critique this tabata routine...

[Urban]

just to clarify, i am not suggesting that i can curl my way out of an arm bar BUT curls and strong biceps can and have helped me keep my elbow from hyperextending in an arm bar long enough to escape or at least bring my free arm around to assist.

but ok, even if your assessment of what happened is accurate (and I have my doubts) why would you train curls tabata style? this kind of escape definitely doesn't require endurance, it's a single peak strength effort. So get a thickbar, or some manilla rope or something and curl heavy. Tabatas are not for this at all.

 

[largeli]

but ok, even if your assessment of what happened is accurate (and I have my doubts) why would you train curls tabata style? this kind of escape definitely doesn't require endurance, it's a single peak strength effort. So get a thickbar, or some manilla rope or something and curl heavy. Tabatas are not for this at all.

Well i thought tabatas would be ideal for developing and increasing red muscle fiber strength, and when youre in an arm bar and NOT trying to curl your way out of it but simply trying to keep the angle of your elbow from increasing or hyperextending that is static strength youre useing.

As far as tabatas not being for this at all, i see now that youre right. I had the wrong idea about tabatas. I think ill use tabatas as a cardio conditioning tool and incorporate burpees, or jump rope.

 

[Urban]

I need more grappling experience just so I can definitively say that curls are useless for armbar defense. Cause to me it seems like your best bet would be to roll onto the shoulder of the arm being armbarred and pulling your arm out. I understand (now) that you aren't curling out of armbars (or thinking you can), but still, I think that as soon as you have the reflex to curl to defend against the sub you'd already be better off rolling and pulling.

 

[batman69]

actually pulling straight back is a good way to get your arm fucked up pretty good. thats what tim sylvia was doing when frank mir broke his arm. granted mir weighs in at 250 or over so he's got a lot of mass behind the armbar but it's still a bad plan. there are ways to defend it and i could throw out a few but this is the grappling forum. the bottom line is, curls will not help you defend an armbar that is properly applied.

 

[largeli]

actually pulling straight back is a good way to get your arm fucked up pretty good. the bottom line is, curls will not help you defend an armbar that is properly applied.

wow....ive said this in the last 3 of my posts i think but theres always gotta be someone who just reads the first couple posts and then comments. Not seeing that i clarified the issue later in the thread.

Sure youre right in saying a properly applied armbar cannot be muscled out of. But you might as well say that a properly applied and executed ANYTHING cannot be muscled out of. Thats a no brainer.
But when someone is trying to apply an arm bar and the hips are not on your elbow joint but below on your forearm i.e. Sylvia/Mir then bicep strength can and has for me prevented them from extending the arm enough to scoot the hips into proper position. Maybe the guys i was rolling with sucked, maybe they didnt execute properly, whatever, im not saying i can escape a perfectly executed armbar from Rickson. Perfect or not, i have escaped armbar attempts with help from the biceps.

 

[batman69]

wow....ive said this in the last 3 of my posts i think but theres always gotta be someone who just reads the first couple posts and then comments. Not seeing that i clarified the issue later in the thread.

Sure youre right in saying a properly applied armbar cannot be muscled out of. But you might as well say that a properly applied and executed ANYTHING cannot be muscled out of. Thats a no brainer.
But when someone is trying to apply an arm bar and the hips are not on your elbow joint but below on your forearm i.e. Sylvia/Mir then bicep strength can and has for me prevented them from extending the arm enough to scoot the hips into proper position. Maybe the guys i was rolling with sucked, maybe they didnt execute properly, whatever, im not saying i can escape a perfectly executed armbar from Rickson. Perfect or not, i have escaped armbar attempts with help from the biceps.

don't get a whiny on me because i try to explain that getting bigger biceps isn't a good substitute for learning the proper techniques of grappling. yes i read your later posts, i was responding to urban's last post with my last post, so get the sand out of your vagina. as far as using arm strength to stall out an armbar till you can move into a better postion. there are better exercises to do for that strength. pull ups, bent over rows, rope climbing, shit a rowing machine is even better than band curls. the bottom line is there are still better ways to get out an armbar before it's locked in than trying to use just your arm strength, such as if your on the your back getting the top leg off of your head and walking your hips around.

