Could Jacare Souza succeed ?


you cant talk to these guys, they are blanketing jacare as being able to own at anything. they dont understand that wrestling is seperate, they assume "oh its a combat sport, jacare would pwn!!!"
 
ive read, thats why im not on here saying wrestlers would beat black belts in bjj comps
for you though...

I never said Jacare would beat even decent level wrestlers. I said that he -could- beat them, earlier I said he probably wouldn't.

Could win = probability of victory exists, regardless of how low.
 
Jacare has great takedowns and wrestling in the context of MMA and BJJ, there is no doubt about that, although that is stating the obvious and I dont think anyone would debate that. I really liked how he set up all the knee taps he hit on Drysdale at ADCC, setting them up with uchi matas and the like and his higlight reel takedowns are a thing of beauty.

That being said, how often do you really see that kind of a dynamic finish at the top levels of wrestling? Do you guys really think he could turn over a guy after they belly out and start crawling out of bounds, or battle a high level wrestler who is tying him up, much less set up a takedown from there? Had Jacare grown up in America and dedicated himself to wrestling, I think there is a very good chance he would have been great at it. But as he stands now, looking at it realistically, his wrestling succeeds because it is adapted to what he is doing, not because it is the best pure wrestling in the world. I think sometimes in these discussions, people forget about the bigger picture... Like in MMA when evaluating a fighter's jiu jitsu, many people just look at how many submissions they earned, and not their ability to defend from damage, pass the guard, stabilize positions and pin, etc (and those are fundamentally more important than just the finish). Wrestling is more than takedowns

Someone who knows whats up along with RYO or whatever
 
I never said Jacare would beat even decent level wrestlers. I said that he -could- beat them, earlier I said he probably wouldn't.

Could win = probability of victory exists, regardless of how low.

well yes he could hes an athlete, but people are saying he has a huge chance/easily could
 
Jacare would OWN any HS wrestler, and hold his own with a college wrestler

No he wouldn't. Lets move back a couple years when Askren came out could he have beat him,no. Someone go and say look at the garcia video. They were grappling not wrestling. Askren would beat garcia wrestling too.
 
I never said Jacare would beat even decent level wrestlers. I said that he -could- beat them, earlier I said he probably wouldn't.

Could win = probability of victory exists, regardless of how low.

Well if that is your logic I COULD win too. I mean I may not be as gifted as Jacare but I am sure I have had more straight wrestling experience. Therefore I have as good a chance as Jacare.
 
Well if that is your logic I COULD win too. I mean I may not be as gifted as Jacare but I am sure I have had more straight wrestling experience. Therefore I have as good a chance as Jacare.

he'd have ZERO chance. zero.

I agree with these ^

People on here would like to believe athleticism + BJJ allows you to beat high level wrestlers at their own sport.....not true.
 
actually Jacare ragdolled Matt Lindland a silver medalist in greco.

Are you referring to their grappling match? I'm assuming thats what your talking about. If I remember correctly Jacare baited Lindland with a flying triangle and then shot for the TD. Ofcourse it caught Lindland off guard.

That would never happen in a wrestling match.
 
I agree, but he has the specific qualities that make for good Judo athletes. If he had spent his career focusing on Judo, I think you'd agree he could have been very successful.

yea, I agree that he does have alot of those qualities. But I believe the question was how he would do now against Judoka or wrestler's in their own sports, not if he trained for Judo his entire life.

Jacare is way behind the curve in terms of competing with Judoka who are just as athletic as him or more, and have many more years of Judo under their belts.
 
I'm resurrecting this thread because the question really fascinates me. I rolled with some D-1 (read: not champs, but D-1) wrestlers, and I think the interplay of wrestling and jiu jitsu is so awesome.

I see them both as grappling, so it's hard for me to believe Jacare wouldn't dominate all but 10% of the collegiate level...but I also defer to those that know a lot more about wrestling than me.

Interesting thread.
 
I'm resurrecting this thread because the question really fascinates me. I rolled with some D-1 (read: not champs, but D-1) wrestlers, and I think the interplay of wrestling and jiu jitsu is so awesome.

I see them both as grappling, so it's hard for me to believe Jacare wouldn't dominate all but 10% of the collegiate level...but I also defer to those that know a lot more about wrestling than me.

Interesting thread.

You rolled with them, but have you wrestled them?
 
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