jaw to make it painful if they try to move or pull me into them, etc. It's not really a choke, just an annoyance. I'm not trying to inflict real pain in a training situation.

    Some guys I train with will put 100% of their weight behind a forearm across the other guy's throat when trying to pass guard. At that point, you are forced to defend it or be choked out. It can be very painful on your throat/adams apple.

    The move definitely works, but is this normal to do it 100% in training, or do you guys feel that is a bit too much? Do you guys use this?
     
  2. b0b

    b0b Banned Banned

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    It is a dick move to do it in training. Same with trachea chokes. It is ok to practice using them, but don't do it 100%
     
  3. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    Wrestlers cross-face a lot to set up things like cradles. I use it a lot for that and to set up chokes. I.E. Get their chin away from their chest. I think it is relatively harmless and I use it and have had it done to me in randori. A Judoka that I train with said that it is illegal in Olympic Judo, so they don't use it nearly as much. I think there are too many rules in that form of Judo!
     
  4. dutchmasterj3

    dutchmasterj3 Blue Belt

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    Obviously a dick move to do. Sometimes though it's the only way to get the choke in. If dudes are doing it at 100% your only choice is to get better and defend it so it don't hurt is the way I look at it. If you could roll with this one instructor of mine who's a purple belt, he smooshes your face while on top of you. He is the oldest and dirtiest jiu jitsu dude around. Point being, you should just work around it. You going to bitch if for some reason someone does that in real life?
     
  5. RobT

    RobT Purple Belt

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    I don't mind how hard they go across my throat. If it's enough to tap me, I'll tap. Otherwise I'll work to get out of it/get the arm off etc.

    Across the face though, I don't think there is any need to go 100% in training. No one is going to tap to it (unless hopelessly outweighed, or totally green).
     
  6. alexgncw

    alexgncw Guest

    i think its pointless to do that full force no one is gonna tap from it so the only reason to do it is to make the person uncomfortable or get them to turn their head to make your escape easier
     
  7. Resident A-hole

    Resident A-hole Orange Belt

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    I was asking out of curiosity as to whether it's commonly used that way in BJJ. I know it will likely happen in a real fight, etc.

    It's easy enough to defend, but opens you up to get your guard passed- which is the intended result of crossfacing.
     
  8. paulchu

    paulchu Guest

    i would say it is a little dirty, but its still a choke (airway), just like an RNC or guillotine (blood). if applied right, and over the carotids, it can also be a blood choke. regardless, it's a dumb move to get tapped out by, keep your chin to your chest
     
  9. Darth Shlong

    Darth Shlong District World Champion

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    it a very asshole move to do, i dont put up with it
    true story= my instructor right before sparring tells me to take it easy on this guy cuz his knee is bad, i say ok. so im taking it easy just working on my guard passes, and this asshole face cranks me , 100% !!!, i thought he was working for a choke, but he let it rip, i felt my back molars move no lie
    i got out of it and said what the fuck, " oh i thought i had your neck" BULLSHIT
    Couple of weeks later we got matched up again, this time hes healed and im pissed so all bets are off. take him down hard, start to pass his guard and the son of a bitch does it again, hes smaller than me and im a pretty strong guy, i grabbed both his lapels pick him up, and slam him as hard as i can driving my forearms into his chest, he started gasping for air, you could tell i knocked the wind out of him. i gave him a look like " you know why ", i dont put up with it , niether should any of you, its a chicken shit move.
     
  10. Bama Zulu

    Bama Zulu Blue Belt

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    I only do it enough to turn their head and keep it turned when I am passing or setting up for an armbar. I agree it is a dick move.
     
  11. pitviper259

    pitviper259 Guest

    ummm i think i have a different understanding of the crossface than all of you?? Coming from a wrestling background for me a crossface is used to defend takedowns and take side control, so i dont really understand how u throw a crossface in someone's guard please explain someone and thanks in advance
     
  12. b0b

    b0b Banned Banned

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    If you are in their guard, you ram your forearm into their throat/face/ and drive in to them.
     
  13. Half Boston Crab

    Half Boston Crab Purple Belt

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    Is it that bad? You shouldn't slam it in of course, like Randleman on Cro Cop, but if you do it as a hold, I don't mind anyone doing it on me. If I want them to let go I'll just tap (not likely though) and otherwise I 'll just work on defending it, or counter with an armbar if he's in my guard.
     
  14. tudor_bjj

    tudor_bjj Purple Belt

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    Top half guard without cross-face is a big waste of energy...
     
  15. IMP

    IMP OBLIVION RECORDER

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    I use it to create space to get out of kesa gatame... but it aint allowed in the ju-jutsu fighting competition here.
     
  16. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    I never use that form of cross-facing. In those cases where my opponent does it, I simply grab the elbow and go for an armbar! I was told that in general from top guard you never want your arms going past your opponent's center line for that reason.
     
  17. Steeltwo

    Steeltwo Green Belt

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    hands to the face is illegal in judo. Which is probly why no one uses it.


    I always hate them, and tend to hurt the person doing them at any given chance. You'd be amazed what a side mount keylock and a knee to the neck and jaw can do to the most people. oh you tapped, let me get up with my knee thats in your jaw first.
     
  18. DeltaSigChi4

    DeltaSigChi4 Banned Banned

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    It's somewhat unclassy, obviously ...

    I was always taught that you never do it to someone who knows alot more than you out of respect.

    The best is when they do the short-elbow strike on the way to the crossface. It's so fucking obvious and pisses me off to no extent.

    E
     
  19. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    Sometimes I accidently elbow people when crossfacing, but it is never on purpose. Maybe wrestling hardened me but I never thought of it as so horrible a move. Of course, I never use it to escape top full guard, but in half guard I do do it a lot. Hell, at practice we will sometimes put on gloves and add light striking, which is more annoying IMHO.
     
  20. nosebleed

    nosebleed White Belt

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    some cross facing, like putting your forearm on their throat when you're in their guard, is bad technique (setting yourself up to be armbarred, etc) and doesn't serve any purpose except annoying your opponent... i tend not to do it to people because rarely does it do any good, and while i don't really enjoy it being done to me, i don't mind someone doing it because as far as i'm concerned, as long as it's not jeopardizing my safety/health (ie cranking a heel hook or most other submissions really hard and fast), all's fair

    cross-facing with your forearm to make room when someone has side control on you or crossfacing with your shoulder to hold them down when you're in top half-guard are pretty standard techniques used in bjj, subwrestling, mma, etc... in those cases, i think they're perfectly acceptable and use them when appropriate
     

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