 

[largeli]

don't get a whiny on me because i try to explain that getting bigger biceps isn't a good substitute for learning the proper techniques of grappling..

lol, dude this is not what you said the first time bro. In this reply you are right in saying bicep strength isnt a good substitute for technique......ok fine, i never said it was, i only said i have used it and it has worked. Whether or not i was useing good technique or caveman technique wasnt my arguement.

In your 1st post you said "Curls WILL NOT help you escape, blah, blah, blah" Just like that.....no if's and's or but's, you just flat out claimed that bicep strength will absolutely NOT help in escapeing an arm bar...."BOTTOM LINE", as you say so often in your posts.

So i wasnt getting whiny on you for saying bicep strength isnt the answer, b/c thats not what you were saying the 1st time......you were being mr. pig head and know it all stubborn and claiming that bicep strength just flat out will not help. Which you are WRONG!!! and you suck

 

[batman69]

lol, dude this is not what you said the first time bro. In this reply you are right in saying bicep strength isnt a good substitute for technique......ok fine, i never said it was, i only said i have used it and it has worked. Whether or not i was useing good technique or caveman technique wasnt my arguement.

In your 1st post you said "Curls WILL NOT help you escape, blah, blah, blah" Just like that.....no if's and's or but's, you just flat out claimed that bicep strength will absolutely NOT help in escapeing an arm bar...."BOTTOM LINE", as you say so often in your posts.

So i wasnt getting whiny on you for saying bicep strength isnt the answer, b/c thats not what you were saying the 1st time......you were being mr. pig head and know it all stubborn and claiming that bicep strength just flat out will not help. Which you are WRONG!!! and you suck

both of my posts come down to very simple ideas that they are:

1. technique over powering out of an armbar, whether it's fully sunk in or not. which means that while it's good to have strong arms it is better to move in the right way to escpae submissions.

2. band curls are for bigger biceps and not for stronger biceps. which leads to three

3. there are far better exercises than band curls for arm strength and bicep strength. off the top of my head pull ups, bent over rows, rope climbs, shit even heavy ass barbell curls would be better.

leave the tabata workouts for things like pushups, squats, rowing, sprinting, handstand pushups, and things like that.

oh and my second post was focused on warning not to pull your arm straight back out of an armbar because it's a great way to get your arm fucked up. you can have really strong arms but if the person has the leverage they are going to damage your arm. i have a feeling you just want to argue, so have at it, i'm done with this thread.

 

[largeli]

both of my posts come down to very simple ideas that they are:

1. technique over powering out of an armbar, whether it's fully sunk in or not. which means that while it's good to have strong arms it is better to move in the right way to escpae submissions.

2. band curls are for bigger biceps and not for stronger biceps. which leads to three

3. there are far better exercises than band curls for arm strength and bicep strength. off the top of my head pull ups, bent over rows, rope climbs, shit even heavy ass barbell curls would be better.

leave the tabata workouts for things like pushups, squats, rowing, sprinting, handstand pushups, and things like that.

oh and my second post was focused on warning not to pull your arm straight back out of an armbar because it's a great way to get your arm fucked up. you can have really strong arms but if the person has the leverage they are going to damage your arm. i have a feeling you just want to argue, so have at it, i'm done with this thread.

youre done with this thread? Dude you shoulda never started with this thread! You contributed nothing. The arguement of bicep strength being irrelevant had already been discussed before you chimed in! You brought nothing new to the topic, and now im trying to think of a way that i can regain the total of 3 minutes off my life that ive wasted reading and replying to you.....any suggestions?

 

[BAS_FAN]

I was once put in an armbar but my biceps were so strong that i curled the guys arms right off his body. Then i used his own severed limbs to beat him into submission. And when i say submission i mean death.